the TWIN PEAKS: THE RETURN non-plot-specific summing-up thread

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ie, people who have seen it distill their impressions for people who haven't yet.

I already know 'too much' (Dougie, Coop's reawakening, glass box) so keep it to vague and glittering generalities, if you can.

(I would've revived an older thread but Search seems to be fucked again.)

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 September 2017 09:25 (five months ago) Permalink

lol morbs you know incredibly little

ToddBonzalez (BradNelson), Monday, 4 September 2017 09:27 (five months ago) Permalink

yeah perhaps but there's more i know and i'd prefer not to know anything, ideally

but it's 2017, a bad world

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 September 2017 09:34 (five months ago) Permalink

it's a hugely inventive and affecting series of concepts and vignettes that don't always conclude, with specific ruminations on time (the passage of it, the indistinctness of it) and moments of fan service where you might least expect them. it's also rewarding in ways that absolutely will not be clear until you've seen the entire thing.

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Monday, 4 September 2017 11:31 (five months ago) Permalink

It's about owls basically

streeps of range (wins), Monday, 4 September 2017 12:14 (five months ago) Permalink

twin peaks the return is an anagram of ornithology twank

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Monday, 4 September 2017 12:23 (five months ago) Permalink

It's basically about never being able to go back home, in the end.

Pascal's Penisés (Old Lunch), Monday, 4 September 2017 13:54 (five months ago) Permalink

(That statement is simultaneously glib, literal, and probably more symbolically apropos than I even realized when I typed it out.)

Pascal's Penisés (Old Lunch), Monday, 4 September 2017 13:56 (five months ago) Permalink

^ in agreement with Old Lunch.

Pataphysician, Monday, 4 September 2017 14:09 (five months ago) Permalink

and moments of fan service

aloooooowly i turn....

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 September 2017 15:38 (five months ago) Permalink

There are a few moments where Lynch gives the fans exactly what they think they want, and a few others where it seems like he's going to give the fans what they want but yanks it away at the last minute, but the bulk of it is about completely smashing the hopes and dreams of the coffee n' cherry pie set. You will be pleasantly surprised by at least that much, Morbs.

Pascal's Penisés (Old Lunch), Monday, 4 September 2017 16:06 (five months ago) Permalink

Disagree based on 16 episodes. The coffee n pie set are strawmen to a whineyesque degree because the show was never just that to anybody, and inasmuch as might have been expected there were indeed significant elements of fan service involved without that ever having become the entire point or another inhibitor to it being something distinct and new

passé aggresif (darraghmac), Monday, 4 September 2017 16:10 (five months ago) Permalink

The tone of the show varies wildly from episode to episode.

Moodles, Monday, 4 September 2017 16:17 (five months ago) Permalink

Scene to scene, def

passé aggresif (darraghmac), Monday, 4 September 2017 16:17 (five months ago) Permalink

i understand this is a different animal, but the original was similarly varied scene to scene. A young film critic seeing it earlier this year said it seemed more 'soap opera' and less 'Twin Peaks weirdness' than he'd expected.

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 September 2017 16:23 (five months ago) Permalink

in the orig series rewatch i am appreciating how Albert sort of functions as a series skeptic: "Is (the giant) related to the dwarf?"

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 September 2017 16:30 (five months ago) Permalink

Yeah I think cooper is our guy who tells us it's all ok just feel yr way around and Albert is that other guy

passé aggresif (darraghmac), Monday, 4 September 2017 16:36 (five months ago) Permalink

since there is a Judy in this edition I assume that's another Vertigo ref

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 7 September 2017 15:56 (five months ago) Permalink

don't forget judy garland

i wish i had all of these on DVD so i could just mail them to you!!

Karl Malone, Thursday, 7 September 2017 16:47 (five months ago) Permalink

Saying there's fan service in this is so literal yet misleading it's like a prank.

Chris L, Thursday, 7 September 2017 16:52 (five months ago) Permalink

(Sheriff Cable voice) got a fan in the Palmer house, has a service...

