WHOCHURCH: The Chris Chibnall era

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have at it, folx

the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Thursday, 9 November 2017 16:42 (eight months ago) Permalink

So are we looking forward to this? I'm liking the new-broom approach to the casting/costume, and much as I enjoyed the last series (a lot), the fact that it ended with two incarnations of the Master in a Cybermen origins story that culminated in a surprise appearance from the Hartnell Doctor indicates a freshen up might be in order.

But jesus, Chibnall's previous Doctor Who sits on a spectrum of bland to poor - some of the most unmemorable episodes in recent memory. Or am I being pessimistic?

(cheeky plug: we review Chibnall's Silurian two-parter on the most recent edition of my Doctor Who podcast - http://www.illexplainlater.com/post/166422653503/episode-27-land-of-make-believe - where we discussed some of this stuff...)

bamboohouses, Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:02 (eight months ago) Permalink

v much looking forward to seeing how jodie whittaker plays it, v much apprehensive about everything else

drinkmaster sealcup at yr service (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:04 (eight months ago) Permalink

The whole show has been feeling very tired and in need of a new injection of ideas for quite some time now. On the other hand I've never seen Broadchurch and most of the episodes Chibnall had written have felt like mid-series filler so I dunno if he's the guy to provide them.

Matt DC, Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:10 (eight months ago) Permalink

The incredibly shoddy photoshopped TARDIS behind Whitaker's Mork cosplay in the promo photo sets the tone for exactly the level of quality I expect from ol' Chinballs.

shackling the masses with plastic-wrapped snack picks (sic), Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:17 (eight months ago) Permalink

Boring writer doesn't neccessariy mean boring showrunner, I'm hoping.

chap, Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:20 (eight months ago) Permalink

I am excited the same way I am excited for any new actor who takes on the role of the Doctor. I'm also looking forward to the Doctor-companion interaction and which parts will change and which parts will stay the same. I also enjoyed most of Chibnall's Who stories and think his worst work appeared in the first season of Torchwood.

the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:22 (eight months ago) Permalink

I did read somewhere that he was planning to have more season-long storylines, which is the opposite direction things should be going in imo. A series of only very loosely connected, straighforward one and two parters each written by a different good writer would do the job fine.

chap, Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:26 (eight months ago) Permalink

I get that on the one hand, but on the other hand the current Golden Age of Television is really strong on bingeable serialized stories that last the whole season, plus his biggest critical praise came from doing that with Broadchurch.

the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:29 (eight months ago) Permalink

I think the problem with recent Doctor Who arcs is that they're neither fish nor fowl - an awkward mix of 'arc episodes' and deliberately less important standalones that fails to really build to any sort of dramatic crescendo or are rushed at the final stages. I'd be fine with either 10 completely discrete episodes or a single 10-part story (an updated spin on The Daleks' Masterplan would suit me very nicely).

bamboohouses, Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:36 (eight months ago) Permalink

I think RTD's first season was the only to really pull off its "arc" - unless you count the Riversong episodes as a single story (and why not - at least "Wedding..." finally gave it a satisfying ending).

Chuck_Tatum, Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:49 (eight months ago) Permalink

S1 barely had an arc, just some flash frames of graffiti shot later on and inserted into episodes months after they'd been written

S5 had a fantastic, coherent, satisfyingly complicated plot arc (only undermined by Rory's prop badge), and the first two Capaldi years together pulled off successful parallel character arcs

shackling the masses with plastic-wrapped snack picks (sic), Thursday, 9 November 2017 17:57 (eight months ago) Permalink

TBH I'd be happy to settle for the show being fun again and it hasn't felt like that for ages.

Matt DC, Thursday, 9 November 2017 18:01 (eight months ago) Permalink

^ x1000000
i may try again now

Chocolate-covered gummy bears? Not ruling those lil' guys out. (ulysses), Thursday, 9 November 2017 19:35 (eight months ago) Permalink

Maybe I read too many Virgin/BBC novels but I can't point at a single season of the reboot that I would say is anti-fun, including Tennant's first season (which is the only one I haven't seen every episode of despite owning multiple copies of it)

the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Thursday, 9 November 2017 19:38 (eight months ago) Permalink

lost me with matt smith, tried again with capaldi and still found it a slog

Chocolate-covered gummy bears? Not ruling those lil' guys out. (ulysses), Thursday, 9 November 2017 20:01 (eight months ago) Permalink

Can we count the 2008-2010 specials?

xp ulysses you crazy, Matt Smith's first season was the best yet.

