ILE Weight Watchaz

By contrast my trainer wants me eating five meals a day ffs. I've just spent $80 on some magical bulking powder. This had better work.

blew out any semblence of tracking my eating on tuesday night with a burrito and a 6er of Rainier's tallboys. Got good & drunk whilst watching primary election returns.

Woke up today with a mild hangover and a chest cold, making my morning all the more blah. No exercise or brisk walks for me for the last coupla days.

In other news, i found out that six pints of beer is only like 20-21 weight watchers points. Funny how that works out.

Attempting to loose the 8-ish lbs I put on during the stress fest that was the end of 2007 and then over Christmas. I've always eaten in a reasonably healthy fashion (nice fatty things in small amounts, excepting cheese and wine - I will not strip all wicked joy from my life, however much I actually enjoy raspberries, grilled fish etc.) So I've started going swiming three times a week again. I was doing this about a year and a half ago and it worked very nicely. I had a flatter stomach, noticably more toned upper arms and thighs and the bit of cellulite I did have went (I am aware I'm quite genetically lucky WRT cellulite, and I thank my grandmother's genes on a regular basis.)
So, swimming it is. Four pounds gone. Whoo hoo! Just the difficult four to go now. (I always struggle with those four-five, that's the cheese weight.)

AA, is the switch to treadmill necessary? i truly hate running and much much prefer cycling - but am i missing out on exercising certain parts of my body if i stick solely to cycling?

and perhaps related, the main problem with my body are my love handles and flabby belly, if i continue with the aerobic + anaerobic exercise + low cal eating will these problems disappear in enough time? are there any particular exercises i can do to focus on these pesky bits?

pretty sure that aerobic exercise is aerobic exercise is aerobic exercise - the point of it isn't to work certain parts of your body, the point of it is to get your heart beating faster and your lungs working harder for an extended period of time - so whatever you choose that does this is fine

kingfish, what is the logic behind lager having low points? i dont quite understand the WW system, is it not based on calories?

AA, that's annoying (for me) about the machines. im not planning to use the weights in my gym as that area is always populated by a real nasty bunch of alpha cocks, complete with roidstare. when i move to a new flat the aim is to have a spare bedroom to put an exercise bike, weights and bench in there, but that'll be at least 6 months off. i'll stick with the machines for now though.

are you a full-on bodybuilder, in that you enter competitions or is just a hobby, a personal thing to look muscular? just out of interest id like to see a photo of your shape. im taking monthly photos of my progress so i'll put them up once im at a stage im happy with.

that bodybuilding site has got me very keen on learning the full facts behind it all, and how best to use weights, though im reading a lot of contradictory points about carbs, proteins, aerobic vs anaerobic, etc. things like eating 8 small meals per day aren't an option for me, but i dont think im doing *that* much damage to my metabolism by eating 3 meals per day.

kingfish, what is the logic behind lager having low points? i dont quite understand the WW system, is it not based on calories?

It's based on calories/kilojoules and saturated fat, as far as I'm aware.

are you a full-on bodybuilder, in that you enter competitions or is just a hobby, a personal thing to look muscular? just out of interest id like to see a photo of your shape.

Full-on? Nah, just a pride/confidence thing. I've been at it for about four years, but never really had proper direction (or sufficient time) until just recently, so the results have only ever been basic. I can take photos, but I don't know if posting them in this thread, and therefore rubbing 9% body fat in the noses of people who read this and are struggling, is terribly fair. The gym thread, perhaps?

Everyone contradicts everyone else in health and training. It's really really bloody annoying. Most of the time whatever you do is okay, as long as it makes sense and is backed up. The bodybuilding site is also aimed at a wide range of people, and it can be difficult to know who's writing some of it; not to mention the fact that everyone's different, and so some techniques and supplements that work for one person may not work for another.

Stick to three meals if that's what suits you. Again, everyone's different.

s.rose, as per your request:

http://www.4bitterguys.com/adam/before.jpg

^ 2003-ish(~80kg)

http://www.4bitterguys.com/adam/after.jpg

^ 2005-ish (roughly where I am now, but perhaps 1-2% less body fat)

Had my meeting today. Have lost a total of 5 lbs since starting 2 weeks ago, so i'm down to 248 and change. I haven't weighed less than 250 lbs in several years.