Chris L, Thursday, 7 September 2017 16:53 (five months ago) Permalink

morbs you could just steal this series off the internet

akm, Thursday, 7 September 2017 16:55 (five months ago) Permalink

Morbs, I honestly think you'll love the new series once you get to it

Moodles, Thursday, 7 September 2017 16:58 (five months ago) Permalink

Xp as many people have said this feels a lot like "if mulholland dr pilot had been picked up", I think a mistake ppl make tho is assuming every single one of the threads in md would have "gone somewhere" if it had continued on

― K-hole MacLachlan (wins), Tuesday, 6 June 2017 12:41 (three months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^not a bad summing-up of the return from 1 week in

streeps of range (wins), Thursday, 7 September 2017 17:20 (five months ago) Permalink

ince there is a Judy in this edition I assume that's another Vertigo ref

it's the same Judy from the last edition

shackling the masses with plastic-wrapped snack picks (sic), Thursday, 7 September 2017 18:26 (five months ago) Permalink

we're not gonna talk about judy

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:09 (five months ago) Permalink

i don't remember a Judy

but I'm only up to ep12 in the reatch

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:11 (five months ago) Permalink

*rewatch

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:11 (five months ago) Permalink

there is no Judy in the original series. The name "Judy" is briefly uttered in FWWM.

Οὖτις, Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:12 (five months ago) Permalink

shame on you, sic

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:13 (five months ago) Permalink

Technically there is a Judy in the original series, she's played by molly shannon

streeps of range (wins), Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:37 (five months ago) Permalink

ok fine

Οὖτις, Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:44 (five months ago) Permalink

we're not going to talk about molly shannon

I would have died laughing if her character turned out to be important in the Return

akm, Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:45 (five months ago) Permalink

i loved that one scene where she plunged her hands deeeeep into her armpits, then held the odorous fingers up to her nostrils and inhaled so deeply. the intake of her breath seems especially crisp (sound design by david lynch showing here) and it lasts a couple beats longer than you'd expect. then: "Starring Kyle McLachlan"

Karl Malone, Thursday, 7 September 2017 22:57 (five months ago) Permalink

since this thread has served its major function i'd like to say thanks also - it's been a lovely and stimulating thread and it's been a good time! an excellent reminder of what ilx is at its best!

i'd like to say thanks to ilx lurker, Priory, who sent me a helpful email off the back of this thread. I was unable to reply to your message since I couldn't find your details (ilx mail doesn't allow one to simply respond to a message!) - anyway, thanks and please de-lurk. x

Cake hawn. (jed_), Friday, 8 September 2017 01:32 (five months ago) Permalink

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8-_aJ1BiFE

Cake hawn. (jed_), Friday, 8 September 2017 01:37 (five months ago) Permalink

FWWM is the last edition!

shackling the masses with plastic-wrapped snack picks (sic), Friday, 8 September 2017 01:52 (five months ago) Permalink

wrong thread obv!

Cake hawn. (jed_), Friday, 8 September 2017 01:55 (five months ago) Permalink

Now that it's over, I've signed up for a free month of Hulu & Showtime and am binge watching. With all the weekly episode synopses that have been published (AV Club, Vulture, etc.), what's a good one for spotting small details, making connections and theorizing? Bonus points for a good comments section.

Hideous Lump, Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:24 (five months ago) Permalink

I'm generally wary of recap culture, but my favorite episode-by-episode discussions of The Return have been Joel Bocko's writeups on lostinthemovies.com and the conversations on the podcasts Diane, Lodgers, and Counter Esperanto.

one way street, Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:33 (five months ago) Permalink

i can't say i read a ton of recaps, but whenever i ran across the Vulture recaps i thought they did a pretty good job and i usually learned a thing or two as well

Karl Malone, Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:39 (five months ago) Permalink

Just watched 17 then dinner then let's do this

passé aggresif (darraghmac), Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:43 (five months ago) Permalink

Your optimism is cute

Moodles, Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:44 (five months ago) Permalink

unless you know something I don't, dinner is guaranteed and the download of ep 18 is fine

passé aggresif (darraghmac), Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:47 (five months ago) Permalink

I'm generally wary of recap culture, but my favorite episode-by-episode discussions of The Return have been Joel Bocko's writeups on lostinthemovies.com🕸 and the conversations on the podcasts Diane, Lodgers, and Counter Esperanto.

Cosign all of this. I've heard the av club & culture reviews are good but haven't really read anything about the show beyond bocko's blog & the ilx thread

streeps of range (wins), Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:51 (five months ago) Permalink

i've pretty much only read jess zimmerman's recaps on vice, those are all excellent

ToddBonzalez (BradNelson), Saturday, 9 September 2017 17:51 (five months ago) Permalink

Emily Stephens is probably the best writer at the AV Club and her recaps were quite good

a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Saturday, 9 September 2017 18:19 (five months ago) Permalink

Dinner was good

passé aggresif (darraghmac), Saturday, 9 September 2017 19:05 (five months ago) Permalink

ayyyyyyy love dinner

streeps of range (wins), Saturday, 9 September 2017 19:09 (five months ago) Permalink

Jesus do I really have to go through all the bad takes before giving out about this on the other thread

passé aggresif (darraghmac), Saturday, 9 September 2017 21:30 (five months ago) Permalink

negative reports about the audience

really? that's fucking lame. just talking and making jokes and stuff?

