i am learning welsh obviously (plus brushing up french)
the welsh is going badly -- french is telling me i am 24% fluent, which is a fib imo
― mark s, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:23 (one year ago) Permalink
should I install this and see how bad my German has become, y/n
― the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:28 (one year ago) Permalink
(I'm already downloading it)
― the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:29 (one year ago) Permalink
Duolingo is a great way to absorb language basics and grammar rules, but once you have that stuff down and are in the mode of adding vocabulary I found it kind of inefficient.
― reggae mike love (polyphonic), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:29 (one year ago) Permalink
xp You will learn many duck-related German sentences ime
― JoeStork, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:32 (one year ago) Permalink
i have been surprised how much french i still know in terms of vocab: my grammar was and is terrible
― mark s, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:33 (one year ago) Permalink
polyphonic otm, I finished the French tree and have never gone back, currently use Memrise (and used Lingvist until I ran out of words) to build vocab
― rob, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:35 (one year ago) Permalink
in welsh i have discovered nothing about ducks but i have encountered a DRAGON (draig)
― mark s, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:38 (one year ago) Permalink
I completed the Japanese Duolingo and it is good for absorbing things by wrote but I grew frustrated with never having any of the grammar explained to me. It’s provided a good base.
There’s some more discussion of Duolingo
Do You Speak A Second Language? 日本語は話せます 🇯🇵
― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:39 (one year ago) Permalink
pimsleur >> duolingo
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:39 (one year ago) Permalink
well but Duolingo is free
― rob, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:44 (one year ago) Permalink
honestly DL is more like a fun app that helps you read stuff in a foreign language
― rob, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:45 (one year ago) Permalink
huh 46% fluent
not bad I guess
― the Hannah Montana of the Korean War (DJP), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:45 (one year ago) Permalink
Was going to say, however tell me more about why pimsleur is good? Everything else I have been trying has been lower cost but really falls down on getting me to speak. I’d pay for some live interaction.
― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 19:51 (one year ago) Permalink
I used to be fluent in Portuguese but haven't used in 20 years - wonder if this could get me back on my bullshit.
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 7 November 2017 20:27 (one year ago) Permalink
Duolingo fluency shield suffers from grade inflation especially when you are progressing through, say, the first third of the course or have just taken the placement test. At some points if starts to drop off and decay and you may regret giving into your ex-clever schoolboy’s craving for this particular form of external gratification.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 21:49 (one year ago) Permalink
Think last word should have been "validation."
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 7 November 2017 22:00 (one year ago) Permalink
whenever i type "nos lau" (thursday night) it tells me i have a typo and that the correct spelling is "nos lau"
― mark s, Wednesday, 8 November 2017 09:20 (one year ago) Permalink
Did you type a lower case “el” (wrong) or a capital “eye” (correct)?
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 09:42 (one year ago) Permalink
oh right that makes sense yes
― mark s, Wednesday, 8 November 2017 09:43 (one year ago) Permalink
That was really it? Some of the answers in some of the courses are messed up so that it will tell you about an alternate answer or typo which seems to be dependent on some punctuation, or even some other “invisible punctuation.” There seem to even be cases where it is supposed to accept some letters from say, a standard English alphabet, without certain diacritical and just tell you to “mind the accents” but it gets into some looking glass world where it doesn’t accept the correct foreign alphabet letter. Feel like I️ saw this happen in Turkish, with the non-dotted i, the ı.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 09:56 (one year ago) Permalink
i haven't gone back in and checked but yes, it's quite likely tha:, since i realised when i read yr post that i was listening to DL's pronunciation of Iau and thinking "wow the initial i sound in front of those vowels is really like an L isn't it?" -- based on assuming my grasp of welsh pronunciation is actually worse than it is
(the pronunciation i learnt as a kid IS different to the version they're using: spoken welsh has surprisingly strong regional variation: https://www.duolingo.com/comment/13474058/Dialects-much-more-than-a-simple-north-south-divide)
(but it's not really the consonants that vary)
― mark s, Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:04 (one year ago) Permalink
Ah, some weird keyboard autocorrect is now putting something strange when I type the letter capital “eye” I.Speaking of which, at some point iOS seems to have added a Welsh keyboard, which may um, assist you in your answers.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:04 (one year ago) Permalink
"wow the initial i sound in front of those vowels is really like an L isn't it?"
or maybe the other way round, anyway i was struck by how different their pronunciation was than mine would be -- which is because i was misreading the letter
― mark s, Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:06 (one year ago) Permalink
Sometimes wonder if the Welsh as taught is just some sort of approximation standard that is in fact spoken by no one at all, like Bokmål/Nynorsk, I️ think.How is your pronunciation of the letter double el?
