Better Call Saul

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I thought the first episode was pretty good. I'm going to give it eight out of ten

paolo, Monday, 9 February 2015 19:17 (five years ago) link

I'm curious what the dramatic arc of the show is going to be, considering that Walt fucked up a relatively stable criminal ecosystem. Tuco and Gus and Saul were all pretty established and safe in their power. I like the idea of the show as a sort of perverted Matlock, where Saul defends a series of mostly guilty people, but I'm not sure if that's what we're going to get.

polyphonic, Monday, 9 February 2015 19:32 (five years ago) link

I loved the comedy of it all, the way things were filmed fit that style perfectly. But if it becomes more dramatic, I'm not sure I will care.

Frederik B, Monday, 9 February 2015 19:38 (five years ago) link

cold open cinnabon was the best part

johnny crunch, Monday, 9 February 2015 19:51 (five years ago) link

if this were actually good, what a coup . . .

rip van wanko, Monday, 9 February 2015 20:55 (five years ago) link

it's a little goofy that he's doing exactly what he speculated he might be doing in his new life

I don't see this amounting to a hell of a lot but I'll prob enjoy it for a season or so.

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Monday, 9 February 2015 21:31 (five years ago) link

but better call saul's a prequel, right? so that means in the last bit of breaking bad he was referring back to something that he used to do.

Karl Malone, Monday, 9 February 2015 21:34 (five years ago) link

it's not exclusively a prequel. The first thing we see is chronologically after BB

polyphonic, Monday, 9 February 2015 21:35 (five years ago) link

xp haha no, that would be even sillier! "for my expensive new identity I'm just gonna go back to my old job"

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Monday, 9 February 2015 21:38 (five years ago) link

actually no it would make more sense, you're right. But it's a flash forward in BCS

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Monday, 9 February 2015 21:41 (five years ago) link

it's a little goofy that he's doing /exactly/ what he speculated he might be doing in his new life

I like the idea of him being 100% committed to a plan he made in haste. It just fits his character so well!

naus, Monday, 9 February 2015 21:42 (five years ago) link

I still haven't had a chance to watch yet. Tonight!

Karl Malone, Monday, 9 February 2015 21:45 (five years ago) link

Nah, it's silly. He probably couldn't choose, it's just tossed off line he throws off. Too much fan service for my taste. The ending with Tuco annoyed me as well. But inbetween, there was loads of good stuff.

Frederik B, Monday, 9 February 2015 21:46 (five years ago) link

I just took it as a joke/fan service, cause why not? I mean within minutes of starting his first jape he's ended up at __________ (removed for karl)

xp nevermind haha

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Monday, 9 February 2015 21:47 (five years ago) link

"it's a little goofy that he's doing exactly what he speculated he might be doing in his new life"

I kinda took it was a business and ID that Saul had created in case anything got to hot, which it did. If I remember right, the scene when Saul tells Walter about Omaha and the Cinnabon is with "the cleaner" held up in that basement waiting to move on to next step.

earlnash, Monday, 9 February 2015 23:29 (five years ago) link

I didn't even recognize tuco until I saw it mentioned somewhere else. there are bound to be things that this that will happen and I don't see why they shouldn't.

akm, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 05:01 (five years ago) link

Anyone notice the little hat tip to the Wire in the courtroom scene? not sure if it was intentional or not.

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 08:22 (five years ago) link

Two associates of Jimmy coincidentally bumping into Tuco's mother (?) is not something that was 'bound' to happen, at least not on their very first day working together. It's an extremely big contrivance, just as it's a contrivance that Saul could have guessed/known/planned exactly what he would be able to do after the cleaner took over.

But so what, right? Well, for me, it takes the mystery out of the characters. The world of Breaking Bad was filled with mystery and danger at the beginning, but they really really killed that over the years. When Krazy-8 was killed, even crazyer Tuco took his place. When Tuco was killed, those weird cousins were sent to avenge him. And this mysterious guy from Chile who sold chicken seemed also involved somehow. But then the entirety of the cartel was nice enough to gather around and be poisoned by a single bottle of tequila, it turned out Gus was mainly motivated by the murder of his friend years ago, and the shadowy involvement of multinational companies in the drugdistribution? Turned out it was a rogue housewife, but nevermind, she had a bad cup of tea as well.

The whole world became so small and neat over the years, that it damaged my interest in it. And now you can't skate on the streets of Albuquerque without running into the Salamanca-family? How small is this city?