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 9 November 2017 20:05 (eight months ago) Permalink

i agree, first matt smith season is one of the most classic

I demand much less from Who then all of you. I'm happy if it's marginally entertaining which it consistently is. I don't care for her suspenders, but I like her coat, and I think she'll be an interesting doctor. I'm more concerned with three full time companions; that pushes this too far into an ensemble which makes me wonder if they will let her carry the show or not.

akm, Thursday, 9 November 2017 20:09 (eight months ago) Permalink

the ONE thing I did grow tired of under Moffatt was the manic pace of every episode though. LIke, 1000 things would happen in some of those smith episodes and they just got impossible to follow. Broadchurch, like it or hate it, has a much more staid pace that I hope he brings to the show.

akm, Thursday, 9 November 2017 20:24 (eight months ago) Permalink

I look at it as back to basics with the caveat that the show has often struggled to juggle story arcs for the Doctor and three full-time companions (the most notorious example I can remember being "Kinda", where Nyssa spends the entire story napping in the TARDIS and pops up at the end asking "hey, did I miss anything?")

the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Thursday, 9 November 2017 20:27 (eight months ago) Permalink

If they do it with Bradley Walsh every week I'm all in.

nashwan, Thursday, 9 November 2017 20:45 (eight months ago) Permalink

Hot take: Bradley Walsh will be good in this.

But doctor, I am Camille Paglia (Bananaman Begins), Thursday, 9 November 2017 20:57 (eight months ago) Permalink

Whooch.

Entree 3000 (Leee), Thursday, 9 November 2017 21:05 (eight months ago) Permalink

I 100% know Bradley from The Chase (not the Doctor Who story) - what is he like when not being really annoyingly anti-intellectual all the time?

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 9 November 2017 21:17 (eight months ago) Permalink

in cases like this (like with james corden, when he appeared on Who) I'm glad I'm not english and don't have the full context of how annoying this person is supposed to be (I liked corden's turn on who a lot. now that he's inflicted on the US with his own show, I see why people are tired of him though)

akm, Thursday, 9 November 2017 21:19 (eight months ago) Permalink

CHURCHWOOD

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Thursday, 9 November 2017 21:24 (eight months ago) Permalink

"an updated spin on The Daleks' Masterplan"

The Master's Dalek Plan

Chunky Backgammon (onimo), Friday, 10 November 2017 00:19 (eight months ago) Permalink

^irl giggle

shackling the masses with plastic-wrapped snack picks (sic), Friday, 10 November 2017 08:31 (eight months ago) Permalink

CHURCHWOOD

it was early in the day and i have... no idea what i meant by this

re chibnall: i'm excited that it's essentially a minor ~reboot~ (god knows this show needs it) but chibnall's writing has never done anything for me. cyberwoman was one of the worst things that has ever happened, although to be fair it was a really long time ago.

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Friday, 10 November 2017 08:58 (eight months ago) Permalink

Bradley Walsh is a decent actor. He'll be fine.

ailsa, Friday, 10 November 2017 10:41 (eight months ago) Permalink

I worry that being Bradley Walsh gameshow host who's never off the telly might overshadow his acting ability.

Chunky Backgammon (onimo), Friday, 10 November 2017 14:01 (eight months ago) Permalink

re chibnall: i'm excited that it's essentially a minor ~reboot~ (god knows this show needs it) but chibnall's writing has never done anything for me. cyberwoman was one of the worst things that has ever happened, although to be fair it was a really long time ago.

"Cyberwoman" was terrible but "Exit Wounds", "Countrycide" and, to a lesser degree, "Fragments" were great. I also think his weakest Who story is "Dinosaurs on a Spaceship" which I still enjoyed a lot because of how silly it was.

the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Friday, 10 November 2017 16:28 (eight months ago) Permalink

He was chirpy never-off-the-telly gameshow host while he was doing Law & Order UK and it didn't seem to have much of an impact on him then.

xpost

ailsa, Friday, 10 November 2017 17:55 (eight months ago) Permalink

dan otm, chibnall's writing didn't stay at "cyberwoman" level thank god. also yeah, it feels wrong bagging "dinosaurs" because it was only ever meant to be the thing that it was. moffat/the bbc clearly wanted silly escapist quasi-blockbusters and that's what the writers delivered.