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:12 (one year ago) Permalink
Ach, still the weird “ego problem” or “ego trip” with the capital eye. Think I️ need to delete my autocorrect dictionary.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:13 (one year ago) Permalink
Tom, delete ILX all my bookmarks my autocorrect dictionary now!
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:15 (one year ago) Permalink
Ah, that didn’t seem to work. I’m stymied.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:16 (one year ago) Permalink
my double ll pronunciation is p good i think! the nearest large town to where we went on family holidays when i was a kid is machynlleth and i know how ppl who live in it say it
this was before welsh was actually taught in schools -- indeed, it was actively discouraged in schools back then, and i know someone who was made to leave school at 16 because he preferred to speak welsh (as did his entire family, of hill farmers)
(he became a mechanic and a builder, and is now very comfortably off and owns half the town)
― mark s, Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:18 (one year ago) Permalink
Ah. I have never been in the presence of a Welsh speaker as far as I know, apart from John Cale at an instore.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:25 (one year ago) Permalink
I against I against I
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:27 (one year ago) Permalink
(Had to chose the *RONG* spelling for each of those eyes to get the correct one)Seems to me the pronunciation of Welsh, especially the “ll,” involves a lot more spittle than, say, English.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:30 (one year ago) Permalink
At one point I was having some problems with the days of the week with when to put the word for day in there, such as “dydd Iau.” Seem to have sorted it, can’t remember what the problem really was.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:39 (one year ago) Permalink
The other thing to remember of course about the “i” is that the word for Thursday starts with j for Jupiter-or Jove! do u see?! in most Romance languages.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:47 (one year ago) Permalink
https://www.duolingo.com/comment/14295031/Dydd-Mercher-a-Dydd-Iau
yes i haven't worked out when not to use Dydd yet!
(tho i also haven't yet been marked wrong on either, and have been assuming -- perhaps wrongly -- that they are effectively interchangeable, at least in this limited context)
ooh handy steer on the root of the day names, i'd spotted they were "a bit like French" but hadn't taken it any further
― mark s, Wednesday, 8 November 2017 10:50 (one year ago) Permalink
To throw a spanner in your welsh works - Memrise has a course in Belter Cant.
― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Wednesday, 8 November 2017 11:01 (one year ago) Permalink
Sut mae, Marc? Sut dych chi?
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 9 November 2017 01:13 (one year ago) Permalink
Dych chi eisiau coffi?
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 9 November 2017 01:17 (one year ago) Permalink
Learning Dutch thru this atm and I like it.
― Acid Hose (Capitaine Jay Vee), Thursday, 9 November 2017 01:17 (one year ago) Permalink
Hartelijk gefeliciteerd!
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 9 November 2017 01:25 (one year ago) Permalink
Both the Dutch and Welsh courses have been spruced up in the past few months, so you guys are on the cutting edge.
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 9 November 2017 01:27 (one year ago) Permalink
/too much time on Duolingo
― Bazooka Jobim (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 9 November 2017 02:50 (one year ago) Permalink
"The grapheme k was also used more commonly than in the modern alphabet, particularly before front vowels.[3] The disuse of this letter is at least partly due to the publication of William Morgan's Welsh Bible, whose English printers, with type letter frequencies set for English and Latin, did not have enough k letters in their type cases to spell every /k/ sound as k, so the order went "C for K, because the printers have not so many as the Welsh requireth";[5] this was not liked at the time, but has become standard usage."
"why doesn't welsh have the letter k?""we ran out that one time and never restocked"
― mark s, Thursday, 9 November 2017 09:46 (one year ago) Permalink
grrrr i am just as bad now at grammatical gender in french as i was aged 13: le cheval but la souris whyyyyyyyyyyyy pourquooooooiii
― mark s, Friday, 10 November 2017 11:06 (one year ago) Permalink
some rules and patterns here (but of course no clue why le cheval but la souris): http://www.french-linguistics.co.uk/grammar/le_or_la_in_french.shtml
― mark s, Friday, 10 November 2017 11:07 (one year ago) Permalink
my devoted year+ on duolingo french got me enough of the basics that I was able to get a civil servant job in France where I speak French full time. it helped that I was living in France most of that time and that I'd already spent a lot of time reading french (or trying to, with much dictionary use) and that I already spoke Spanish pretty well (son of a native speaker but didn't grow up speaking it, only learned it in school). so I am yay duolingo!
I spent some time on the japanese tree earlier this year as I learn that language next but I'm going to need more than just duolingo to do it because I don't have a great sense of the grammar whereas learning a second romance language, I already grokked the main structures, what I really needed was enough confidence in applying those structures to go ahead and speak it irl.
although I think the japanese accent is easier than the french accent, so duolingo may be ok in that regard (japanese mostly sounds like it looks, unlike french)
― droit au butt (Euler), Friday, 10 November 2017 15:55 (one year ago) Permalink
I'm doing German which I'm already sorta conversational in as my Dad is from there. I wasn't raised speaking it though and what I do know is only what I've picked up listening to him speak with friends and relatives and the times that I've spent there. I'm really enjoying it so far though and am excited to improve :).