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 08:53 (five years ago) link

eh, i dunno, i don't see it as a problem thus far. so long as it doesn't turn into a 'league of extraordinary gentlemen'-style thing where all they do is give familiar characters walk-on parts. if this is a prequel, i expect to find out how Jimmy becomes Saul, how he meets Mike and why he decides to become a criminal lawyer. Tuco was one of my favourite characters in BB and it' shame he only lasted a handful of episodes, so bringing him back into the frame is a great idea in my book.

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 09:10 (five years ago) link

tuco's gun is comically large

Clay, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 09:20 (five years ago) link

that's what she... oh never mind

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 10:05 (five years ago) link

Lydia wasn't a "rogue housewife"

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 10:42 (five years ago) link

yeah, this was pretty good. i really liked that there wasn't much expository dialogue - the characters' interactions were enough to fill in the blanks.

i wonder if the black and white photography in the omaha sequence was a deliberate homage to / joke about alexander payne's nebraska?

bizarro gazzara, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 10:44 (five years ago) link

were the flash forwarded sequences in BB b/w?

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 10:49 (five years ago) link

Did 'Chuck' ever get mentioned in BB? I take it he's Jimmy's brother? Or uncle?

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 10:50 (five years ago) link

So glad this isn't just a knockabout sitcom about a hapless lawyer though. I was always a Saul agnostic when he was in BB as he stood right on the edge between comic foil and slapstick sitcom buffoon. Plus it took me ages to stop thinking of him as Gob in Arrested Development, but as a lawyer instead of a magician. I like how Jimmy cuts a bittersweet, really quite dualised and tragic figure. One minute he's walking around in his suit, acting as though he owns the place; next he's returning home to an absolute hovel after having been talked down to and kicked in the nuts by life... It continues the double-act of WW/Heisenberg in that respect.

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 11:07 (five years ago) link

i might be out on this already, the tone just feels off to me; I bet there will be some inspired stuff but not sure I want to invest ~14 hrs or w/e

johnny crunch, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:10 (five years ago) link

There will be loads of bb characters in this. Of course as Saul goodman he'll have good reason to come up against every scumbag in Albuquerque, and cops too

I mean, this is a breaking bad spinoff about Walter White's wacky lawyer; its very existence is fan service, however much prestigey ~darkness~ they inject into it.

I'm down cause I thought odenkirk was brilliant in bb

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:15 (five years ago) link

i loved the cold open so much

gr8080, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:35 (five years ago) link

I enjoyed this a fair bit, just because Saul is a great character and it's good to spend more time with him. Wish the Tuco reveal hadn't come so early, because it's a fairly short line from him to Gus Fring, and really if this show is going to succeed on its own terms it needs to take time to do a Frasier and build its own universe of characters. The scenes with Chuck suggested that's in the plan, even if he felt miscast - I struggled to see him and Saul as actually related.

It's also showing us at least two Walter White-style descents into the underworld, and I love seeing people way way over their heads.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:40 (five years ago) link

Like I think a constant parade of "hey look, it's Badger!" gratuitous fanwank would be the worst approach they could take and I more or less trust Gilligan not to take that road.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:41 (five years ago) link

No they'll be careful not to make it constant I think

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:58 (five years ago) link

yeah i think i trust this team enough now not to make it shit

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:07 (five years ago) link

When you look at Odenkirk's career between his inspired turn as Stevie Grant in The Larry Sanders Show and his BB turn as Saul it is quite depressing, a lost decade and a half of mediocre writing credits and various atrocious comedy-fail shite. I think this being his stand alone big shot and Gilligan's nerviness at following up such a big hit might be something to do with the rocky start this series has made. I hope it gets better cos I always liked Odenkirk, but so far it all feels a bit stilted and predictable.

xelab, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:09 (five years ago) link

nah...

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:16 (five years ago) link

don't think i'd heard of odenkirk before BB though.

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:17 (five years ago) link

i think the broken windshield was a nice level of fan service callback

young pc thug (Merdeyeux), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:31 (five years ago) link

haha, what's that?

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:33 (five years ago) link

i.e. that walt's windshield was constantly broken and now we've had another two broken windshields already, the breaking bad universe is much like our universe but with way more broken windshields

young pc thug (Merdeyeux), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:34 (five years ago) link

xposts

Odenkirk did Mr Show between Sanders and Breaking Bad! And he was in Nebraska after BB, which was nominated for a Palme D'Or and a half-dozen Oscars. He will be fine if this tanks.

