THE DEUCE with David Simon, George Pelecanos, James Franco AND James Franco

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Guess we might as well have a thread for this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2pXEzIQnUs

bet HBO are really regretting their investment after the Vinyl debacle

Number None, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 21:24 (two years ago) link

HBO Drops Another Deuce

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 21:36 (two years ago) link

two months pass...

Long preview article:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/24/arts/television/the-deuce-hbo-david-simon.html

Eazy, Thursday, 24 August 2017 21:11 (two years ago) link

James Franco, who directed two of the first season’s episodes, assumes double acting duty as well. He plays Vincent Martino, an ambitious bartender based on the man who had spun enticing tales of the Deuce, and his twin, Frankie, who shares none of his brother’s reservations about working in the sex trade for the mob.

Eazy, Thursday, 24 August 2017 21:12 (two years ago) link

Does the "actor playing two roles" thing *ever* work out to be better than more than tolerable?
Just get another actor!

calstars, Thursday, 24 August 2017 23:22 (two years ago) link

And Franco is so annoyingly smug all the time. Ugh, not sure about this

calstars, Thursday, 24 August 2017 23:23 (two years ago) link

In the future, TV and movie viewers will be able to swap out actors at will for anyone in the canon.

calstars, Thursday, 24 August 2017 23:24 (two years ago) link

Does the "actor playing two roles" thing *ever* work out to be better than more than tolerable?

Jeffrey Jambor in Arrested Development & Nicholas Cage in Adaptation

but yes, it's almost always a bad idea

Number None, Friday, 25 August 2017 06:28 (two years ago) link

Twin peaks is doing well atm

streeps of range (wins), Friday, 25 August 2017 06:58 (two years ago) link

oh yeah lol

Number None, Friday, 25 August 2017 07:43 (two years ago) link

I am cautiously optimistic about this tbh

a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Friday, 25 August 2017 08:15 (two years ago) link

but I also loved most of Treme so

a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Friday, 25 August 2017 08:15 (two years ago) link

Otm

Spottie, Friday, 25 August 2017 15:56 (two years ago) link

first episode is streaming now fyi

sktsh, Sunday, 27 August 2017 15:09 (two years ago) link

*on hbo go that is

sktsh, Sunday, 27 August 2017 15:09 (two years ago) link

they point out that the franco thing is a "based on a real life" thing but man i don't wanna see franco doing the patti duke

Chocolate-covered gummy bears? Not ruling those lil' guys out. (ulysses), Sunday, 27 August 2017 16:26 (two years ago) link

The patti what

Οὖτις, Sunday, 27 August 2017 16:31 (two years ago) link

it's a reference to patty duke's most famous role

In 2015, Duke made her final TV appearance, guest-starring as Grandma Janice and Great-aunt Hilary, a pair of identical twins, on "Liv and Maddie."

nomar, Sunday, 27 August 2017 17:45 (two years ago) link

and Οὖτις's post was a reference to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgdisnVQf6A

Number None, Sunday, 27 August 2017 17:48 (two years ago) link

three weeks pass...

renewed for a second season

if i ever watch it wd be for Maggie Gyllenhaal

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Friday, 22 September 2017 01:06 (one year ago) link

Does the "actor playing two roles" thing *ever* work out to be better than more than tolerable?

uhhh, Jeremy Irons for Cronenberg? and the Hammer dude in the Facebook movie, on a more mortal level.

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Friday, 22 September 2017 01:08 (one year ago) link

Fargo Season 3 has double the Ewan MacGregor, he's good as them.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 22 September 2017 02:00 (one year ago) link

Morbius OTM was waiting for Dead Ringers...

Week of Wonders (Ross), Friday, 22 September 2017 02:08 (one year ago) link

Keaton in Multiplicity is p funny

Οὖτις, Friday, 22 September 2017 02:13 (one year ago) link

This is really good so far. Feels nice and authentic without the "people playing '70s dressup" vibe of most recent films and tv things set in that decade ( yeah, "Vinyl", I'm looking at you). Cast is excellent.

