Deep Space Nine: a thread for (re)watching this awesome series

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We've had a couple of DS9 threads before, but they were mostly about specific characters, so I think the the series deserves one of its own. And since it's been recently added to Netflix outside the US too, I think it'd be nice to discuss it with people who are watching it for the first time, or rewatching it like I'm doing at the moment.

And since this thread should be friendly to new viewers, let's try avoid spoilers if possible, and mark any posts with spoiler with an appropriate warning. I think it's okay to mention names like the Dominion or Pah-Wraiths, but please don't discuss any twists and revelations about them without a spoiler warning.

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 11:19 (three years ago) link

I'm in the middle of rewatching the first season, and since I remembered it being as poor in quality as the first TNG season, I've been a bit surprised that there are actually several episodes that are quite good or even classic (besides "Duet", who's classicness is widely accepted). "Past Prologue", the second episode (third episode in Netflix, since they use the production order rather than the airing order) is already very good and touches several of the themes that will become unique to DS9.

OTOH, you also have eps like "Babel", which are okay but feel more like rewritten TNG scripts... Maybe that's why the first season feels so spotty, because it has more TNG-style, continuity-free episodes than the later seasons, where the big plot arcs start to roll.

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 11:27 (three years ago) link

The "weird space phenomenon of the week" type of plots work in TNG, but I don't think DS9 finds its own flavour until it de-emphasizes those in favour of galactic politics and intrigue.

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 11:33 (three years ago) link

I do not accept the classicness of "Duet"!

Pean-Juc Leeecard (Leee), Monday, 14 November 2016 15:18 (three years ago) link

Like, maybe I'm showing my ignorance of WWII history, but I can't imagine that

*SPOILERS*

an accomplice to genocide would be so wracked by guilt that he'd go to such radical lengths to force a war-crimes reckoning -- seemed like precisely the moral corrective that victims of genocide / retrospective capital-H History would fantasize about.

*END SPOILERS*

Pean-Juc Leeecard (Leee), Monday, 14 November 2016 15:25 (three years ago) link

If that episode was in a realistic WWII series, I would tend to agree, but this is Star Trek! It's an allegory, a moral fable, and I think it works very well as such.

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 17:02 (three years ago) link

I mean, one of the main themes of the entire franchise is that our better nature can in the end overcome all the horrible things we've done. I wouldn't want a ST that's cynical in that regard, that's for some other sci-fi series to do.

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 17:06 (three years ago) link

I love watch Jake grow up over the first few seasons. He's so young at the start! Brooks has discussed it before, but he had a real bond with Cirroc Lofton and it really shows as their relationship develops.

Jeff, Monday, 14 November 2016 17:08 (three years ago) link

I wouldn't want a ST that's cynical in that regard, that's for some other sci-fi series to do.

That's what DS9 turns into in the 6th and 7th seasons though, no?

Pean-Juc Leeecard (Leee), Monday, 14 November 2016 17:39 (three years ago) link

Maybe for some stretches, but in the end not really, because...
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(WARNING! SPOILERS FOR DS9'S FINALE WILL FOLLOW!)
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...the whole series ends with the rather optimistic and Star Trekkian idea that the Dominion can be reasoned with, that they can learn to understand solids and eventually change their oppressive ways.

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 21:29 (three years ago) link

I just rewatched the 1st season episode "Battle Lines", and I hadn't realised before that Jonathan Banks (aka Mike from Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul) has a major role in it! He plays the leader of the Ennis, one of the two warring factions the protagonists come across. And he conveys a similar cynical and bitter amusement as he does with Mike, I guess that's really his forte. Perfect casting!

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 21:34 (three years ago) link

Watching the pilot. Sisko explaining the dictionary to dimwitted transcendental beings is hard going.

quis gropes ipsos gropiuses? (ledge), Monday, 14 November 2016 22:23 (three years ago) link

Yeah, I always found that bit tedious too, and it didn't feel very credible either: if the wormhole aliens don't understand certain concepts because of their non-linear existence, how is explaining them with different words gonna help?

That said, the payoff to that scene ("then why do you exist here?) is still pretty great and moving.