Brio2, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:40 (five years ago) link

and fargo

oi listen mate, shut up (dog latin), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:44 (five years ago) link

Comedy-fail dross and an appearance in a Payneful, overrated movie might pay the bills but fronting your own series is a different matter and Fargo is also post BB.

xelab, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:47 (five years ago) link

Yeah, Odenkirk hasn't had the best luck making movies of his own but he's otherwise had a pretty solid (if generally low-key) career and a vast comedic community that rightfully respects the shit out of him. Plus he brought Tim & Eric into our hearts and homes. He's gonna do just fine.

Brodozer Coke Buffet (Old Lunch), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:48 (five years ago) link

Mr. Show = 'comedy-fail dross'. Okay.

Brodozer Coke Buffet (Old Lunch), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:50 (five years ago) link

ok whatever your assessment of his career or talents are - he understands the risks of Better Call Saul, he'll be fine if it doesn't work out, and it's not "his stand alone big shot".

The NYT interview seems totally level-headed:


“I was worried about what it would do to my family and worried about whether I would end up being the guy who” — um, screwed up — “the legacy of ‘Breaking Bad.’ ”

“And then I talked to my daughter, who is 13 and incredibly mature, she said, ‘It’s a big opportunity, we will be fine, and if it’s bad, really, how bad could it be?’ ”

“And I said well, it won’t be bad. It’s written by Vince Gilligan and Peter Gould; the worst thing is it’s a really interesting misfire. If that’s the worst thing it is, I’d be more than happy to be part of that.”

Brio2, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 14:59 (five years ago) link

There's a scene in Ep 1 at a security checkpoint where the guard waves the metal detector near a guy's privates and it goes off...the fact that McKean is in the cast made me think this was a homage to Spinal Tap

calstars, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 15:12 (five years ago) link

i loved the cold open so much

― gr8080, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:35 (2 hours ago) Permalink

Me too!

Punny Names (latebloomer), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 16:19 (five years ago) link

AAAAAAAAAAAA

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 17:51 (five years ago) link

That was some nasty comedy, it's rare I genuinely lol while cowering

k3ller of sh1p (wins), Tuesday, 10 February 2015 17:54 (five years ago) link

The second half was quite okay.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 18:38 (five years ago) link

I had the same thought re the relative lightness of this ep and how needed it was

felt jute gyte delete later (wins), Wednesday, 18 March 2020 12:24 (one week ago) link

the only really dark turn was Jimmy explaining that he'd done all of the normal tricks and they were entering a different phase, only for Kim to immediately jump on board

I feel like there's this balance right now where he and Kim are going to end up pushing each other closer to the edge

mh, Wednesday, 18 March 2020 14:09 (one week ago) link

Oh yeah, egging each other on in mutual bottle-throwing is not a path that ends anywhere good I fear. I love that they’ve gone this way with Kim and it isn’t merely jimmy dragging her unwilling into his bullshit

So I guess mike hooks up with gus out of count of Monte cristo game recognise game. Also I can’t remember how long he’s lived in New Mexico but I would have expected him to have at least a little Spanish - then again he doesn’t talk to that many people

felt jute gyte delete later (wins), Wednesday, 18 March 2020 14:20 (one week ago) link

The fall of Slippin' Kimmy is going to be so painful. This is the best tv show ever invented.

Miami weisse (WmC), Wednesday, 18 March 2020 14:34 (one week ago) link

Agreed. I'm scared that the last time we see her is going to be in a dark alley where she's just handing goons envelopes of cash to go break someone's legs. Well, maybe not that bad, but you get the picture

mh, Wednesday, 18 March 2020 14:43 (one week ago) link

Getting bored of the Acker storyline tbh. I couldn't give a fuck whether the old bastard gets kicked out of his house or not

paolo, Saturday, 21 March 2020 11:12 (one week ago) link

Then think of it as the Kim storyline, since it is.

Miami weisse (WmC), Saturday, 21 March 2020 13:32 (one week ago) link

Is it me or was that last episode really boring?

Saxophone Of Futility (Michael B), Saturday, 21 March 2020 16:48 (one week ago) link

It was you.