Acid Hose (Capitaine Jay Vee), Friday, 22 September 2017 03:43 (one year ago) link

didn't hate ep one but also not watching anymore of this

johnny crunch, Friday, 22 September 2017 11:13 (one year ago) link

a recommended old VV story on that milieu, "Deep Peep"

https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=KEtq3P1Vf8oC&dat=19780501&printsec=frontpage&hl=en

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Friday, 22 September 2017 17:03 (one year ago) link

I just learned that Margareta Levieva, who plays Abby the NYU dropout on this show, is 37 years old. Her character is supposed to be what, 19? I never would have guessed.

JRN, Tuesday, 26 September 2017 01:57 (one year ago) link

woah

a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Tuesday, 26 September 2017 01:58 (one year ago) link

*Margarita

JRN, Tuesday, 26 September 2017 01:58 (one year ago) link

three weeks pass...

i think the latest episode was the first really good one. all of the separate pieces that have been slowly developing - the cops, the mafia, prostitutes and pimps, porno, the francos - are starting to intertwine and it's really satisfying. not unlike, for obvious reasons, the wire.

anyone else watching this? i am trying to break myself out of the habit of calling it "the douche, starring james franco AND james franco as the douche"

Currently (Karl Malone), Wednesday, 18 October 2017 14:37 (one year ago) link

didn't hate ep one but also not watching anymore of this

i felt the same way, btw, after watching the first couple. there was almost something exhausting about gearing up for more "prestige television". i know that doesn't make any sense. i suppose i should hold off on expressing any more enthusiasm until there are at least a few really really good episodes in a row, but i'm much more optimistic about that happening than i was at the beginning. there's a lot going on, so now i can see why they took the time to build up the world.

Currently (Karl Malone), Wednesday, 18 October 2017 14:45 (one year ago) link

there was almost something exhausting about gearing up for more "prestige television". i know that doesn't make any sense.

literally could not make any more sense

Guayaquil (eephus!), Wednesday, 18 October 2017 14:47 (one year ago) link

haha, well that's nice to hear. i mean, i hear things of that nature from my friends, too. but i'm not sure why i feel that way! "dang it, here's another really well produced serial tv/film, basically, which will bring my enjoyment for the next 2 to 6 years." maybe it's just the exhaustion of knowing that i might be expected to know what's going on with this show, in certain circles, and that if i don't know, i will feel left out?

Currently (Karl Malone), Wednesday, 18 October 2017 14:56 (one year ago) link

I'm watching it, it's solid in that particularly un-showy David Simon way where things happen and then some more things happen. Amazingly I don't think very much about James Franco being James Franco, which means this is probably his best role(s)?

change display name (Jordan), Wednesday, 18 October 2017 15:39 (one year ago) link

And it is driving me insane that for some reason Black Thought is credited as "Tarik Trotter" when everything else he's done has been "Tariq Trotter". Why???

change display name (Jordan), Wednesday, 18 October 2017 15:40 (one year ago) link

Amazingly I don't think very much about James Franco being James Franco

yeah, i actually don't mind franco but for some reason i really enjoy making fun of james franco, so i'm probably going to keep doing it. speaking of, check out this cool screen capture from imdb's website this morning:

https://i.imgur.com/9ZfjOnf.png

Currently (Karl Malone), Wednesday, 18 October 2017 15:46 (one year ago) link

I like this but it's so slow. Feel like Maggie G had been about to join films for 6 eps now.

Thomas Gabriel Fischer does not endorse (aldo), Thursday, 19 October 2017 13:47 (one year ago) link

HBO’s new ensemble drama “The Deuce” is, among other things, an unflinching show about the sex work industry in 1970s New York. But its most intimate exchange to date takes place in a moment of postcoital vulnerability between lovers. A bedside radio plays the Four Tops’ Motown hit “Baby I Need Your Loving” as Vincent Martino (James Franco), a thirtysomething bar proprietor, and his college-dropout bartender, Abby Parker (Margarita Levieva), lie in each other’s arms. “Do you like this music?” he asks, and her condescending laugh says it all. When he presses her about what she listens to, Abby turns the radio’s dial until she hears “Pale Blue Eyes” by the Velvet Underground. When she starts to tell a story about seeing the band at Max’s Kansas City, Vincent shushes her: “I’m listening.”

rmde

Οὖτις, Friday, 20 October 2017 19:32 (one year ago) link

That scene was not so good. It did make me wonder whether VU ever got any radio play, even locally in New York.

