'Children of Men', the new Alfonso Cuaron sci-fi flick

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-the Happy Gilmore ending
-the Boogie Nights ending

― Ned Raggett, Sunday, 25 March 2007 15:22 (nineteen years ago)

loved owen moving through london -- horseguards on the mall and everything, a kind of inner-london zone which is deaf to everything outside it.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 25 March 2007 15:25 (nineteen years ago)

I saw this myself last week, and I'd broadly side with the consensus, i.e. great. The Bexhill battle is one of the most terrifying, visceral, apocalyptic sequences in film (up there with the Bourne Supremacy car-chase). :-D

the Open Water ending, anyone?

― unfished business, Sunday, 25 March 2007 15:27 (nineteen years ago)

oh, xpost: the bit with King Crimson? Yeah, that ruled.

― unfished business, Sunday, 25 March 2007 15:28 (nineteen years ago)

zizek points out the link between this and 'and your mama too' -- cuaron's niftiness with foreground/background relations. the background of this one is something you look out for more, i guess -- reminded me most of 'the manchurian candidate '04' though this was much better -- but something similar was going on in 'and your mama'. iirc the v/o prompts us to think about the wider world round these two rich guys or whatever.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 25 March 2007 15:37 (nineteen years ago)

Watched it again last night. The amount of obviously expository dialogue stuck out seemed even more flagrant, but now that I knew what would happen I could focus on just how OMG the long takes are. There's some stuff about the doggicam et al on the US DVD but I wish there was more.

Something else that really stuck out the second time was how ridiculously long it takes Clive to show any sign of having a bullet in his gut. I know he's trying to be chivalrous, but if he was shot by Chiwetel Ejiofor (which is when I assumed he got hit), I think he would have started making a mess long before he was sitting in the boat. How could he get down all those stairs without some serious wincing and a scream or three? I've never been shot in the gut, though. Maybe you can play it cool, take long walks, etc.

I wish it had ended with Clive showing her how to hold the baby while they were sitting in the boat. I think it provides enough thematic closure, without the obviousness of him getting an extended death sequence and greenpeace arriving.

― da croupier, Sunday, 25 March 2007 16:45 (nineteen years ago)

but Clive Owen does the extended death sequences so well!

"D'you ever get the headaches?"

― unfished business, Sunday, 25 March 2007 16:51 (nineteen years ago)

I know. He could have at least stressed the importance of supporting the baby's head before kicking off.

― Beth Parker, Sunday, 25 March 2007 19:49 (nineteen years ago)

Maybe I'm misreading you, but it sounds like you think I'm saying they should have added Clive giving babyhandling advice. The advice is already in the scene, I'm just saying they should have stopped right after.

― da croupier, Sunday, 25 March 2007 20:24 (nineteen years ago)

The foot thing would have done more for me if I hadn't already seen it in Die Hard.

― da croupier, Sunday, 25 March 2007 20:25 (nineteen years ago)

Oh sorry. The Alzheimer's.

― Beth Parker, Sunday, 25 March 2007 21:35 (nineteen years ago)

It was time to rent some DVDs and this one was among the new arrivals at the video store I stopped in last night.

One thing I noticed were all the different distinctive spaces, sanctuaries of various sorts. Much of the time spent travelling is spent moving from one sanctuary/safe-house/secured space (or relatively secured space) to another. Jasper's hideaway, full of records of the past, music (was there vinyl? I forget), books, art, etc. is in a way like the art ark (or whatever it was called). Later in the film, there is that Eastern Orthodox dwelling with the icons and old framed photographs.

Kee's character develops incredibly rapdily, from an unappealingly hostile refugee who seems ungrateful for what people are doing for her, to someone who is laughing along with everyone else in the car before the ambush has even occurred.

I liked it a lot. I agree with some people above about some weak points, but have nothing to add about that.