Tuomas, Monday, 14 November 2016 22:33 (three years ago) link

idk because language is multivalent and certain words/phrases might get routed differently through the universal translator

mh 😏, Monday, 14 November 2016 22:41 (three years ago) link

Goddamn it I still have to finish my TNG rewatch don't start this thread now :)

Chuck_Tatum, Monday, 14 November 2016 23:04 (three years ago) link

idk because language is multivalent and certain words/phrases might get routed differently through the universal translator

To me that scene felt like the wormhole aliens were communicating to Sisko directly via telepathy, so the universal translator wasn't involved. Presumably the aliens' language is so different from humanoid ones that the UT can't even process it.

Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 November 2016 12:46 (three years ago) link

oh yeah, I forgot all their interactions take place in mental dream time

mh 😏, Tuesday, 15 November 2016 14:54 (three years ago) link

Yeah. Also, for some inexplicable reason the aliens only want to talk to Sisko, while they immediately send Dax away from the wormhole. I guess they're afraid of cooties?

Tuomas, Wednesday, 16 November 2016 07:23 (three years ago) link

Just a couple of episodes in but to my surprise I am enjoying not hating the low budget soap opera feel.

quis gropes ipsos gropiuses? (ledge), Wednesday, 16 November 2016 09:04 (three years ago) link

I think DS9 actually had a reasonably large budget for its era, with the virtue of being a Star Trek show. Certainly most the effects still look pretty good, especially when you compare them to a lower-budget show like Babylon 5, whose CGI would nowadays look crappy even in a budget video game.

Tuomas, Wednesday, 16 November 2016 10:47 (three years ago) link

The big exception I guess is Odo's morphing, which does look silly, but I think those effects were state-of-the-art back then. And you can see budget cuts the show took later on from the fact that in later seasons Odo often doesn't morph even when it would make sense him to do so, or he morphs offscreen.

Tuomas, Wednesday, 16 November 2016 10:49 (three years ago) link

Ok low stakes rather than low budget - Keiko becoming a schoolteacher is hardly JR getting shot. I know, there's plenty of high stakes galactic political intrigue to come.

quis gropes ipsos gropiuses? (ledge), Wednesday, 16 November 2016 13:25 (three years ago) link

Ok, I get what you mean, and I myself like these low stakes stories too. DS9 has a great ensemble cast, and I like how they, unlike TNG, often build the drama on personal interaction and avoid the Weird Space Threat of the Week altogether. Plus the lower stakes make sense considering the stable setting. With the Enterprise, they can sorta justify meeting things that endanger the ship or some random planet every week, because they're constantly on the move, but it'd feel ridiculous if Bajor was constantly under some new, previously unheard of cosmic threat.

Tuomas, Wednesday, 16 November 2016 13:43 (three years ago) link

The low-stakes stories don't happen till much later in the series IMO, because nearly every episode in the first couple season strike me as having an existential threat shoe-horned into it (see that one where Dax is hazing a Trill would-be initiate and accidentally breaks space-time).

Meighton Leeester (Leee), Wednesday, 16 November 2016 18:54 (three years ago) link

I just rewatched "Progress", which is an excellent example of a first season episode with low stakes. (Okay, if Mullibok stays on the moon he will die, but it's obvious they'll beam him up against his will before letting that happen, so the whole point of the episode is really just the moral dilemma his stubborness causes Kira to face.) But you're right that they do become more prominent in later seasons, when the writers are more comfortable in not following the narrative traditions of earlier ST series.

Tuomas, Thursday, 17 November 2016 08:14 (three years ago) link

Trying to do this properly and not skip any but I'm in the middle of the first season slump and things are only going to get worse:

Deep Space Nine is put in jeopardy when the crew's thoughts manifest themselves, and such figures as Rumpelstiltskin appear.

The Federation ambassador from Betazed, Lwaxana Troi, visits the station, and develops an affection for Odo.

Can't I skip them? Pleeease?

quis gropes ipsos gropiuses? (ledge), Monday, 21 November 2016 20:26 (three years ago) link

It's all part of a rich tapestry, ledge

You cld comfortably skip ahead to the first episode w/ the Jem'Hadar, tbh

Darcy Sarto (Ward Fowler), Monday, 21 November 2016 20:38 (three years ago) link

you can skip the rest of the first season except for Progress and Duet imo

i wouldn't skip much in season 2, there's some fun throwaway episodes there

ciderpress, Monday, 21 November 2016 20:46 (three years ago) link

Those are both good episodes! You do have to have a taste for camp, though.