JRN, Friday, 20 October 2017 20:05 (one year ago) link

yeah that particular kind of um fictional license really leaps out I mean wtf

Οὖτις, Friday, 20 October 2017 20:07 (one year ago) link

Yeah that was my least favorite scene in the show so far. Very Treme-era Simon.

change display name (Jordan), Friday, 20 October 2017 20:07 (one year ago) link

I saw five minutes of this show. Might have been the first episode, or the fifth, who knows. Seemed ... nothing special, but it did at least look right.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 20 October 2017 20:08 (one year ago) link

God I’m sorry they played a band inaccurately on the radio how did you not shut off the show then and there.

rb (soda), Friday, 20 October 2017 20:13 (one year ago) link

I never even turned it on, problem solved

Οὖτις, Friday, 20 October 2017 20:17 (one year ago) link

I'm agnostic on The Wire but this is decent. Paradoxically, its leisurely pace makes me think there needs to be more of it to be effective.

ryan, Friday, 20 October 2017 20:20 (one year ago) link

started watching the first ep and am reserving judgment til I'm through w it but my first thought was what's up with all the blaxploitation tropes and zero mafia guys.

Οὖτις, Monday, 23 October 2017 18:53 (one year ago) link

also lol @ Method Man in a wig

Οὖτις, Monday, 23 October 2017 18:53 (one year ago) link

the mafia guys are present

Number None, Monday, 23 October 2017 18:54 (one year ago) link

I liked the pilot of this but have yet to watch more. tbh I really liked Treme, esp the 2nd and 3rd seasons

Simon H., Monday, 23 October 2017 18:55 (one year ago) link

otoh Barry White and whatever Moroder song that was in the gay disco were very well placed

Οὖτις, Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:12 (one year ago) link

three weeks pass...

lol nobody's watching this, are they

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:46 (eleven months ago) link

I am, but I'm watching season 1.

I didn't realize Megan Abbott was a writer and story editor on this; she's my friend's wife too, you'd think he'd more loudly socialize shit like this

akm, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:48 (eleven months ago) link

also: this is really a great series. I echo everything poositive everyone said up above. when it was originally being touted it was very much along the lines of 'here's the start of the porn industry!" which is selling it short. It's about a lot more than that. I appreciate shows like this that give me a picture of what NYC was like at that time; the first time I went to NYC was 1997 by which time all of that had been completely cleaned up. It's hard for me to fathom a big chunk of a city even being like this these days.

akm, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:50 (eleven months ago) link

I didn't know they were up and running again. I will definitely watch the second season, but I don't have HBO, so I'll have to wait for my bootleg DVD place to get it.

clemenza, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:53 (eleven months ago) link

I'm still watching, but behind by a few weeks. Tough to watch this on the bus!

DJI, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:53 (eleven months ago) link

yeah it is *really* broad in scope. Almost too broad, I think. I'm generally enjoying it because it's so well shot and acted, and if I don't like one storyline hey don't worry in 5 minutes the show will be shift focus to somewhere else. But I think it does lack a certain dramatic tension, there's a distinct lack of real conflict. Everybody is made sympathetic in one way or another, there's no real villains, and no real stakes to anything - none of the characters really seem to be in opposition to one another, so what you get is just kind of a bunch of semi-interesting (and usually lurid) stuff happening. It ends up feeling oddly inert.

the one minor character I miss from season 1 was the porn store owner. that guy was just too perfectly cast.

xp

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:54 (eleven months ago) link

Been watching it ( missed this week's) and still loving the attention to detail. Some of the storylines are becoming yawnsome, though ( Gyllenhaal's (sp!) and the troublesome Franco "twin" especially). Love the cop stuff but I think I see where a lot of stuff is heading ( Maggie G's son prob inadvertently catching a porno starring mom / hooker porn starlet tries to leave pimp and trouble ensues/ etc etc). Girl who plays bar owner Franco's girlfriend should play Joan Jett in a biopic. Gorgeous.