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:04 (one month ago) Permalink

Audiences are what worry me about these things but I'd love so much to see this in the cinema

very stabbable gaius (wins), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:05 (one month ago) Permalink

really? that's fucking lame. just talking and making jokes and stuff?

― Karl Malone, Wednesday, January 10, 2018 10:04 AM (thirty-two seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lotta inappropriate laughter

flamenco drop (BradNelson), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:05 (one month ago) Permalink

Oh yeah that was my experience of seeing fwwm at the cinema for sure

very stabbable gaius (wins), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:06 (one month ago) Permalink

gobble gobble

flamenco drop (BradNelson), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:08 (one month ago) Permalink

two friends of mine went, haven't heard much bad stuff

this wd involve all kinds of nervous laughter i'm sure

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:09 (one month ago) Permalink

Wonder if the Sutherland quote about screenings being "relatively rare" has to do with the rights & how they work differently for TV shows, as Simon H speculated on his podcast. Hopefully it's more just stating the obvious re the practicalities of putting on 16 and a half hours of content, like you'd expect these to be rare, screenings of Out 1 are extremely rare too

very stabbable gaius (wins), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:13 (one month ago) Permalink

i've been rewatching on bluray and when i got to pt8 i lingered in the projection booth at work after the square had finally fucking ended and the staff had gone home and arranged a theatrical screening for myself, in the middle of the night, alone, when no one knew where i was or what i was doing. i sat on the stage 8ft from the screen. as ferris bueller says, if you have the means, i highly suggest picking one up

whole show's terrific at home tho as long as yr able to turn it up.

difficult listening hour, Wednesday, 10 January 2018 17:34 (one month ago) Permalink

damn that rules, lol @ 'when the square finally fucking ended', all i ever heard about that movie was how interminable it was

flappy bird, Wednesday, 10 January 2018 18:24 (one month ago) Permalink

otm. i highly recommend seeing Lynch's work large, preferably projected, dark room up close. a good projector is not that expensive of an investment and is a dramatically different experience. i projected most of season 3 with a few friends at a time as it came out. the night of episode 8 there was a mini miracle and we finally got everybody together to have the night off and grab pizza. we projected out in the living room on the large white wall and had no idea it was going to be _that_ episode. it was amazing.

a few months later i went to visit a friend who had moved out of town and we planned on binge watching as much as we could while i visited. the thing is, the couch we sat on was way across the room, the TV monitor just a tiny box on the far end of the room. it was hard to focus on it. it was easy to get distracted. Lynch in particular plays with tension and dynamics far more than most other directors so i agree w him that a powerful system is necessary to get the full experience. visual details and quiet noises can be missed if it's an un-optimized viewing experience. his work triggers all kinds of (often mixed) emotions.

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 18:26 (one month ago) Permalink

ah there is a cut off sentence at the end there. i meant to say: people will laugh at David Lynch's work because it is genuinely funny, sometimes cosmically so. he is constantly tip-toeing all kinds of lines and combining horror with beauty and comedy all at once. first time i saw a Lynch film in the theater was Mulholland Drive and while it was a thing of beauty, me and two friends had never laughed so much in our lives.

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 18:29 (one month ago) Permalink

I liked The Square but the last 45 minutes is really quite a slog

AB I'm extremely jealous of yr setup

Simon H., Wednesday, 10 January 2018 18:29 (one month ago) Permalink

^same, it was fine but interminable

very stabbable gaius (wins), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 18:31 (one month ago) Permalink

I stumbled across a Lynch piece in an art museum here. Hand-made paper, on which he drew a baby having a baby (more or less).

change display name (Jordan), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 18:33 (one month ago) Permalink

the square had one scene in the first half-hour (delivering the letters) that was so riveting and dreadful and confidently on-the-nose (the dark square of the apartment stairwell he turns round and round, descending, as he enmeshes himself violently with other lives) i wondered if by the end of the movie stockholm would be in apocalyptic flame, and then as far as i can tell nothing happened for two more hours except strained artworld satire. tasteless millennial marketing team in partic rang false w every other word.

adam's setup sounds ideal.

difficult listening hour, Wednesday, 10 January 2018 19:09 (one month ago) Permalink

my peaks friend at work had an extra ticket for saturday's MOMA marathon and offered it to me. I had already told my friends I would be dungeon mastering for them that day. I didn't go to the screening. A DM is only as good as his word :(

Winter. Dickens. Yes. (Jon not Jon), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 22:27 (one month ago) Permalink

battle of nerddoms!