Meighton Leeester (Leee), Monday, 21 November 2016 21:16 (three years ago) link

The Rumpelstiltskin episode is skippable (it's pretty much a TNG style "weird space phenomenon of the week" story with no larger importance), but I wouldn't skip the Lwaxana episode. It ends up subverting our expectations of the character, and Majel Barrett is wonderful while doing that. Plus it has some important character revelations about Odo. The Lwaxana eps in DS9 (there's a couple of more to follow) in general are better than her TNG episodes, because they treat her less like a joke.

And you definitely shouldn't skip to the first Jem'Hadar episode! In the second season the quality of writing gets better, and the opening three-parter has some very important plot development w/r/t Bajoran politics that will resonate right until the end of the series.

Tuomas, Tuesday, 22 November 2016 08:17 (three years ago) link

I wouldn't skip the Lwaxana episode

damnit.

Progress was ok, critical character development for Kira, that guy was a dick though.

The Storyteller prob the worst I've seen so far. Fatuous group psychology + ludicrous deus ex machina.

quis gropes ipsos gropiuses? (ledge), Tuesday, 22 November 2016 13:12 (three years ago) link

Yeah, The Storyteller's A plot is probably the worst in the entire series, except for "Profit and Lace".

Tuomas, Tuesday, 22 November 2016 15:25 (three years ago) link

WARNING! SPOILERS ABOUT "PROGRESS"!
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I love how "Progress" subverts the viewer's expectation of what sort of a story it's gonna be, i.e. your typical "the underdog is always right" tale where were supposed to root for this one stubborn guy and forgot about the utilitarian alternative, and instead it turns into a lesson for Kira that sometimes siding with The Man is the right thing to do.
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Tuomas, Tuesday, 22 November 2016 15:35 (three years ago) link

I love how Quark's life is saved when he bends over to pick up a nickel.

schwantz, Wednesday, 23 November 2016 04:20 (three years ago) link

I do not accept the classicness of "Duet"!

I second that emotion!

quis gropes ipsos gropiuses? (ledge), Monday, 28 November 2016 08:59 (three years ago) link

Can you elaborate?

Tuomas, Monday, 28 November 2016 10:15 (three years ago) link

i like Duet but agree that it is pretty contrived

ciderpress, Monday, 28 November 2016 12:17 (three years ago) link

I like Duet, too. It may be contrived, but it's far and away one of the strongest episodes of the first couple seasons.

I actually had to think about which episode it was, since I always confuse it with Waltz. (Mentally filed under "heavy episodes where two characters square off moralizing against each other.")

Millsner, Monday, 28 November 2016 12:52 (three years ago) link

Contrived and hammy. I liked the camp survivors standing round all dressed in rags to elicit maximum sympathy.

the year of diving languorously (ledge), Monday, 28 November 2016 12:59 (three years ago) link

two weeks pass...

Kira and Dax notwithstanding this show is being hella sexist right now. Sisko and O'Brien land on a planet and find some earth people marooned there for ten years. One guy says 'I used to be an engineer!', another guy says 'who won the soccer?', a woman steps forward and says 'what are the latest fashions?' smdh. And don't get me started on the Ferengi, a bit of light comic relief from a species who oppress their women in the most contemptible fashion.

That episode with the marooned dude was pretty good though, until the final insulting two minutes.

the year of diving languorously (ledge), Wednesday, 14 December 2016 13:34 (three years ago) link

*dudes

the year of diving languorously (ledge), Wednesday, 14 December 2016 13:34 (three years ago) link

trek gotta trek

i enjoyed the 3-parter opening season 2. that evil religious lady is a good villain!

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Wednesday, 14 December 2016 14:47 (three years ago) link

I think the Lwaxana episodes are good curatives to the usual Trek sexism, IIRC.

Bianca Smell BO (Leee), Thursday, 15 December 2016 01:11 (three years ago) link

on the recommendation of the ILE tastemaking consensus and because I am into day five of being sick as a goddamn dog, I've now set my sights on climbing this mountain of a show. Damn but it is a lot of episodes. I'm about 8 deep into S1 and it strikes me as mostly ok trek, if a little boring. I barely remember watching it during it's orginal run, and couldn't have stuck with it for more than part of S1 and a few into S2 or 3. I find it the kind of show I can watch with my eyes closed. As long as I have the dialogue I can fill in the rest. So far I'm liking Quark mostly because he gets picked on way too much. Kira yells 100% of her dialogue and Dax is to date perhaps the most boring trek character ever created. I'm sure I'll see things change. Anyway, I'm in.

great Canadian prog-psych debut from 1969 (Sparkle Motion), Friday, 16 December 2016 01:34 (three years ago) link

Lwaxana episodes are getting better and better, carrying over from TNG (outside that ghastly drowning kid one). it quite enjoyed seeing her paired with Odo, it's kind of a perfect match, and their little adventure together was very endearing and sweet.

AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 16 December 2016 14:49 (three years ago) link

i recall one bad lwaxana episode that was one of the worst of the series but the other couple she's in are fine

ciderpress, Friday, 16 December 2016 14:51 (three years ago) link

11/28/1994. Fascination — A mysterious virus causes the DS9 characters to begin falling in love with each other on sight.

this was the bad one iirc

ciderpress, Friday, 16 December 2016 14:53 (three years ago) link

good god that's going to be a terrible episode on any version of Trek, save the TOS, where it would be hilarious

great Canadian prog-psych debut from 1969 (Sparkle Motion), Friday, 16 December 2016 15:43 (three years ago) link

Kinda surprised if it wasn't used in TOS already, TNG had "The Naked Now" right?

Nhex, Friday, 16 December 2016 18:09 (three years ago) link

I've just seen 'the captain (commander) falls in love with a ghost', that was pretty bad

the year of diving languorously (ledge), Friday, 16 December 2016 20:00 (three years ago) link

maybe the nog ptsd episode managed to wring some pathos out of the otherwise risible vic fontaine thing.

The Pingularity (ledge), Friday, 30 August 2019 17:44 (eleven months ago) link

pic.twitter.com/xe7vaiwIg0

— Charles Windstar (@Cwindstar) September 6, 2019

mookieproof, Friday, 6 September 2019 05:17 (eleven months ago) link

damn, i finished ds9 last night. i definitely felt bereft afterwards.

i know we have people watching rn so i won't spoilerize, but there are many elements of the finale that i was not fully on board with.

Seany's too Dyche to mention (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 10 September 2019 17:18 (eleven months ago) link

was pretty amazed that the penultimate episode was honestly not very good and focused quite a bit on the ferenghis. never change ds9

Seany's too Dyche to mention (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 10 September 2019 17:19 (eleven months ago) link

man I'm so itching to discuss all the aspects of the finale and the whole of the season that i wasn't on board with.

The Pingularity (ledge), Tuesday, 10 September 2019 17:19 (eleven months ago) link

this show is a hundred years old, there can be no spoilers, metaphysically speaking

j., Tuesday, 10 September 2019 17:22 (eleven months ago) link

It is with extreme regret and sadness to announce that my love and best friend, Aron Eisenberg, passed away earlier today.
He was an intelligent, humble, funny, emphatic soul. He sought to live his life with... https://t.co/VbI9X5g1ku

— Malíssa Longo (@Malissa_Longo) September 22, 2019

mookieproof, Sunday, 22 September 2019 05:42 (ten months ago) link

RIP :(

Nhex, Sunday, 22 September 2019 13:08 (ten months ago) link

aww. RIP :(

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, 22 September 2019 15:08 (ten months ago) link

Bummer.

DJI, Sunday, 22 September 2019 15:51 (ten months ago) link

finally finished it

still don't like nog

mookieproof, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 02:18 (ten months ago) link

your heart felt something at the ptsd episode, though. right?

mh, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 02:32 (ten months ago) link

never felt like he was a character dude I could relate to personally due to baggage and different outlooks but the realization, couched in the disconnect that *he* was now the injured one and really figured out what empathy is, meant something

then again, c’mon, you have to lose a leg to realize you’re mortal. ferengi are all libertarian teens

mh, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 02:36 (ten months ago) link

i think i mostly didn’t like him because his actor (rip) seemed to always be yelling? as a character he had a good arc, but weird because even at the end he still looked exactly like the kid he used to be

mookieproof, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 03:29 (ten months ago) link

He still looks exactly the same 75 years later (The Visitor).