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Friday, 10 November 2017 20:32 (eight months ago) Permalink

How much Gatiss are we expecting this time round?

Never changed username before (cardamon), Friday, 10 November 2017 23:14 (eight months ago) Permalink

i have seen a lot of lols about the new Doctor’s outfit on FB & elsewhere & it is making me annoyed

her look is on point & awesome
the short trousers with tall boots is such a great look esp with her height & propotions etc, and stripes are great & suspenders are cool wtf is wrong with ppl arg

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Saturday, 11 November 2017 00:47 (eight months ago) Permalink

don’t you get it veg she’s feeeeeeemale

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Saturday, 11 November 2017 01:17 (eight months ago) Permalink

grrr

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Saturday, 11 November 2017 04:30 (eight months ago) Permalink

suspenders are a 'little' costumey and it felt a bit like we were past costumey with capaldi, but I like her coat alot and I'm not sure what people have against culottes, I think they are cute on women.

akm, Saturday, 11 November 2017 04:41 (eight months ago) Permalink

suspenders are great on those who are shaped to accomodate them and horrific for everyone else, any suspender backlash is just indicative of the 90% of the population who can't wear them or who tried and failed
if you can pull them off (and Jodi Whittaker definitely can) I say put the pedal to the metal and go for it

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Saturday, 11 November 2017 04:47 (eight months ago) Permalink

otfm

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Saturday, 11 November 2017 05:16 (eight months ago) Permalink

(to whittaker pulling off the look)

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Saturday, 11 November 2017 05:16 (eight months ago) Permalink

Otfm

Entree 3000 (Leee), Saturday, 11 November 2017 07:39 (eight months ago) Permalink

(to me wearing suspenders)

Entree 3000 (Leee), Saturday, 11 November 2017 07:40 (eight months ago) Permalink

The coast is very Took Baker but with some Davison styling, especially around the lapels. The striped shirt also goes with the retro give.

Entree 3000 (Leee), Saturday, 11 November 2017 07:41 (eight months ago) Permalink

*coat

Entree 3000 (Leee), Saturday, 11 November 2017 07:42 (eight months ago) Permalink

*Tom Baker

Entree 3000 (Leee), Saturday, 11 November 2017 07:42 (eight months ago) Permalink

*retro vibe

Entree 3000 (Leee), Saturday, 11 November 2017 07:43 (eight months ago) Permalink

lol

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Saturday, 11 November 2017 07:45 (eight months ago) Permalink

“Took Baker Coast”, the new contribution from Mark Gatiss

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Saturday, 11 November 2017 08:08 (eight months ago) Permalink

"But Broadchurch was real fucken bad so I'm less excited than usual."

the first and third series are great. I agree the second one was fucken bad.

akm, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 14:32 (two days ago) Permalink

All I saw was the first. It may have been fine for the most part but the incredibly stupid, completely out of left field 'let's say........Moe' reveal at the end blanketed everything that came before with a shower of bullshit.

Gregory Horsemelt (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 14:37 (two days ago) Permalink

well then I don't recommend watching series 2. or maybe I do! because it's garbage.

3 was pretty good though

akm, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 15:14 (two days ago) Permalink

the only way to be a True Fan is to be an uncritical fan

yeah that sounds exactly like something I would say

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 15:23 (two days ago) Permalink

the mystery was irrelevant, it's all about the music and long shots of the seaside town and knitted brows

com rad erry red flag (f. hazel), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 15:35 (two days ago) Permalink

yeah I mean the mystery is terrible. it's all about that and also all about "how many more ways can Miller and Hardy screw this up?"

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 15:54 (two days ago) Permalink

and the weather balloons

Arch Bacon (rushomancy), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 15:57 (two days ago) Permalink

the only way to be a True Fan is to be an uncritical fan

Tombot notwithstanding, I doubt you'd find anyone here who would approach any show this way.

Abercromb Metrion Finchos (Leee), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 17:34 (two days ago) Permalink

I just don’t understand bemoaning seasons of a show that haven’t even aired yet. I guess sic’s reasoning makes some sense in that he’s hated all of chibnall’s writing on the show to date.