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 10 January 2018 22:32 (one month ago) Permalink

adam's setup sounds ideal.

i dropped ~$100 on a consumer grade LED projector a few years ago and use it for hours daily. you can probably spend that now and get one with way better resolution (mine is kind of useless for anything with text). imo it's also a QoL upgrade as you suddenly aren't staring directly at a screen quite so much, there is the possibility for a larger image that is easier on the eyes.

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Thursday, 11 January 2018 01:04 (one month ago) Permalink

I'm rather late to the ILX/TPTR party, but can I just say that the fact that it exists is such a fucking blessing.

© louis jagger/richards (Pillbox), Thursday, 11 January 2018 09:14 (one month ago) Permalink

Yeah, I'm not blasting the sound; I'd rather not be scared into permanent sleeplessness by a TV show.

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Sunday, 14 January 2018 03:09 (one month ago) Permalink

There's a fair chance that will happen anyway, might as well get those good headphones on and luxuriate in the ominous rumbling imo

very stabbable gaius (wins), Sunday, 14 January 2018 10:09 (one month ago) Permalink

Won't comment until I get a few episodes in, but I finally started this last night (first two parts).

clemenza, Sunday, 14 January 2018 16:56 (one month ago) Permalink

four weeks pass...

Did the first series 'rescue' DL from postmodernism?

Twin Peaks proved, at least for a while, to be not only a phenomenal critical/commercial success, but one that worked entirely on its auteur’s own idiosyncratic terms, melding an ironic view of melodramatic conventions with a surrealist vision. Indeed, Lynch has often been credited with irrevocably transforming television, paving the way for that Golden Age represented by The Sopranos (with its frequent recourse to dream sequences), The Wire, Breaking Bad and Mad Men.

Yet it could just as easily be argued that television transformed Lynch, previously a key postmodern figure. Whereas modernism viewed narrative as a problem, postmodernism viewed it as a joke, a hoax that had been exposed and deserved only our derision. Blue Velvet (1986) and Wild at Heart (1990) belong securely within this tradition, as does the feature-length Twin Peaks pilot.

As the latter series developed, however, Lynch clearly found himself caring, in an unironic way, about characters who had initially existed in inverted commas, introducing a depth of feeling that would be retained in his later, more mature output. Turning from Twin Peaks’s 1989 pilot to its prequel, Twin Peaks: Fire Walk with Me (1992), one is struck by the sharp difference in tone; the scene in the pilot in which we are asked to laugh at Deputy Andy Brennan (Harry Goaz)’s grief upon confronting Laura Palmer (Sheryl Lee)’s corpse feels callous in a manner that has no equivalent in the later film, or any of Lynch’s subsequent theatrical efforts.

http://www.bfi.org.uk/news-opinion/sight-sound-magazine/comment/bradlands/twin-peaks-david-lynch-stretches-television-unknown

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Monday, 12 February 2018 22:27 (one week ago) Permalink

Twin Peaks: Classic or Dud?

Haribo Hancock (sic), Monday, 12 February 2018 22:52 (one week ago) Permalink

the scene in the pilot in which we are asked to laugh at Deputy Andy Brennan (Harry Goaz)’s grief upon confronting Laura Palmer (Sheryl Lee)’s corpse feels callous in a manner that has no equivalent in the later film

when truman says "is this gonna happen every damn time?" you have all of andy's character (except his physical heroism) summed in one moment, and you're not (just) supposed to laugh imo. andy is undesensitizable, which in a whole show about trauma is hardly just a joke. plus, accidental resonance: things that happen again, things that are returned to, the same as last year at mr. blodgett's barn.

difficult listening hour, Monday, 12 February 2018 23:14 (one week ago) Permalink

at the same time yes it is played for laughs. figure it out yknow?

difficult listening hour, Monday, 12 February 2018 23:15 (one week ago) Permalink

Whereas modernism viewed narrative as a problem, postmodernism viewed it as a joke, a hoax that had been exposed and deserved only our derision.

also i've never taken an english course so who knows but this sounds wrong.

difficult listening hour, Monday, 12 February 2018 23:19 (one week ago) Permalink

yeah i was gonna make roughly the same post. considering how much crying and sobbing there is in the episode, it serves a much more nuanced purpose than getting a laugh

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Monday, 12 February 2018 23:20 (one week ago) Permalink

"narrative deserves only our derision" reads like a characterization of postmodernism by... someone who thinks you can be rescued from it by television

difficult listening hour, Monday, 12 February 2018 23:20 (one week ago) Permalink

Narrative is funny though.