The Pingularity (ledge), Tuesday, 24 September 2019 08:33 (ten months ago) link

According to Ira Behr, Marc Alaimo never wavered from his belief that at heart, Dukat was an okay guy. He'd developed his theory during the shooting of the third season episode "Defiant", a landmark show in terms of rendering Dukat a more ambiguous character from a moral standpoint, and despite all that Dukat had done, Alaimo still felt there was good in him. As Behr says, "In Marc's mind, I believe he felt his relationship with Winn was legitimate in some way, and that, in some wacky fashion, it was Dukat's bid for legitimacy. I mean Marc was actually upset when we had him hit Solbor [in "The Changing Face of Evil"]. Until the very end, he wanted Dukat to be the hero of Deep Space Nine.

lol what a weirdo

mookieproof, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 15:00 (ten months ago) link

method acting

mh, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 15:01 (ten months ago) link

anyway, s07 was good. i think the jadzia-to-ezri thing was handled about as well as it possibly could have been. (the ezri's family episode was weak, but that wasn't the character's fault.) her interactions with worf were great. the method of her getting with bashir was annoying -- oh, she's talking about him in her sleep, and then the two of them spend three episodes staring at/avoiding each other like adolescents -- but i don't mind them getting together.

i liked vic fontaine, but it was maybe a little too much. if those episodes had been spread out over multiple seasons than one-plus seasons it might have been better. i was a little disappointed that it was never explained why he was 'more than just a hologram' -- briefly wondered whether he might be a Prophet who was on probation or something.

garak and weyoun were awesome. kai winn was perfect. damar was solid. would join the house of martok. still don't think much of dukat or his actor -- no depth when it was required nor presence when it wasn't.

the section 31 eps were good (and the guy who played sloan was great) except for the final one where . . . miles and julian traipsed through his dying mind? that was goofy af and easily the weakest part of the entire Final Chapter.

the miles-and-julian relationship really became a parody by the end.

weird to see quark reduced to the role of greek chorus in s07, particularly as people went to vic's instead.

sorry for complaining about kira being shrill early on; she ultimately ruled.

i just never really cared about odo. and tbh it's pretty weird that the federation would keep on a security officer who served under the cardassians -- even before he was revealed as one of the Dire Enemies. he and kira getting together was weird but fine, and much less annoying than the seasons spent with odo yearning.

always here for wallace shawn and rom; the rest of the ferengi episodes were . . . fine. whatever. the only episode i skipped in the whole series was the one where quark evidently dresses up as a woman.

the segue from Female Changeling Ordering the Genocide of All Cardassians and Pyrrhic Final Battle > Linking with Odo > Calmly Surrendering and Submitting to Judgment was . . . awfully handy.

the sisko's final fate was, i think, questionable at best. i'm told that originally he just became a prophet and that was it, but that upon reflection avery brooks thought 'having the black guy abandon his family' was a bad look and insisted on sisko promising to return. imo he should have been offered prophetic immortality and turned it down.

v. glad i watched it, even if it took like three years! definitely cared more about the characters than in other treks, although it took longer to do so than might have been ideal. i think it had higher highs than TNG; it might also have had more duds, but that's probably because i skipped the first two seasons of TNG. ultimately they're tough to compare.

mookieproof, Wednesday, 25 September 2019 00:42 (ten months ago) link

and yes nog's progression from gung-ho kid who signs on with the crazy elite cadets > kid who is less gung-ho > maimed and scared veteran is really good and important.

i just find nog's presence annoying. it'd have been better (and more interesting) with jake

mookieproof, Wednesday, 25 September 2019 00:54 (ten months ago) link

if they ever followed up on the Ferengi, I’d most want to know how Rom did as Grand Nagus

mh, Wednesday, 25 September 2019 01:24 (ten months ago) link

Nothing would ever be better and more interesting with Jake

valet doberman (Jon not Jon), Wednesday, 25 September 2019 01:55 (ten months ago) link

My issues with the final season were: enough with the mirror universe and holodeck and stupid Ferengi episodes already! When they were still coming in the second half of the season it *really* felt like they had more important things to be getting on with. Except... the whole Dominion/Cardassian alliance and war ended up being just as tiresome - there was absolutely no sense of the grand scale of it, when most of the time it was just Weyoun and Damar alone in a room looking at screens. The expressionless Breen added absolutely nothing. And as for Sisko, what a fucking disaster. Seven seasons of building up expectations and then - "I know what I have to do! Fly to Bajor in a shuttle and hurl myself off a cliff!"

The last section 31 episode was indeed a dire, a miserable failure of an attempt at a classic mindfuck episode. Hated Vic. The Klingon episodes were good, probably the best part of the whole thing.

Sorry to be so negative. I'd never have agreed that it had higher highs than TNG, but I feel like S7 retroactively poisoned my enjoyment of the whole thing!