(for body type analysis, i'm a shade over 6'1" with a decent back & legs from years of the rowing machine and bike; biceps & upper chest need much work, tho)

Also, i've dropped 20 lbs from last spring/summer, which is astonishing, since i think i drank MORE after changing jobs.

Brilliant! If you keep doing what you're doing, there's no reason that it shouldn't continue to drop.

What's the best way to do sit-ups? I wanna start them but I'm worried that I'll do them wrong and they'll be ineffective, or give me a hernia or something. Any diagrams or videos online to show the best way?

They're more effective if you keep your feet up against your bum and pull your chin toward your hips, rolling into it.

I read/was told once that only a small movement was needed for a sit-up to be effective, but I'm not sure if that's just an excuse to do relatively lazy/easy versions, rather than fully pulling myself up to meet my knees, which I'm not convinced I could even do one of.

Yeah. If you go all the way up, you're just rocking up and down. Your shoulders must be off the surface but you don't want to be sitting upright. This is what I mean about pulling your chin toward your hips: you lift by pulling with your abs alone, not by swivelling with back, legs, glutes etc.

If small movements are easy, you're not doing them properly.

It's probably something you need to be shown, actually.

thanks for those pics AA, very interesting. can i ask what your height and age are, and what BMI you were in the 2003 shots? i was about the equivalent of those 2003 pics when i began this whole thing 3 weeks ago so it'd be good to compare. your shape in the 2005 pics looks just excellent, it's definitely something to be proud of. i hope i'll move toward a more intensive weights routine too, once ive dropped this excess fat.

i did my third weekly weigh in this morning and it seems ive lost 7 pounds in the past 3 weeks, which im pleased with as i dont feel like ive been depriving myself at all, and even if a few bad habits drift back in eventually there are some that i'll never go near again (insanely sugary soft drinks for one) knowing what i know now. this also means that im on the very brink of entering the 'healthy' BMI - i'm 0.1 away from leaving the 'overweight' section.

having a meal out for valentines day but the plan is to just have breakfast that day, and do a strong workout at the gym so even if the meal comes to 1000 cals i'll still be under the basal rate.

as (i think) i said on the other thread, a major plan for later in the year is to move to a place with a spare bedroom and buy some workout equipment for it - machines that aren't coated with a strangers sweat! my own music blasting out! no pain-in-arse travelling to and from the gym! - but what are the best and most essential basics to start with? im thinking a decent exercise bike with a digital display, a small set of dumb bells, a basic ab cruncher. will i need a bench too? what else is vital? and where could i find a decent weight training routine, without paying a trainer?

can i ask what your height and age are, and what BMI you were in the 2003 shots?

I'm 34 in March, and ~75kg and 178cm. I'd have weighed about the same in the 2005 pic.

Not a clue about BMI, sorry. I don't even know what my BMI is right now, I just know I was massively unfit in 2003. (The relatively small drop to 75kg is fat loss offset by muscle mass increase, so weight alone is a misleading indicator.)

your shape in the 2005 pics looks just excellent, it's definitely something to be proud of.

Thanks! My current goal is to double that - not in fat loss, but in muscle size.

btw, taking unflattering photos like mine above are really important, so months/years later you have something to look back on and remind yourself what you've achieved.

i did my third weekly weigh in this morning and it seems ive lost 7 pounds in the past 3 weeks, which im pleased with as i dont feel like ive been depriving myself at all (...) this also means that im on the very brink of entering the 'healthy' BMI - i'm 0.1 away from leaving the 'overweight' section.

Wow, this is fantastic. Obtaining results like this is what keeps you going.

what are the best and most essential basics to start with?

Honestly, I'm not sure. I've only ever used public gyms. At the very least, you'd need an adjustable bench, two dumbbells and a barbell (both with changeable weights) and a standing pulley mechanism. A swiss ball would come in useful for crunches and some pulley work. Forego the ab cruncher; you can do excellent crunches with just a bench and/or swiss ball, if your technique is correct.