― Rockist Scientist, Thursday, 5 April 2007 15:39 (nineteen years ago)

I was relieved it didn't end with Kee just floating out there without anything showing up, which I guess shows that I am secretly an optimist (since the arrival of the ship leaves me hopeful, even though it's also clearly very open-ended just how things will play out past that point, who/what the Human Project is, etc.).

― Rockist Scientist, Thursday, 5 April 2007 15:44 (nineteen years ago)

zizek points out the link between this and 'and your mama too' -- cuaron's niftiness with foreground/background relations.

If only Mama had had as high a body count.

― Dr Morbius, Thursday, 5 April 2007 15:47 (nineteen years ago)

i watched this for the second time last night. I noticed the dialogue stuff da croupier mentioned too. But aside from that it was every bit as great as the first time I saw it.

― The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall, Thursday, 5 April 2007 16:23 (nineteen years ago)

And there was a part of me expecting that boat to not show up at the end.

― The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall, Thursday, 5 April 2007 16:23 (nineteen years ago)

Saw this in theater, so motherfucking good. We caught the latest show, and on the just-after-midnight drive home through the city, the girl I was with started freaking out a bit, "I can't see any children, Nick, I need to see some damn children." We put Nickelodeon on as soon as we got home just to calm down.

My favorite part of any post-apocalyptic tale is the ephemera (posters, commercials, etc.) and it does not disappoint.

― en i see kay, Thursday, 5 April 2007 16:25 (nineteen years ago)

After hearing how great this was for so long, I was disappointed by it when I finally saw it. The bleakness is too unrelenting and even laughable in some places. The one shot where I realised I'd had enough is where the car is driving through the countryside; the camera pans along a field and there we see a dead fox and two outflow pipes gushing out yellowy, gungy water. It's like Cuaron couldn't stand to have a single moment where the misery isn't stamped down on our heads. The cynisism wore me out.
The script was really patchy in places as well. Especially all the scenes in Michael Caine's gaff. Surprisingly really clunky.

Many of the scenes were really impressive but the film's impossible to love and I can't imagine wanting to revisit it any time soon.

― DavidM, Thursday, 5 April 2007 16:27 (nineteen years ago)

"impossible to love" is surely disproven by, among other things, this very thread!

― Tracer Hand, Thursday, 5 April 2007 16:46 (nineteen years ago)

I was just reading an interview with Cuaron (actually a full-page NYTMag advertisement for the DVD cleverly designed as an "interview") in which he gives the obvious rationale for packing in the background detail -- pretty clearly less "bash you over the head with bleakness" and more "replace all expository blahblahblah with background / scenic detail that gets the job done." There is rather a lot of that, though, granted. Which was his ad-copy sales pitch for the DVD: "We put in so much detail! You can watch it over and over and things will keep popping out!"

― nabisco, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:07 (nineteen years ago)

Has anyone watched that DVD extra that seems to have nothing to do with the movie, but it nothing more than environmental hysteria and specious claims from doomsday nutters? That bugged the shit out of me. What is it doing on the DVD?

― kenan, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:18 (nineteen years ago)

I couldn't make it through that, not because it was specious necessarily but I sure wasn't in the mood. I skipped to how they filmed that awesome shit in the car.

― Jordan, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:21 (nineteen years ago)

impossible to love except by everyone who has seen it

― and what, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:42 (nineteen years ago)

http://www.bigshotmag.com/images/kp.jpg
(l - r) loved it, thought it "okay"

― nabisco, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:44 (nineteen years ago)

That's not so much funny, I just happened to be looking at pictures of Kid 'n Play and wanted an excuse to share.

― nabisco, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:50 (nineteen years ago)

If anything, I thought that considering the state of collapse the world was supposedly in, it looked pretty good. There were still some nice trees and pleasant book-lined livingrooms, and so on.

― Rockist Scientist, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:53 (nineteen years ago)

Nabsico, if you too are posting random images, all is lost.

― Rockist Scientist, Thursday, 5 April 2007 17:54 (nineteen years ago)

Finally saw this yesterday. Thought it was great. I liked all the pets, too.