The Pingularity (ledge), Wednesday, 25 September 2019 08:04 (ten months ago) link

Ok, Terrence, don’t be nervous, it’s just a walk by. You’re just an extra. You’ve been walking your whole life. This shouldn’t be hard. Just don’t walk like a complete weirdo, distract them, and ruin the scene. Ok. Here we go pic.twitter.com/EMktaqaWb6

— William Mullally 🍯☕️ (@whmullally) October 2, 2019

mookieproof, Wednesday, 2 October 2019 18:49 (ten months ago) link

My issues with the final season were: enough with the mirror universe and holodeck and stupid Ferengi episodes already! When they were still coming in the second half of the season it *really* felt like they had more important things to be getting on with. Except... the whole Dominion/Cardassian alliance and war ended up being just as tiresome - there was absolutely no sense of the grand scale of it, when most of the time it was just Weyoun and Damar alone in a room looking at screens. The expressionless Breen added absolutely nothing. And as for Sisko, what a fucking disaster. Seven seasons of building up expectations and then - "I know what I have to do! Fly to Bajor in a shuttle and hurl myself off a cliff!"

The last section 31 episode was indeed a dire, a miserable failure of an attempt at a classic mindfuck episode. Hated Vic. The Klingon episodes were good, probably the best part of the whole thing.

Sorry to be so negative. I'd never have agreed that it had higher highs than TNG, but I feel like S7 retroactively poisoned my enjoyment of the whole thing!

― The Pingularity (ledge), Wednesday, September 25, 2019 1:04 AM (one week ago)

i basically share most of your criticisms. i like vic tho.

it also felt a little too melancholy to end with that shot of kira and jake looking at the wormhole, thinking about their loved ones that they may never see again.

Seany's too Dyche to mention (jim in vancouver), Wednesday, 2 October 2019 18:53 (ten months ago) link

at work emailing someone with the first name gul and a second name that sounds like a cardassian surname

Seany's too Dyche to mention (jim in vancouver), Thursday, 3 October 2019 16:19 (ten months ago) link

https://s.put.re/36doTBVb.jpeg

Philip Nunez, Thursday, 3 October 2019 18:05 (ten months ago) link

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EGaHMdkWwAAAqpt?format=jpg&name=small

mookieproof, Wednesday, 9 October 2019 15:46 (ten months ago) link

three months pass...

My roommate sent me a “meme” and now I have to sit down pic.twitter.com/Wl8vRRhpwr

— Alex Arrelia (@AlexArrelia) January 12, 2020

que pasa picasso (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 13 January 2020 12:49 (seven months ago) link

Ya, iirc Trek pretty regularly paints this era as basically the Dark Ages.

Pizza is Really Yummy for Me (Old Lunch), Monday, 13 January 2020 12:56 (seven months ago) link

I watched that two-parter not too long ago and it was probably a heavy-handed warning of what could be in the mid-'90s but watching it today I was fairly impressed by their prognostication skills.

Pizza is Really Yummy for Me (Old Lunch), Monday, 13 January 2020 12:59 (seven months ago) link

*marks calendar for four years from now*

The Bell Riots were a pivotal series of events on Earth that took place in September of 2024. Started in San Francisco's Sanctuary District A, they were named after protest leader Gabriel Bell. One of the most violent civil disturbances in all of American history, the riots and subsequent crackdown resulted in the deaths of hundreds of Sanctuary District residents

que pasa picasso (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 13 January 2020 13:00 (seven months ago) link

By the 2020s, the American government – reacting to serious problems of homelessness and unemployment – created special Sanctuary Districts (essentially walled-off sections of the city grid) in most major cities. Unfortunately – while established with the benevolent intent of providing free housing and food, as well as prospects for future employment – the Sanctuaries quickly degenerated into inhumane internment camps for the poor.

this appalling socialism would never fly in the real america of the 2020s

que pasa picasso (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 13 January 2020 13:02 (seven months ago) link

xp. strangely TNG mention that in 2024 irish unification happens.

and that ds9 ep also prognosticates that the neo-trotskyists will soon be in power in france

bidenfan69420 (jim in vancouver), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:46 (seven months ago) link

which, if la france insoumise were more popular, would be kind of accurate maybe?

bidenfan69420 (jim in vancouver), Monday, 13 January 2020 17:47 (seven months ago) link

I could see the sanctuary district thing happening if it gave a huge kickback to the property owners that topped the amount they'd make from redevelopment

babu frik fan account (mh), Monday, 13 January 2020 18:11 (seven months ago) link

Star Trek had a nuclear apocalypse in the late '90s IIRC

Greta Van Show Feets BB (milo z), Tuesday, 14 January 2020 02:21 (six months ago) link

same

que pasa picasso (bizarro gazzara), Tuesday, 14 January 2020 06:47 (six months ago) link

two weeks pass...

i know they shared a lot of writers, but did ds9 pick up a lot of tng staff once it was off the air? would that explain the general uptick in quality with season 4?

j., Friday, 31 January 2020 07:25 (six months ago) link

one month passes...

