US Politics, July 2024 - "Will you just drop out, man?"

True. The guy does seem to have gotten less “handsy” in recent years

Anne Applebaum advocated for treating Palestinian journalists as enemy combatants. I don’t really care what she says about US politics.

What did she suggest be done to them, aside from looking at them askance?

As oppposed to Biden politely asking that not TOO many Palestinian kids get murdered?

BIDEN: The only person on this stage that is a convicted felon is the man I’m looking at right now. And the fact of the matter is he is – what he’s telling you is simply not true.

The fact is that there was no effort on his part to stop what was going on up on Capitol Hill. And all those people, every one of those who were convicted, deserves to be convicted. The idea that they didn’t kill somebody, just went in and broke down doors, broke the windows, occupied offices, turned over desks, turned them over, statues – the idea that those people are patriots? Come on.

When I asked him, the first of two debates we had – debates we had the first time around, I said, will you denounce the Proud Boys? He said, no, I’ll tell them to stand by. The idea he’s refusing – will you denounce these guys? Will you denounce the people we’re talking about now? Will you denounce the people who attacked that Capitol? What are you going to do?

https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/27/politics/read-biden-trump-debate-rush-transcript/index.html

BIDEN: The idea that I did anything wrong relative to what you’re talking about is outrageous. It’s simply a lie, number one.

Number two, the idea that you have a right to seek retribution against any American just because you’re a president is wrong, is simply wrong. No president’s ever spoken like that before. No president in our history has spoken like that before.

Number three, the crimes that you are still charged with – and think of all the civil penalties you have. How many billions of dollars do you owe in civil penalties for molesting a woman in public, for doing a whole range of things, of having sex with a porn star on the night – and – while your wife was pregnant?

I mean, what are you talking about? You have the morals of an alley cat.

I still hate how they both insult Stormy Daniels. Appearing in sexual films and sex work are both more noble than being a fucking politician in America

Anne Appelbaum was someone who wrote a whole column recently about how she was at some party, and she slowly realized all of her wonderful friends were fascists

2) Kamala Harris is a black woman. The Republicans have already exposed themselves as a racist, misogynist, fascist party, but they haven't had such a ripe target yet. Also, a sizable number of so-called Democratic voters won't vote for a black woman

This is not a good argument against Harris. Of course she will not win the votes against Trump supporting white supremacists, but she doesn’t need to. The Trump camp will viciously attack whoever they are up against. I don’t think the fact that she is black will make her more vulnerable to these attacks. In fact I could see people getting pissed off by them and motivated to vote for her.

I think she would do well actually. Hillary had unique negatives and now Biden does too. Kamala doesn’t. And I think elevating her would be much less risky than a contested convention.

Shades of "you can't nominate him they'll scream socialist" right before the right spends 4-8 years calling Clinton/Obama/Biden a Castro-Maoista.

The stuff people dislike about her — awkwardness, seemingly unusual sense of humor (random laughing) — are things they could learn to like. If she was their high school principal they would like her.

I wish the Democrats would dig up an actual socialist to back

man wouldn't that be nice, not remotely kidding

A skeleton socialist

gotta be one in the closet somewhere

I would like even just a progressive like Warren but it’s not happening. The best possible outcome for progressives this election is Kamala winning so Trump doesn’t get it. I don’t think Whitmer or Newsom would do better than her, there is no evidence for it. And they would have to fight for delegates in a messy open convention that would look bizarre from the outside and probably illegitimate. Kamala was elected to be Biden’s replacement.

I agree with that google doc, basically.

I guess I’m a KHiver even though I donated to Bernie in 2020.

Harris' obvious negative is running a shit-ass campaign in 2020. But she's been veep for three years and has total access to party machinery. Like you said, she'd start with some good will.

What did she suggest be done to them, aside from looking at them askance?

― more difficult than I look (Aimless), Saturday, July 6, 2024 5:56 PM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

I don’t know if you’re joking, but she suggested that they should be bombed.

Her other obvious negative, for the record, is being CA attorney general, but that's me and many progressives, the latter of whom weren't voting for Biden-Harris anyway.

She is a neoconservative basically

Applebaum not harris

Xp alfred, biden had worse record on that issue than harris as he authored the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act. And he won.

Well, sure, he's been in public life since 1874.