This storyline isn’t about Acker, it’s about Kim’s self-destructiveness, her frustration, and her moral compass

Οὖτις, Saturday, 21 March 2020 16:57 (one week ago) link

it was boring

So who was Max? Did I miss something?

akm, Saturday, 21 March 2020 17:16 (one week ago) link

yeah that escaped me also, so many details lost over the seasons

Webcam Du Bois (Hadrian VIII), Saturday, 21 March 2020 17:19 (one week ago) link

https://breakingbad.fandom.com/wiki/Max_Arciniega

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Saturday, 21 March 2020 17:32 (one week ago) link

my presumption is that they were a couple prior to Salamanca murdering him; the internets generally agree but it's open to interpretation

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Saturday, 21 March 2020 17:34 (one week ago) link

ah, thanks, never would have dug that one out

I should watch this show w/ the wiki open

Webcam Du Bois (Hadrian VIII), Saturday, 21 March 2020 18:22 (one week ago) link

yeah that was my interpretation too

terminators of endearment (VegemiteGrrl), Saturday, 21 March 2020 18:24 (one week ago) link

it explains the deeeeeep need for revenge & the way the Salamancas have always treated Fring

terminators of endearment (VegemiteGrrl), Saturday, 21 March 2020 18:25 (one week ago) link

Somebody, I think Lalo, referred to Fring with a homophobic slur and referred to Max's murder earlier this season. They're laying out there for the attentive viewer.

Miami weisse (WmC), Saturday, 21 March 2020 18:40 (one week ago) link

Which would make Gale Boetticher on Breaking Bad kind of an echo of Max? (Gus also paid for his education, I think...or least he said something about a scholarship when he tried to explain their relationship to Hank.)

clemenza, Saturday, 21 March 2020 18:54 (one week ago) link

yep

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Saturday, 21 March 2020 19:52 (one week ago) link

I never suspected a sexual relationship between gus and gale tbh

Οὖτις, Sunday, 22 March 2020 00:04 (one week ago) link

yes me neither

terminators of endearment (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, 22 March 2020 00:58 (one week ago) link

i dont get that vibe from them at all

terminators of endearment (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, 22 March 2020 00:59 (one week ago) link

Between gus and max otoh, definitely

Οὖτις, Sunday, 22 March 2020 01:06 (one week ago) link

def

terminators of endearment (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, 22 March 2020 03:58 (one week ago) link

Even if there wasn't a sexual relationship--and I don't rule it out (Gale was gay, right?)--Gus still may have viewed Gale as some kind of stand-in for Max...Or maybe it was more of a father-son relationship. There seemed to be something there in the way Gus treated Gale (conceding he did cut him loose at one point).

clemenza, Sunday, 22 March 2020 04:06 (one week ago) link

So I guess mike hooks up with gus out of count of Monte cristo game recognise game.

Kind of amazing that you referred to it this way, because the actor who played Mike's doctor also played Luigi Vampa, the captain of the ship that rescued Edmond Dantes (played by Jim Caveziel) after he escaped from the Chateau D'If in 2002's The Count of Monte Cristo!

TrumpPence a Bag (B.L.A.M.), Monday, 23 March 2020 02:59 (six days ago) link

A reminder to myself that this is on tonight (almost forgot last week). "Wexler vs. Goodman"--major turning point? Too soon if there's still a season-and-a-half.

clemenza, Monday, 23 March 2020 13:04 (six days ago) link

not if Better Call Saul

Dollarmite Is My Name (sic), Monday, 23 March 2020 18:04 (six days ago) link

Haven't been as big on the recent episodes as some of the rest of you, but that one was excellent. Great opening, great closing, and the shot just before the commercial break of Kim walking in to help Jimmy clean up the commercial shoot was a great MacGuffin (unless it wasn't). Trying to stay vague.

clemenza, Tuesday, 24 March 2020 02:14 (five days ago) link

I actually didn't get what Jimmy was up to till he explained at the end. Rotten, but it made perfect sense.

clemenza, Tuesday, 24 March 2020 04:34 (five days ago) link

Just read the Rolling Stone recap. I took absent-minded notice of the song Jimmy was strumming on his guitar but forgot the significance of it, especially at that particular moment.

clemenza, Tuesday, 24 March 2020 12:31 (five days ago) link

Not sure what Kim was thinking at the end there

paolo, Tuesday, 24 March 2020 21:34 (five days ago) link

she's only human and... god, we do stupid things for love

plus, spousal privilege

absolute idiot liar uneducated person (mh), Tuesday, 24 March 2020 21:49 (five days ago) link

otm I was thinking we might get a legal justification next week but mainly she loves jimmy so “what is she thinking” is the exact point and beside it

felt jute gyte delete later (wins), Tuesday, 24 March 2020 21:54 (five days ago) link

he's doing exactly what he's always done, and said he'd do, and it's heartbreaking

absolute idiot liar uneducated person (mh), Tuesday, 24 March 2020 21:57 (five days ago) link