He Has 17,700 Bottles of Hand Sanitizer and Nowhere to Sell Them pic.twitter.com/PZySdov6Po

— Carta Monir (@CartaMonir) March 14, 2020

mookieproof, Saturday, 14 March 2020 21:54 (four months ago) link

lol, thought that scenario felt familiar. Although I don't remember ever hoping that Quark's would get looted in the wake of a failed scheme.

Unparalleled Elegance (Old Lunch), Saturday, 14 March 2020 22:08 (four months ago) link

three weeks pass...

Anyone complaining that ST: Picard is too slow has not watched this show recently.

justice 4 CCR (Sparkle Motion), Sunday, 5 April 2020 19:21 (four months ago) link

HOW DARE U

terminators of endearment (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, 5 April 2020 19:39 (four months ago) link

this one's mostly episodic though other than like 4 or 5 episodes per season that advance the Plot? its not 'slow' if its executing a complete story every episode imo

i haven't seen picard so maybe that's the same idk

ciderpress, Sunday, 5 April 2020 19:43 (four months ago) link

IDK, because of my love for Trek and my respect for the participants of this thread, and their enthusiasm, I have been trying for a while to get into DS9. I've watched about 2 1/2 seasons over the last couple of years, but have forgotten what took place in most of the episodes so I've been rewatching select eps from S2 & S3 to keep at it. Anyway, I still find most of the characters to be less than compelling. I don't really know what Dax is or does still, Bashir I'm warming to, Quark I like, but everyone with the exception of O'Brien TALKS WAY TOO MUCH. The only person to really own it, and who I'm finally getting into as I'm getting close to the end of S3, is Avery Brooks and his demented, go for broke line readings no matter what the occasion.

By and large, the pace is excruciating, even on the self contained eps. Story arc-wise, I did like the one where the Dominion clowned the Cardassians & Romulans in one fell swoop. That was well written and paced, but it took an entire episode of setup to get there.

Anyway, I have plenty of time to keep at it and see where it goes.

justice 4 CCR (Sparkle Motion), Sunday, 5 April 2020 20:31 (four months ago) link

I don't really know what Dax is or does still

There's behind the scenes stuff that kind of explains Dax's fuzziness, namely that the original scope for the character was to be a mentor figure dripping with gravitas, but Terry Farrell, being relatively new to acting, said she felt she couldn't pull it off, which sent Dax into a limbo until they settled on Action Barbie (her term) and party girl.

My beef with STP isn't its narrative slowness so much as its patchy and flimsy world-building, which is an area in which DS9 is unrivaled among the other Trek properties.

Other things that I love are Sisko and Jake's unbridled affection for each other, Garak, Kira yelling at people.

Triceratops Vowell (Leee), Monday, 6 April 2020 18:18 (four months ago) link

one month passes...

The time-traveling San Francisco episodes are overly too prescient and I hope they're not quite our world. They're much closer than I think the writers ever intended!

mh, Tuesday, 26 May 2020 23:15 (two months ago) link

If Jeff Bezos wants to justify some of his zillions, he should fund the HD-ing of DS9.

Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Wednesday, 27 May 2020 00:58 (two months ago) link

just read (parts of) the 'star trek - the second 25 years' and lol

it's essentially just endless bitching by writers, most of whom were fired, complaining that they 'couldn't tell stories' because of roddenberry or berman or braga or the network. i mean it doesn't even *mention* that two ds9 actors had a baby during the show's run.

the exception is behr, who went ham at the end of ds9 (and will not shut up about it)

berman comes across as a dick, but at least a self-aware and superficially diplomatic one. except for 'it's so difficult to find beautiful young women who can actually act.' maurice hurley didn't even bother with that.

mookieproof, Wednesday, 27 May 2020 01:07 (two months ago) link

also everyone absolutely loves the bakula

mookieproof, Wednesday, 27 May 2020 01:10 (two months ago) link


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