If you get a bike, don't get a cheap one. They don't last.

where could i find a decent weight training routine, without paying a trainer?

I just came off Max-OT, which has given me incredible strength (but not size) gains in the five weeks I've been doing it. Links:

http://www.ast-ss.com/max-ot/max-ot_intro.asp
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/Max-Ot_Complete_Routine/m_390/tm.htm

It's crucial to do the recommended warm-ups in order to avoid injury.

I recommend a trainer initially, just to show you good technique. Particularly in the case of the Max-OT programme, the weights are so heavy that you could injure yourself if you're not doing them correctly.

You should find some other good ones at bodybuilding.com. If you swap Max-OT and hypertrophy programmes (as I'm doing now), you're supposed to notice size gains along with the strength gains.

For situps, do them crunch-style(arms folded across chest), since with the fingers linked behind the neck, you can stretch your spine all to hell.

Said my chiropractor, at least, and he had the knowing of a lotta things.

Did my weigh-in today. Turns out I lost 5.2 lbs last week(wearing pajama bottoms instead of denim & a belt helps), so i'm down to 243 or so, for the first time in, again, several years.

Wow.

Expect a plateau soon, but don't panic when it happens.

Lost another 5.1 lbs last week. Down to 238. Wheeee.

Lotsa biking did it.

Do you still enjoy the biking?

yup

Brilliant.

a 5 pound drop each week sounds very high, is that sustainable? is it right that weight drops quickly at first then slows as you reach closer to your goal?

i'm getting a steady 2 pound drop a week and feeling just great for it. fitting into clothes ive not worn in years, positive comments from friends, love handles noticeably shrinking, the only thing left is a small paunch i need to shift. the split second decision to do this in mid-jan is pretty much the best thing i've ever done. big thanks to you AA for the encouragement and advice (that bodybuilding site you linked to has proven very useful).

i'm heading to the gym three times a week now and actually look forward to it. i didn't before because i didn't have a routine or plan, it was just half-arsed ad hoc bits of cycling and weights that didn't help at all. i listen to music and read magazines while on the exercise bike - i think the more hardcore gymgang frown on it because i'm not giving it 100%, but i'd rather give 95% and have 5% of enjoyment along with it.

i have a set target of reaching good slimness by june but i think i'll reach that well before then. i'll have to reassess what i want to do then as i imagine i'll have to do a different routine to the one i have now. i can't imagine my current eating habits changing much (a 400-500 deficit on the basal metabolic rate is proving no problem at all, amazingly). it makes me shudder to think about the junk i used to eat, out of pure ignorance, a little bit of thinking and calculating has made so much of a difference. before i did this i felt i was just sliding down an inevitable slope into fattiness, like so many of my family members and the people i know around me.

i'm planning for the 3 x weekly gymtrip to be a longterm thing, but what happens when you go on holiday for a cpl of weeks? does the muscle drop off quickly, is it bad to do this?

AA, do you have any basic tips for the gym? as in, increase the weights by one level every 2 months or so or whether its better to do small number of reps at a higher weight, or more reps at a lower weight, just general things like that!

also, does weight training increase testosterone? i could sense something like this in the hours after a session on friday.

it is the 7th sense

There's no way a 5lb/wk weight drop is sustainable, in terms of continually doing so week after week after week. This last coupla weeks were my most physically demanding, if you will, since I got out and biked around for 30-50+ mins almost every day. Way I figure it, once I hit my 10% goal(around the upper 220s), the rate will change and losing a significant amount per week will require more effort & activity.

But, hell, that's a problem I should only be so fortunate to have.

I have noticed that in the 5-6 weeks i've been on weightwatchers, I've lost enough weight to decrement my daily point allowance twice.

i'm getting a steady 2 pound drop a week and feeling just great for it. fitting into clothes ive not worn in years, positive comments from friends, love handles noticeably shrinking, the only thing left is a small paunch i need to shift. the split second decision to do this in mid-jan is pretty much the best thing i've ever done. big thanks to you AA for the encouragement and advice (that bodybuilding site you linked to has proven very useful).