I could use a better memory--I find it so hard to retain details from previous seasons. Clearly Nacho and Mike have a lot of history. None of which I remember now.

clemenza, Tuesday, 24 March 2020 22:08 (five days ago) link

lol

Speaking of that plotline, lalo is clearly about to call his new hotshot lawyer so things are about to get complicated for jimmy/saul, also lalo is still in play in breaking bad and it doesn’t feel like the timelines are near joining up yet

felt jute gyte delete later (wins), Tuesday, 24 March 2020 22:20 (five days ago) link

So we’re still about four years from the start of Breaking Bad. Plenty of time for Jimmy to ruin Kim’s life over the next two seasons and still be an established success & singleton by the time he first appeared

― Fantastic. Great move. Well done (sic), Wednesday, February 26, 2020 6:37 AM (four weeks ago)

Dollarmite Is My Name (sic), Wednesday, 25 March 2020 06:11 (four days ago) link

Noticed Saul and Gus were wearing pretty much the exact same blazer.

nashwan, Wednesday, 25 March 2020 09:27 (four days ago) link

I have enjoyed this season so far (with some reservations), but this last episode was bad. I am an attorney and for the most part have found the show's legal elements to be decent, at least compared to most television shows. It actually showed grunt attorneys doing document production! But Jimmy's entire scam and the way Mesa Verde just says, "we love Kim so much we'll let her boyfriend sue us" is some of the dumbest shit ever.

Why, I would make a fantastic Nero! (PBKR), Wednesday, 25 March 2020 11:37 (four days ago) link

I'm not an attorney but felt the same way.

As for the ending, yes, the human heart is complex and we contain multitudes etc. but to spend so much time across so many episodes engineering this eviction plotline in the service of the Kim-Saul dynamic, and then just blow up all of those details in the last five seconds on a mysterious (and to me unconvincing) whim of the heart was to me a letdown.

Most any other actress in this role couldn't care Kim's complexity across a single season of this show, but I'm starting to feel like they're making Rhea Seehorn run in circles for no good reason. Like, yes, we *know* already that Jimmy is a corrupting influence and she'd be better off w/o him but damnit just can't seem to let the rascal go, etc. This plotline is starting to feel to me like in GoT when they just had those kids wandering around in the snow for five years.

Webcam Du Bois (Hadrian VIII), Wednesday, 25 March 2020 14:10 (four days ago) link

the opening shot with Kim not getting in the car with her alcoholic mom, who is lying to her, is meant to mirror the ending imo

absolute idiot liar uneducated person (mh), Wednesday, 25 March 2020 17:04 (four days ago) link

Jimmy's like an alcoholic for hijinks

absolute idiot liar uneducated person (mh), Wednesday, 25 March 2020 17:04 (four days ago) link

Was it Rhea in some kind of prosthetics playing Kim's mum? Her voice was indentical.

chap, Wednesday, 25 March 2020 17:31 (four days ago) link

No--the Rolling Stone piece thought so too.

clemenza, Wednesday, 25 March 2020 17:32 (four days ago) link

Ha yes the casting of Kim's mother was so good I thought they may be related IRL

nashwan, Wednesday, 25 March 2020 17:35 (four days ago) link

I disagree with posts above about weakness/unmotivated nature of plotting. I think it's pretty obvious that this is Kim doubling down in a desperate attempt to get Jimmy to reform. The Mesa Verde plot is there to illuminate their relationship, and to show how both of them respond to escalating stakes with more and more addictive behaviors. Not unlike Adam Sandler in UNCUT GEMS. She has just as bad a gambling problem as he does, in fact he brings it out of her and makes it worse. In this sense you need the Mesa Verde to move Kim inexorably down her trajectory. She's not running in circles at all.

drew in baltimore, Wednesday, 25 March 2020 17:35 (four days ago) link

The two posts this morning did give me pause about the latest episode--"Yeah, they sure did buckle to such a slapdash, borderline ridiculous threat." I think I just mostly check credulity at the door with not just this show but other TV shows I enjoy. (I like Ozark, which is preposterous.) There was the roadside lineup for cell phones and legal advice earlier...I just go with it.

clemenza, Wednesday, 25 March 2020 17:41 (four days ago) link

i thought they dubbed Seehorn's voice as the mother.

akm, Thursday, 26 March 2020 14:56 (three days ago) link

I'm re-watching from the start so not keeping up with this thread. Just up to the s4 episode where they make all the provisions for the German lads to be isolated inside for 8-10 months. Such foresight!

kinder, Thursday, 26 March 2020 22:01 (three days ago) link


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