I don't think you should underestimate the intangible of Biden tapping out and Harris entering, whatever the reality may be of her own appeal, at this point it would be an adrenaline shot for a lot of voters who are weary of seeing Biden as the candidate and wishing there was someone better. For someone more dynamic and sane to enter the fray when you've had these two (plus RFK Jr) would get some people onboard. I don't think it helps Trump one iota.

I personally don't have strong feelings for KM one way or another, but I think objectively she would be a plus in this particular election for the dems, and I think for whatever her reputation was the first half of this administration in the last year she's certainly I think seen in a better light, and maybe that's just in comparison to Biden and Trump, but it might be a not insignificant difference maker.

I think she would do well actually. Hillary had unique negatives and now Biden does too. Kamala doesn’t. And I think elevating her would be much less risky than a contested convention.

― treeship., Saturday, July 6, 2024

I would love to see her as president, but I disagree with your thinking that Harris doesn't have unique negatives and that she is less risky.

But say it's an adrenaline shot and she is elevated, how would it not be a contested convention anyway? I'm asking sincerely, I don't know. Would all of the Biden delegates automatically agree to pledge to her, or would it end up being a free-for-all shit show, in which case we will surely lose

totally agree w/u omar xp

Warren is not a progressive

I think the adrenaline affect among people who would (probably) vote anyway is not nothing. but the main thing is there are millions of low info voters who will vote for anyone who has a chance of winning who is not Biden or trump. People really don’t want to vote for them!

I also think she would make trump look awful and win by a lot actually.

caek also otm, unfortunately ILX is not in charge of the US, I really think we could get some things done if we were

we'd FP the Infowars guy and Joe Rogan to start with

The Infowars guy has effectively FP’d himself at this point

KM is a risk. Biden is a risk.

But say it's an adrenaline shot and she is elevated, how would it not be a contested convention anyway?

It might be! But she starts with Biden's $200+ war fund.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GR1k7r_XUAAU3Qf.jpg

This may go without saying but fuck the New York Post

I really disagree that we should refrain from nominating her for fear of the NY Post writing racist articles.

that's a plus, they are already scared of it happening

But say it's an adrenaline shot and she is elevated, how would it not be a contested convention anyway? I'm asking sincerely, I don't know. Would all of the Biden delegates automatically agree to pledge to her, or would it end up being a free-for-all shit show, in which case we will surely lose

This is insane hand-wringing. If Biden announces he's withdrawing and handing the crown to the Vice President, who do you think is mounting a challenge?

Everyone will just be relieved that Biden's out.

Oh man if the New York Post gets racist enough, the Democrats might only win New York 58-42 instead of 61-39.

I’m optimistic/naive enough to think that the amount/nature of vile stuff she would be subject to would actually win her votes. Prehistoric mask off boomer stuff plus Nazi freak stuff that even moderate Romney republicans tell themselves they don’t like. Plus the endless “because of woke” stuff that bores normal people. But I don’t know how I feel about advancing “she would be a lightning rod for the worst sentiments in america” as an argument to nominate her. For one thing she’s a human being.

https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=Biden%27s+Woke+Agenda

I think it should be disregarded. Whoever is nominated will be a lightning rod.

I wonder if the Post said anything horribly racist about Obama in the summer of 2008.

But say it's an adrenaline shot and she is elevated, how would it not be a contested convention anyway? I'm asking sincerely, I don't know. Would all of the Biden delegates automatically agree to pledge to her, or would it end up being a free-for-all shit show, in which case we will surely lose

This is insane hand-wringing. If Biden announces he's withdrawing and handing the crown to the Vice President, who do you think is mounting a challenge?

Everyone will just be relieved that Biden's out.

― papal hotwife (milo z), Saturday, July 6, 2024

I don't mean to be hand wringing, if all of the delegates are on board with her, that's fine

One thing that seems plausible if you’re looking for things to handwring about is various states refusing to put her on the ballot. I’m not sure if any of the states that matter are specific concerns this year. Georgia and NC maybe?

I feel like I'm coming off as "Biden or Bust" here but the truth is, I too would feel relief and excitement if they announced tomorrow that Harris was gonna do it instead. All I'm saying is that I don't think my judgment is particuarly trustworthy and it's very easy to see myself, in that circumstance, eventually really regretting that they'd made the change, and wishing Biden were still the candidate.

there are millions of low info voters who will vote for anyone who has a chance of winning who is not Biden or trump. People really don’t want to vote for them!

I think this is the best case for a change.