An Uphill Battle For Legumes (Capitaine Jay Vee), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:55 (eleven months ago) link

Girl who plays bar owner Franco's girlfriend should play Joan Jett in a biopic. Gorgeous.

not gonna deny that she is v pretty but her character is so fucking annoying and unrealistic, that person did not exist in 1977.

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 19:57 (eleven months ago) link

What do you find annoying and unrealistic about the character?

An Uphill Battle For Legumes (Capitaine Jay Vee), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:01 (eleven months ago) link

"yeah it is *really* broad in scope. Almost too broad, I think. I'm generally enjoying it because it's so well shot and acted, and if I don't like one storyline hey don't worry in 5 minutes the show will be shift focus to somewhere else. But I think it does lack a certain dramatic tension, there's a distinct lack of real conflict. Everybody is made sympathetic in one way or another, there's no real villains, and no real stakes to anything - none of the characters really seem to be in opposition to one another, so what you get is just kind of a bunch of semi-interesting ... stuff happening. It ends up feeling oddly inert."

Haven't seen any of this yet, but sounds like Treme, which I watched a season plus of and eventually wandered away from. Hard to get excited about.

circa1916, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:04 (eleven months ago) link

middle-class feminist studies girl drops out of college to dabble in sex-work activism also happens to have impeccable cutting edge taste in up-and-coming punk bands and happens to be a dead ringer for Joan Jett, I mean come on that is some v idealized hindsight-is-20/20 screenwriter nonsense

maybe if she was modeled on Andrea Dworkin I would buy it

xp

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:04 (eleven months ago) link

it was clear from the Wire that Simon (and I suppose Pellecanos?) like to show the moral grey areas that most real people live in and that that militates against having outsized evil villains, but I feel like the genuine uber-ugly levels of brutality that are deeply ingrained in being a pimp (or a mobster, or a corrupt cop) are overly obscured in this show - at least one of these types could be credibly expected to be a real monster, but that's not really how Rudy or CC or any of these types are written. This one wants to be an actor! This one's kinda nice sometimes! Rudy looks out for his guys! Stories without villains or at least some sense of struggle, of opposing forces, just tend to be less engaging, and this show is no exception.

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:09 (eleven months ago) link

I'm watching it too, and haven't seen this week either, but like most I'm sticking with it because it's well made and the actors are good rather than the plot which is all over the place and, as others have said, far too broad.

Larry is the standout character this season I think.

So many penises, it feels like.

Bimlo Horsewagon became Wheelbarrow Horseflesh (aldo), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:17 (eleven months ago) link

Larry's on-set dick reveal + smile was by far the funniest moment of the season

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:18 (eleven months ago) link

The real villain of Simon's shows is the SYSTEM, man.

DJI, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:19 (eleven months ago) link

"dead ringer for Joan Jett"

is her hair black in season 2? I don't see the resemblance myself

akm, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:21 (eleven months ago) link

how about Suzi Quatro

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:23 (eleven months ago) link

I'd say CC is unambiguously a bad guy

Number None, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:24 (eleven months ago) link

(i'm watching too, but don't have an awful lot to say about S2 so far. Just seems to be ticking along)

Number None, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:24 (eleven months ago) link

xpost Yeah her hair's black now she's booking punk and new wave bands for the bar.

I don't care at all about the other nightclub.

Bimlo Horsewagon became Wheelbarrow Horseflesh (aldo), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:25 (eleven months ago) link

Other xpost Nah, CC is going to turn into Iceberg Slim and be the hero of season 3.

Bimlo Horsewagon became Wheelbarrow Horseflesh (aldo), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:27 (eleven months ago) link

I'd say CC is unambiguously a bad guy

I do think the bringing in CC's former bottom whore as Abby's activist partner has brought his shittiness into sharper focus

(lol @ Iceberg Slim, well-known good guy pimp! I guess he did ultimately renounce his wayward ways)

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:29 (eleven months ago) link

Good points, Shakey. I guess I'm just enjoying the ride but definitely there's a bunch of unrealistic crap worthy of whatever that awful Scorsese NYC A&R guy series was whose name I forgot. Though this is a much better sho, imho.