Alba, Tuesday, 13 February 2018 06:44 (one week ago) Permalink

Jeeze I'd say one would only have to watch 10 minutes of THE ELEPHANT MAN to realise where Lynch's heart is.

startled macropod (MatthewK), Tuesday, 13 February 2018 06:52 (one week ago) Permalink

no matter how hard I try i will never understand what is or isn't postmodern

josh az (2011nostalgia), Tuesday, 13 February 2018 08:43 (one week ago) Permalink

congratulations, you're postmodern

Simon H., Tuesday, 13 February 2018 13:47 (one week ago) Permalink

feel like anything before WWI is modern but past that it gets fuzzy. once you've passed Andy Warhol and the birth of the internet there's no looking back

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 13 February 2018 13:50 (one week ago) Permalink

i chose WWI cos Dada/surrealism being the first cracks in the facade of pop postmodernism

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 13 February 2018 13:51 (one week ago) Permalink

Netflix finally sends the DVDs on Tuesday. See you in the Other Place!

morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 16 February 2018 20:36 (one week ago) Permalink

i'll probably start it this weekend, as i'm watching the original's finale tonight i think.

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Friday, 16 February 2018 20:37 (one week ago) Permalink

we'll see you both at the curtain call

i remember the corned beef of my childhood (Karl Malone), Friday, 16 February 2018 20:39 (one week ago) Permalink

O Lucky Men!

Re: the revive, why do so many hot takes of Lynch's work seem to so fundamentally misunderstand Lynch and his aims? I mean, I geddit, he can be a slippery customer, but still.

I Wanna Be A Door (Old Lunch), Friday, 16 February 2018 20:39 (one week ago) Permalink

I think there's a fundamental mismatch between how fans watched the Twin Peaks revival—obsessively, in online forums, sleuthing and pouring over every crevice for deeper significance—and how Lynch has suggested we enjoy it: as an experience, a dream that works best on the immediate level. He's all but said "just watch it, enjoy it and be moved by it."

Obviously artists don't get to control how viewers engage with their work, but it does make the 15,000 Reddit threads devoted to Judy seem very silly.

Evan R, Friday, 16 February 2018 21:02 (one week ago) Permalink

I'm not going to not talk about Judy.

Alba, Friday, 16 February 2018 21:05 (one week ago) Permalink

frankly the obsessive poring-over is why I like to watch such series long after they debut.

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Friday, 16 February 2018 21:09 (one week ago) Permalink

(ie to abstain from it)

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Friday, 16 February 2018 21:09 (one week ago) Permalink

i don't think he minds a huge group of fans obsessing over every tiny detail in his work. he even nods to that kind of community/culture a few times in the return (i won't be specific even though it wouldn't really be a spoiler at all)

i remember the corned beef of my childhood (Karl Malone), Friday, 16 February 2018 21:11 (one week ago) Permalink

in terms of how an audience consumes his work, he seems much more concerned about the quality - he hates people watching on phones, and he recommended several times that people use headphones (which i do too; if you're into the eraserhead soundtrack you'll love this)

i remember the corned beef of my childhood (Karl Malone), Friday, 16 February 2018 21:13 (one week ago) Permalink

Yeah that's a noble priority. I remember this debuted in the summer, and every Sunday night even on the most sweltering days I'd have to turn off the air condition when watching the new episode so I didn't miss any of the sound details

Evan R, Friday, 16 February 2018 21:27 (one week ago) Permalink

Never watched anything else in our place at such a volume (although my gf did insist on a significant reduction wrt the Penderecki).

Love Theme from Biodome (Old Lunch), Friday, 16 February 2018 22:37 (one week ago) Permalink

Do you have neighbors, pal?

Figure I'll go about 2 episodes a week, an 18-hr marathon doesn't seem optimal for my mental state.

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 17 February 2018 14:32 (six days ago) Permalink

i tried but can't do more than 2 episodes at a time. 3 is a stretch.

akm, Saturday, 17 February 2018 16:22 (six days ago) Permalink


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