― Benson and the Jets (ENBB), Friday, 10 November 2017 16:03 (one year ago) Permalink
i just discovered the chats-with-bots feature (after several days of just ignoring the you-have-mail signal): i like that it goes "excellent response!" after what is (in another, more accurate sense) a pretty basic not-actually-rude response
― mark s, Friday, 10 November 2017 16:14 (one year ago) Permalink
I can recommend the ‘Human Japanese’ App for this.
― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Friday, 10 November 2017 20:29 (one year ago) Permalink
De vijfentwintigste. Waarom vraag je?
― nathom, Friday, 25 January 2019 13:54 (three weeks ago) Permalink
Because I just learned the word “hoeveelste.”
― The Life-Changing Magic of “Tighten Up” (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 25 January 2019 18:31 (three weeks ago) Permalink
I love that word! Wonder how you pronounce it. I lost my ten day streak due to being sick. J'avais mal à la tête. Atama itai da yoooo
― nathom, Sunday, 27 January 2019 09:57 (two weeks ago) Permalink
Dommage!Some Dutch things I recently came across that I found interesting or amusing, not through Duolingo:The wordspaalwoning and maggiblokje®The word order in the sentence Ik ben de stad in gefietst.Interesting French locution I just came across in Le Petit Robert: Inconnu au bataillon
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 27 January 2019 16:03 (two weeks ago) Permalink
Another fun Dutch word:Pinksteren
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 27 January 2019 16:51 (two weeks ago) Permalink
I’m learning Japanese, which is unsurprisingly hard though I’m making progress! I’m actually grateful for the repetition so I can get the sounds and characters down.
Duolingo is a bad place to start learning Japanese and I don’t think the course is very much cop. LingoDeer isn’t a bad place to start though. You need more explanation of the mechanics of the language and LingoDeer has that. There are however a bunch of tools that are way worse than Duolingo; tools that try to shoehorn Japanese into a European language template - so bad.
― American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Monday, 28 January 2019 00:59 (two weeks ago) Permalink
I agree with Ed.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 28 January 2019 01:08 (two weeks ago) Permalink
Started doing Japanese w memrise (while continuing w duolingo). It's meh but better than nothing.
― nathom, Wednesday, 30 January 2019 15:45 (two weeks ago) Permalink
Het is zo helder als koffiedik.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 3 February 2019 13:12 (one week ago) Permalink
― breastcrawl, Sunday, 3 February 2019 15:49 (one week ago) Permalink
No, dict.cc
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 3 February 2019 15:52 (one week ago) Permalink
More useful coffee-related turn of phrase:http://www.projects.science.uu.nl/ubv/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/koffie.jpg
― breastcrawl, Sunday, 3 February 2019 15:57 (one week ago) Permalink
https://static.mijnwebwinkel.nl/winkel/hello-bird/image/cache/full/789e31ffe6d4af0459320960ee774375f9192875.jpg
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 3 February 2019 16:04 (one week ago) Permalink
that one is advanced level lol
― breastcrawl, Sunday, 3 February 2019 16:05 (one week ago) Permalink
voor gevorderden
I don’t even know how to interpret the first word.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 3 February 2019 16:08 (one week ago) Permalink
it’s supposed to be “plat Amsterdams”. The first word is actually three words: “waar is m’n...”
― breastcrawl, Sunday, 3 February 2019 16:16 (one week ago) Permalink
Heel erg gedankt!
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 3 February 2019 19:43 (one week ago) Permalink
Aargh, heel erg bedankt
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 3 February 2019 19:44 (one week ago) Permalink
niks te danken!
― breastcrawl, Sunday, 3 February 2019 21:04 (one week ago) Permalink
Bakkie! Haha. We'd never use that word in the Flanders.
― nathom, Monday, 4 February 2019 07:42 (one week ago) Permalink
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSuxJBbswMfWqKE0Tm7RLdkUWsuWvkihVd26k9XSoaFIc8UqlQ
― breastcrawl, Monday, 4 February 2019 08:39 (one week ago) Permalink
Thanks for the tip - I’ll check it out. I’m a bit eh over it atm - not sure of the usefulness of repeating the same eight or nine words over and over for AN ENTIRE MODULE.
Russian is killing me, but that’s really my fault for not revising the alphabet before I started.
― gyac, Monday, 4 February 2019 09:13 (one week ago) Permalink
The fact I'm studying french from english is weird. Like I need to first translate to dutch. But I'm loving it.