Really reminded me of Half Life 2, of all things, in terms of run-down/post-apoc european fascistic society where people can't have kids and rebels stage a violent uprising and video screens everywhere.

― kingfish, Monday, 9 April 2007 19:11 (nineteen years ago)

kingfish OTM. i totally also thought of HL2.

― Will M., Monday, 9 April 2007 19:12 (nineteen years ago)

Also, what also reminded me of HL2 was that both worlds had world- and plot-specific grafitti, which, in the game at least, really helped with the immersion. It gave me the feeling that this was an actual world w/ actual people trying to express a culture of trying to figure out wtf was going on.

― kingfish, Monday, 9 April 2007 19:39 (nineteen years ago)

Lack of children, running gun battles in the street, overbearing police/combine, desolated countryside areas, refugees flooding to cramped places, MIT grad... oh wait, that was only HL2 ¬_¬

― james, Monday, 9 April 2007 19:51 (nineteen years ago)

Nabsico, if you too are posting random images, all is lost.

no, nabisco is noise
it will all be fine

― rrrobyn, Monday, 9 April 2007 19:57 (nineteen years ago)

I just saw this today, and loved it, despite having the book in the back of my mind. The one thing that disappointed me about the adaptation (and there were a fuckload of changes, most of the second half, most for the better) was the circumstances of his son's death.

Instead of dying naturally, the kid dies as a toddler when Theo inadvertedly reverses over him in the car, and he's been tormented by it ever since. That might not have worked in the film because they conflated the ex-wife with Julian and (I think) made up the Kee character and the whole immigrant subplot. Essentially the kid is born in the woods and the first half hour is pretty much the whole book.

I haven't read this whole thread, but what was the deal with the kid taking his pills at Theo's brothers table?

― Matt DC, Wednesday, 11 April 2007 21:58 (nineteen years ago)

It was Theo's cousin wasn't it? I figured the kid was just his son who was suffering from some kind of intense psychological malaise - being a member of the last generation on earth and all that.

― chap, Wednesday, 11 April 2007 23:14 (nineteen years ago)

I'm reading the book right now and to be honest I don't see much similarity at all. I don't think the circumstances in the movie work if Theo's unintentionally killed the daughter though.

― Alex in SF, Wednesday, 11 April 2007 23:24 (nineteen years ago)

"I was just reading an interview with Cuaron (actually a full-page NYTMag advertisement for the DVD cleverly designed as an "interview") in which he gives the obvious rationale for packing in the background detail -- pretty clearly less "bash you over the head with bleakness" and more "replace all expository blahblahblah with background / scenic detail that gets the job done." There is rather a lot of that, though, granted. Which was his ad-copy sales pitch for the DVD: "We put in so much detail! You can watch it over and over and things will keep popping out!"

-- nabisco, Thursday, April 5, 2007 8:07 PM (1 week ago)"

blood diamonds to you if you can tell me where to find this (or a similar quote about the dvd)!

― That one guy that quit, Friday, 13 April 2007 16:50 (nineteen years ago)

Oh come on it wasn't THAT good really was it? I liked it but the way a lot of ILX people slate some perfectly decent films, I'm surprised by the unanimity on this thread.

Just saw it (on a telly, not on the big screen admittedly) and it was alright. Some big plot holes - (if the population is going down, why be so volatile towards illegal immigrants? why go to project whatsit instead of staying with the fishes?). and the ending was dumpcakes. the lead character wasn't as good as people say, in fact he delivered his lines pretty rubbishly towards the beginning of the film.

i did like the bit in bexhill (the blood on the lens!) and the ambush on bikes (which is weird - i usually hate long action sequences). I don't know if I'd bother watching it again any time soon. Silent Hill was better.

― the next grozart, Monday, 23 April 2007 00:30 (nineteen years ago)

As someone who probably falls on the slating side more often than not, I was happy to be in the outspoken majority on this one.

― Eric H., Monday, 23 April 2007 00:45 (nineteen years ago)

i did like the bit in bexhill (the blood on the lens!)