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 17:47 (two days ago) Permalink

i have a certain amount of trepidation about the guy who wrote the best episodes of the show i like being replaced by the guy who wrote the worst episodes of the show i like

i'm not prejudging, but i'm hedging my bets a little

Arch Bacon (rushomancy), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 17:52 (two days ago) Permalink

Agreed. Or, I wouldn't say Chibnall's episodes aren't the worst of the series, if you compare them the to actively gringe-worthy stuff, like the alien TV announcer in the 1950s, or the Moon giving birth, or the magical tree fairies saving Earth from solar flares, they're just perfectly mediocre. Watchable, but there's no new ideas, nothing other DW writers hadn't episodes hadn't done better. So what I'm fearing his showrunner arcs will be like that too.

Tuomas, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 18:37 (two days ago) Permalink

the guy who hired a woman to play the Doctor is definitely unlikely to bring any new ideas to the table, it's a fact

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 18:40 (two days ago) Permalink

I guess sic’s reasoning makes some sense in that he’s hated all of chibnall’s writing on the show to date

iirc nobody else in this thread or any other Who thread has given any other reason for taking a cautious attitude? I'm going to watch and be delighted if it's good, which seems a better way to enjoy than to go in expecting it's going to be great

Anyway, it's definitely wild to have spent the last seven years being shouted at by 70% of Doctor Who thread posters for enjoying Doctor Who, or for plainly explaining things that happened onscreen that people weren't looking at (without indicating my own enjoyment or disappointment), and now be charged with being part of a nebulous pack of anti-fun Dr Who grouches

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 18:43 (two days ago) Permalink

the guy who hired a woman to play the Doctor is definitely unlikely to bring any new ideas to the table, it's a fact

― El Tomboto

i was just reading some old doctor who news clippings and jnt was talking about casting a woman as the doctor in 1981

i don't think he was seriously considering it, but in that light it's hard to call casting a woman to play the doctor a "new idea"

Arch Bacon (rushomancy), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 18:44 (two days ago) Permalink

Actually doing so rather than hinting it to goose ratings is anew idea.

Andrew Farrell, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 18:52 (two days ago) Permalink

xpost: the brand new idea that the producer of Doctor Who repeatedly teased in the press from 1981 to 1987, and that the original creator of Doctor Who formally advised the BBC to do in 1985 when the show was moribund, and that was done by four fully-produced shot-on-film American fan films from 1984 to 1988, and was done on BBC television by Steven Moffat in 1997, and has been repeatedly set up in dialogue from 2010 to 2014, then shown as possible onscreen in 2014 and 2015 (and had been implicitly established as possible and not unusual onscreen on 23/10/1976)

All credit to Chibnall for doing it and I expect her to be a delight! but it's really not an example of him bringing a new idea his first new idea to Doctor Who ever

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 18:59 (two days ago) Permalink

i don't think he was seriously considering it

it was Tom who actually said to a press conference that he thought it could be time for a woman, JNT ran with it for years but obviously never considered it

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DFJaHbYWAAAw1Rt.jpg

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 19:03 (two days ago) Permalink

"I've spoken to various people, some them ladies"

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 19:08 (two days ago) Permalink

I don't recall ever yelling at you for enjoying Dr Who but there's probably some episode I hated that you liked along the way somewhere.

I'm excited for new Who, you guys are all "well we'll see I guess grumble grumble" because of vague Chibnall beefs - I just don't see why the orthodoxy of grumble needs to reign supreme. Me, DJP and f. hazel OTM, the rest of y'all can carry on I suppose.

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 19:12 (two days ago) Permalink

I don't think it's a radical or unreasonable position to take a cautious approach if you don't like the incoming showrunner's previous work! And that this position can be independent of the new Doctor herself.

That said, "Dinosaurs on a Spaceship" and "The Power of Three" are fantastic! The rest of his Who eps are forgettable though.

Abercromb Metrion Finchos (Leee), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 19:20 (two days ago) Permalink

most who eps are forgettable except that one with the completely horrifying creatures

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 19:33 (two days ago) Permalink

damn, ratings absolutely tanked last season! chibnall hasn't written a who episode since 2012? that's more time than bob holmes took off between "kroll" and "androzani". strange.