An Uphill Battle For Legumes (Capitaine Jay Vee), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:50 (eleven months ago) link

*show

An Uphill Battle For Legumes (Capitaine Jay Vee), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:50 (eleven months ago) link

Definitely more Suzi than Joan

An Uphill Battle For Legumes (Capitaine Jay Vee), Wednesday, 10 October 2018 20:54 (eleven months ago) link

that awful Scorsese NYC A&R guy series was whose name I forgot

VINYL! gawd that was so bad. also ref'd upthread lol

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 10 October 2018 21:06 (eleven months ago) link

two weeks pass...

that steak order was confirmation that CC is 100% evil

Number None, Wednesday, 24 October 2018 22:00 (ten months ago) link

tension def ramped up this episode. contradictions were heightened, one might say

Οὖτις, Thursday, 25 October 2018 15:35 (ten months ago) link

was totally convinced that was David Proval playing the elder Martino in his one scene but apparently not...? That dude did look familiar though.

Οὖτις, Monday, 29 October 2018 15:23 (ten months ago) link

Armand Asante

akm, Monday, 29 October 2018 15:42 (ten months ago) link

No redemption for CC then.

My favourite new fact is that Blake Leyh wanted to use We Are All Prostitutes as the theme music for season 2 but David Simon wouldn't let him because he felt it was a bit too Do You See.

Bimlo Horsewagon became Wheelbarrow Horseflesh (aldo), Wednesday, 31 October 2018 16:11 (ten months ago) link

"let's go with 'This Year's Girl', it's much more subtle"

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 31 October 2018 16:18 (ten months ago) link

ten months pass...

It's back, and it's 1985. They are giving us a version of the Jack Maple policing story. This show is great, but still feels pretty low-stakes.

DJI, Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:24 (one week ago) link

so this is gonna be the "who is going to get AIDS?!" season eh

Οὖτις, Thursday, 12 September 2019 15:56 (one week ago) link

Yeah I guess :/

DJI, Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:02 (one week ago) link

Sex, lies and videotape

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:11 (one week ago) link

"wolfpacks", AIDS, some anachronisms in the dialogue ( "run it back"? Who used that on the streets of NYC in '84?!) and a bit of a messy covering-all-bases feeling. Kind of a disappointing start.

Carly Jae Vespen (Capitaine Jay Vee), Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:17 (one week ago) link

Very much a "torn from today's headlines!!" vibe in the writing that felt facile. Let's see where they go. Still, the recreation of mid-80s NYC in the production- at least what I recall of it - is often uncanny.

Carly Jae Vespen (Capitaine Jay Vee), Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:22 (one week ago) link

it continues to look and sound incredible but it's kind of all over the place narratively

Οὖτις, Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:24 (one week ago) link

like, I can't keep either Franco character's personal relationships straight

Οὖτις, Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:25 (one week ago) link

Yeah and I'm finding them the least interesting characters at the moment.

Carly Jae Vespen (Capitaine Jay Vee), Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:28 (one week ago) link

lol yeah it's weird how they have this twin plot set-up and then basically do nothing with it, they might as well be two non-identical twins played by different actors

Οὖτις, Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:29 (one week ago) link

if this ends with "good" Franco getting whacked in a case of mistaken identity because the "bad" Franco crosses the mob I am going to rmde

Οὖτις, Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:30 (one week ago) link

lol

Carly Jae Vespen (Capitaine Jay Vee), Thursday, 12 September 2019 16:42 (one week ago) link

i could not follow what bad Franco brother aws up to in this episode at all. What was the deal with meeting the dude in the car? what was he selling? Why did he borrow that video equipment and make that video with the family? what was going on?

akm, Sunday, 15 September 2019 15:26 (five days ago) link

the thing in the car I could follow - he has a side hussle w the gangster underling that the mob boss/Jackie Jr (no I can't remember the actual character name) doesn't know about.

No idea what the family/video camera thing was about cuz I was like "wait, he still has a family? who are these people?"

Οὖτις, Monday, 16 September 2019 16:40 (four days ago) link

his side hussle is alluded to later when the mob boss/Jackie Jr asks about his loyalty/that he would never cut him out of anything. So there's some obvious foreshadowing going on there.

Οὖτις, Monday, 16 September 2019 16:41 (four days ago) link

hussle & flo

now let's play big lunch take little lunch (sic), Monday, 16 September 2019 18:33 (four days ago) link


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