― nathom, Monday, 4 February 2019 18:09 (one week ago) Permalink
Just found another meaning for “bakkie” - “radiozendapparatuur”
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 03:31 (one week ago) Permalink
translated as “rig” in English.Also a third meaning, “aanhangwagentje” or “trailer” in English.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 03:33 (one week ago) Permalink
Oh, it seems the second meaning is a CB radio.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 03:41 (one week ago) Permalink
Bakkie doesn't feel like it's Algemeen Nederlands (official dutch). Certainly not in Belgium. We would say "bakje" (-je means small). Don't take my word for it though. Lol
― nathom, Saturday, 9 February 2019 07:12 (one week ago) Permalink
“Bakje” is the diminuitive for the word “bak” in Standard Dutch, “bakkie” originates from the (influential) West Netherlands dialect. In the South of the Netherlands and in Flanders the most common dialect equivalent would be “bakske”.“Bak” is used in many different (idiomatic) ways, most of them related to the core meaning of “(usually rectangular) container”.This is a fun (and I’m sure not nearly exhaustive) map about the local variants of “kopje/bakje koffie”:https://www.mijnwoordenboek.nl/dialect-vertaler.php?woord=kopje%20koffie
― breastcrawl, Saturday, 9 February 2019 11:50 (one week ago) Permalink
(an *interactive* map, no less)
― breastcrawl, Saturday, 9 February 2019 11:51 (one week ago) Permalink
Well, there's even a difference between East-, West-Flanders and Antwerp. Bakske is sth we'd rarely if ever use here (in the West-Flanders).
― nathom, Saturday, 9 February 2019 12:00 (one week ago) Permalink
No doubt! That’s why I left it at “most common”. So what would the West-Flanders version of “bakje” be?
― breastcrawl, Saturday, 9 February 2019 12:08 (one week ago) Permalink
We'd pronounce it baksje. I think. Lol. (Sorry massive migraine)
― nathom, Saturday, 9 February 2019 12:59 (one week ago) Permalink
I can’t quite parse this sentence:kleine panda roofdier dat bij de wasberen hoortSmall panda predator that hears by the raccoon? Is known as the raccoon?
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 13:58 (one week ago) Permalink
“horen (bij)” (originally it’s “behoren”) means “belong (to)”
― breastcrawl, Saturday, 9 February 2019 14:03 (one week ago) Permalink
it’s not really a sentence though, more a definition:“kleine panda: roofdier dat bij de wasberen hoort”“small panda (actual English: lesser>red panda): predator belonging to the raccoons (i.e. raccoon family)”
― breastcrawl, Saturday, 9 February 2019 14:11 (one week ago) Permalink
Ah, thanks. Oh I see. There is no colon but the first part is in blue and the definition is not. This is from Prisma, not Duo btw.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 14:42 (one week ago) Permalink
Roofdieren = verscheurende dieren or is there a subtle difference?
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 15:04 (one week ago) Permalink
Or does it mean carnivores?
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 15:42 (one week ago) Permalink
Predators, carnivores, carnivorans... These are all different things in English, but who knows when to use which word? (I certainly don’t).Same in Dutch, where there’s 4 or 5 of these: roofdieren, Carnivora, carnivoren (=vleeseters), predatoren. (“verscheurende dieren” is some kind of archaic term afaict). The first two are apparently synonyms, so that would make “roofdieren” “carnivorans” in English. However, in daily speech “roofdieren” is used as a catch-all term standing in for all of these categories.(Now I’m starting to get a headache too!)
― breastcrawl, Saturday, 9 February 2019 16:53 (one week ago) Permalink
Thanks! Sorry to drag you down into my Dutch dictionary dilemma.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 19:50 (one week ago) Permalink
would you call it een waarachtige woordenboekworsteling?
― breastcrawl, Saturday, 9 February 2019 20:52 (one week ago) Permalink
Ik weet het waarachtig niet!
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 9 February 2019 21:05 (one week ago) Permalink
Chinese anyone?
― cakelou, Sunday, 10 February 2019 03:33 (six days ago) Permalink
Wil je nog koffie?
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 10 February 2019 13:30 (six days ago) Permalink
Mandarin course is pretty good but after battling through the third checkpoint I took a long break and haven’t really been back.
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 10 February 2019 13:33 (six days ago) Permalink
― nathom, Sunday, 10 February 2019 14:36 (six days ago) Permalink
― nathom, Sunday, 10 February 2019 14:37 (six days ago) Permalink
_would you call it een waarachtige woordenboekworsteling?_Never heard of that. Sounds "stiff"
― Only a Factory URL (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 10 February 2019 14:44 (six days ago) Permalink
‘twas
― breastcrawl, Sunday, 10 February 2019 14:46 (six days ago) Permalink