Arch Bacon (rushomancy), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 19:34 (two days ago) Permalink

I guess I just don't watch television for the ideas

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 19:34 (two days ago) Permalink

wild to have spent the last seven years being

I mean

in this time period I have also

- read 36 NAs and 13 MAs and one QR
- bought nine volumes of TARDIS Eruditorum
- repeatedly paid up to $30 just in postage to get issues of Nothing At The End Of The Lane and Vworp Vworp sent to Australia
- bought issues and specials of DWM in three countries
- bought 11 volumes of the Panini strip collections, plus a bootleg of the first McGann one when it was out of print for a few years
- (also sold off my old copies of the Marvel colourised reprints)
- selected and programmed classic series repeats for the country's largest broadcaster
- paid to see Dr Who in the cinema on ten different occasions, in five cities, on two different continents and one island
- been the only telly person who got in free from BBCWW to the one-off cinema screening of the fancied-up Day Of The Daleks who stayed to watch the whole thing
- stood behind Waris Hussein and his boyfriend to watch an am-dram staging of An Unearthly Child in the basement of a Manchester pub
- repeatedly eaten lunch on other people's office floors to watch episodes before TX
- listened to over a hundred hours of Verity!, a podcast about women enjoying Dr Who whether it's good or not
- bought and read the autobiography of Barry Letts
- bought and read the biography of Robert Holmes
- bought and read and loved the biography of JNT
- bought and read both Cartmel's production memoir and his out-of-print, bad, history-of-Who book
- bought the first three print collections of Wife In Space, and read the blog entries for nearly every serial I've watched and several that I haven't
- talked to Paul Cornell, eating dirty chicken in the street outside a dance party he couldn't be bothered to queue for after the first screening of Day Of The Doctor, about Day Of The Doctor
- listened to hundreds of hours of Big Finish and Nest Cottage audios (most of them not good; some of the good ones 2 or three times)
- rented or borrowed DVDs for 55 of the 139 intact classic stories
-- watched nearly all of these in groups I've organised or with one friend
-- frequently rewatched by myself with commentaries and/or production notes on
-- generally watched whatever else of the documentaries and revisiteds and behind-the-sceneses I could get to before returning the discs
-- streamed half a dozen of the other 84 stories
-- watched a handful of orphan episodes
--- including the first ever, unannounced, public screening of Air Lock after it was recovered
-- watched three or four recons
-- read the Targets for 3 of the missing stories and two of the existing ones
- listened to the Lalla Ward / John Leeson audiobook of Gareth Roberts' novelisation of Shada
- watched an hour of I4n fucking L3vine's animation of Shada

this morning in bed I read the second issue of Ben Aaronovitch and Cartmel's Seventh Doctor Titan miniseries, and I have typed all my posts today in front of the Twitch stream of Trial Of A Time Lord*

last night my Seattle housemate got back from staying on the London floor of someone I met in Leeds five years ago by walking up to them and asking if they posted in the comments section of a Doctor Who blog



but sure, I'm bad at finding enjoyment in Dr Who ...because I think some of it is better than other bits?

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 20:41 (two days ago) Permalink

I haven't done any of those things, but just wanted to say that so far Chibnall has done a brilliant job in upsetting Ian Levine, and that will do for me.

mfktz (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 20:44 (two days ago) Permalink

* within the first few minutes, The Doctor is shouting at ppl that he can't even be brought to trial for malfeasance or unbecoming behaviour, bcz he's the President. hope Tombot was watching too.

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 20:45 (two days ago) Permalink

truly, the most difficult man alive to upset

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 20:46 (two days ago) Permalink

oh but this time he's really upset

mfktz (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 20:49 (two days ago) Permalink

somebody on this thread seems pretty upset

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 20:54 (two days ago) Permalink

<3 sic. But the real revelation here is

read the blog entries for nearly every serial I've watched and several that I haven't

JimD, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 21:05 (two days ago) Permalink

Am still proud of the time I alerted sic to a Moffat Q&A series that he'd **never heard of**

Chuck_Tatum, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 21:15 (two days ago) Permalink

Jim - missing episodes!

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 21:44 (two days ago) Permalink

i once ate a sandwich that looked kind of like a varga plant, that's my fan cred sorted

Arch Bacon (rushomancy), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 21:53 (two days ago) Permalink

* within the first few minutes, The Doctor is shouting at ppl that he can't even be brought to trial for malfeasance or unbecoming behaviour, bcz he's the President. hope Tombot was watching too.