That shot was so looong. And awesome.

― Drooone, Monday, 23 April 2007 00:47 (nineteen years ago)

I think the reason they can treat illegal immigrants so badly is that England is basically the only place in the world that hasn't collapsed, so people will still be trying to go there no matter how badly they're treated. Maybe I'm misunderstanding your question though.

I don't really understand why Kee doesn't stay with the fishes but I think they do address it--there's a lot of detail in the movie and it's hard to catch everything. One reason I can think of is that Julianne Moore told her to only trust Clive Owen, and the fishes were going to kill him.

― 31g, Monday, 23 April 2007 00:50 (nineteen years ago)

Also, the comparison to Half-Life 2 upthread is totally otm, that was exactly what I thought of when the bexhill scene was over and those jets flew over the boat. That scene really does feel like a first person shooter at times--I guess it's partly due to the very long single take.

― 31g, Monday, 23 April 2007 00:55 (nineteen years ago)

if the population is going down, why be so volatile towards illegal immigrants? why go to project whatsit instead of staying with the fishes?

I don't think either of these questions make sense. The UK is one of the last places on Earth to succumb to all-out anarchy, which is why everyone is going there and exactly why they're trying to keep everyone out; the government is afraid that the influx of immigrants will upset the fragile balance they have that's keeping their society together. The Fishes don't have any medical training whatsoevere as far as I can remember, plus they stated rather explicitly that they wanted to use the baby as a political rallying point several times before the ambush and death of the Julianne Moore character, so exactly why would Kee want to stay with them?

― HI DERE, Monday, 23 April 2007 01:46 (nineteen years ago)

Plus they betrayed and killed one of two people in the world Kee seems to have trusted and liked.

This is one of those rare films that I actually find very difficult not to watch on a regular basis, as I feel semi-guilty for not spending my time watching other things. Though I'm always happy when a friend hasn't seen it yet, as that's a justifiable excuse for watching it again.

― Gukbe, Monday, 23 April 2007 02:04 (nineteen years ago)

Finally saw this. Half-Life 2 comparisons seconded, and also Adam is totally OTM with "It's everything V for Vendetta promised and failed to deliver". Really good. Shame I didn't see it on a big screen, I might have jizzed myself like I did for Sunshine.

However everyone who says the midwife speech was unnecessary - when she said "I was in the John Radcliffe" I was all "DUDE THAT'S WHERE I WAS BORN!1!1!!!1!!!"

― ledge, Monday, 23 April 2007 10:03 (nineteen years ago)

maybe i do need to watch this again. or maybe it's just not my thing. i'm really surprised by how many people liked this on ilx - maybe even more unanimous than spirited away? i preferred v for vendetta tbh.

― the next grozart, Monday, 23 April 2007 10:09 (nineteen years ago)

I saw it on DVD, and though I think it would have been better on the big screen, I still found plenty to like. In the pantheon of atmospheric, dystopian sci-fi noir action films, it probably ranks somewhere below "Brazil" and "Blade Runner", but still better than most of that genre.

― o. nate, Monday, 23 April 2007 15:25 (nineteen years ago)

julianne moore is hardly in it but her manage to make a lot out of it. can't believe the criticism upthread of owen's response to her death.

― That one guy that quit, Monday, 23 April 2007 16:35 (nineteen years ago)

Wow, this film is overrated like crazy on here, especially considering how awfully clunky the script is. It's catnip for cynics I spose.

― DavidM, Monday, 23 April 2007 18:42 (nineteen years ago)

It's catnip for cynics I spose.

I don't understand this. If anything, the movie has a sweetness at its heart.

Nothing else new to add, just another voice loudly in favour of this film. Oh, and I also thought of Half Life 2.

― Lostandfound, Monday, 23 April 2007 19:22 (nineteen years ago)

'cynics' = anyone noticing the world is going to shit. Is DavidM Armond White?

― Dr Morbius, Monday, 23 April 2007 19:24 (nineteen years ago)

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