― kelp, clam and carrion (sic)

sadly we're at a point where time lord government is better-run than american government, they were at least able to remove their president for gross dereliction of duty

Arch Bacon (rushomancy), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 21:56 (two days ago) Permalink

I am to Marvel what sic is to Who except that sic seems to trump me on most Marvel knowledge despite not even liking Marvel much. Don't know how u do it, man.

Pizza's the food that's sure to please! (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 21:57 (two days ago) Permalink

Twitch is up to Trial episode ten, and if I'd ever know that space robots play holographic Galaga in this, I'd forgotten. I withdraw everything 0.07% of every bad thing I've said about Pip & Jane

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 22:28 (two days ago) Permalink

wait I just noticed Colin's tie and waistcoat combo, reinstate that percentage even though it wasn't their fault

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 22:29 (two days ago) Permalink

Have I missed "a megabyte modem!"?

JimD, Wednesday, 18 July 2018 22:45 (two days ago) Permalink

I think that's in ep 14, when P&J come back to write the conclusion to a 14-part story without knowing what happened in the first eight or in parts of the four that they'd already written

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Wednesday, 18 July 2018 22:55 (two days ago) Permalink

I was 8 when Trial was on. Peri’s death is FUCKED UP. That and Paradise Towers are as scared as I can remember DW making me feel.

Chuck_Tatum, Thursday, 19 July 2018 02:13 (yesterday) Permalink

there's something slightly malevolent feeling about that entire era.

akm, Thursday, 19 July 2018 19:14 (yesterday) Permalink

two different eras there

Paradise Towers starts on Twitch in 10 minutes!

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Thursday, 19 July 2018 19:38 (yesterday) Permalink

Enjoy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEc-OQ_oqDk

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 19 July 2018 19:53 (yesterday) Permalink

I didn't look at Twitch at all until Colin started, and I've now rewatched 7 (or 4) of the eleven worst Dr Who stories ever, in a row, for the first time. It's so hilarious that JN-T only commissioned four scripts ever, and three of them were by the Bakers, all BACK TO BACK.

But in the same way shitty Who is great fun to watch with friends and beer, you can totally see how the chat element of the Twitch run papers over any ups and downs, the #youths watching just taking it all on in the spirit of fun, creating their own injokes and interests.

Case in point: Keff McCulloch's score for Time And The Rani, at 31 years' distance, is not (well, not only) being greeted with horror for its cheap terribleness, but being joyously celebrated as v░a░p░o░u░r░w░a░v░e

the kids are alright

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Thursday, 19 July 2018 19:58 (yesterday) Permalink

looks fine, if typically uninformative.

akm, Thursday, 19 July 2018 19:58 (yesterday) Permalink

xpost can a mod please zap that trailer ffs

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Thursday, 19 July 2018 19:59 (yesterday) Permalink

There’s definitely something bleak and nasty about the horror episodes of that period, in a way that’s very different to the darkest stories of the Tom Baker era. The shoddiness just makes everything more horrible by default, like the show’s being mounted on the cheap in the middle of an apocalypse. Maybe Androzani through Happiness Patrol?

Chuck_Tatum, Thursday, 19 July 2018 20:03 (yesterday) Permalink

the bleakness of Saward is a different tone to the bleaker stories of Cartmel -- Saward's rings of aspiration toward cultural masculinity, but as he doesn't believe in it himself, the stories end up riddled with nihilism. Cartmel is out to actively interrogate cultural attitudes and assumptions, so the bleak stories there tend to be "structured society and authority are bad and tend toward fascism... let's overthrow the paradigm and build a new, inclusive world."

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Thursday, 19 July 2018 20:20 (yesterday) Permalink

like: Revelation and Paradise Towers are both deeply influenced by 200AD, especially Wagner/Grant and Mills. But the conclusion of Revelation is "LOL EVERYTHING'S SHIT AND LOVE IS A LIE," whereas Towers' is "the oppressors should be overthrown and young women should be in charge of everything. also, spraypaint things pink."

kelp, clam and carrion (sic), Thursday, 19 July 2018 20:25 (yesterday) Permalink


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