This is great to hear. Now that you've seen what's possible you won't go back; everyone I know who's gone through the same thing has stuck to their new weight.

i'm heading to the gym three times a week now and actually look forward to it. i didn't before because i didn't have a routine or plan, it was just half-arsed ad hoc bits of cycling and weights that didn't help at all.

Crap innit? I used to do the same thing and wonder why nothing was changing.

i listen to music and read magazines while on the exercise bike - i think the more hardcore gymgang frown on it because i'm not giving it 100%, but i'd rather give 95% and have 5% of enjoyment along with it.

Pffft. You've got to have music, and I don't think flipping through a magazine will have much of an impact. It's when you take in a novel or chat to people that you're wasting your time.

i'm planning for the 3 x weekly gymtrip to be a longterm thing, but what happens when you go on holiday for a cpl of weeks? does the muscle drop off quickly, is it bad to do this?

I've been told that you lose half your strength after two weeks off, but it's probably a bit of a stretch. You couldn't lose half your size (muscle mass) or fitness in two weeks. I'm prepared to be proven wrong though.

In October I'm going to Vietnam for two weeks, and there won't be time to do a lot of gym work. I think there's basic stuff you can do in a hotel room just to keep on top of it; when/if I find out what it is I'll stick it in the gym thread.

AA, do you have any basic tips for the gym? as in, increase the weights by one level every 2 months or so or whether its better to do small number of reps at a higher weight, or more reps at a lower weight, just general things like that!

Change everything every four weeks. That's the biggest one.

If you're doing strength training, you always want to be trying for heavier weights. If you're doing hypertrophy (as I am now), you need to be increasing the number of reps (or sets) roughly every week.

If you don't want bulk, focus on strength training. If you bulk too much, do fewer weights sessions and focus on cardio. If (like me) you want bulk, cut out cardio altogether. :)

My brother's college football weighttraining program was 3 times of 30 reps. Once you can do that, increment the weight and start again.

Is this a good diet?

Bran flakes, brown toast and coffee for breakfast

Bagel with sliced meat for lunch

Lean meat with rice and veg for tea

Apples and bananas as snacks

Cuz it's mostly all I'm eating at the moment.

30 reps?! 15 is probably enough.

Bodrick: I can count three food groups there. You could be adding to that and mixing it up. The sliced meat sounds processed. It could certainly be a lot worse though.

Yeah, you want to get meat sliced fresh from the deli, not pre-sliced packaged stuff.

Also, you should get like 2 teaspoons of "healthy oils", like olive oil or something per day.

And a multivitamin.

Some of the meat is off the counter, some is processed.

I heard multivitamins are bullshit, I dunno tho.

Olive oil is god. It's still oil though, so don't be drinking it :)

Still, two teaspoons instead of say, butter or margarine, is quite easy.

Oh, definitely. Don't cook with anything else.

Down to 236 today. Gained half-a-pound when measured last week, seem to have more than made up for it since. Am within like 7 lbs of my original 10% goal.

Must feel sooo good.

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drf700/f780/f78080jkbhe.jpg

pretty good, yeah. No major life/energy changes yet, but not bad so far.

One of the many side-benefits of my increased bike-riding(60 minutes tonight, up & down portland hills), that i can drink lots of light beer at the end of the night with no problem.

Yes, i know that i'm doing the horrid thing by chugging lite beer, but such temporary concessions must be made in the course of dropping a lot of weight. Once I get to an acceptable level, i'll change up from "losing" to "maintaining", and back to the proper stuff i go.

I am so starting this asap. I am really effing tired of being such a fat-ass.

I am currently formulating my workout plan. I will post for comments.

Alright, so its been QUITE a few years since I was regularly working out and watching what I ate, so I'm starting slow.

The bare minimum rules are:
1) No fried food
2) No fast food
3) No sodas, even diet - if I'm thirsty, water
4) At least two 45 min walks a day, increasing to one 45 min walk and one jog, once my legs/ankles/feet get up to it
5) 3 times a week, gym
6) Consume no more than 1500 calories per day

I'll post each week to see what happens. Its not as if I have a particularly unhealthy lifestyle, but I'm not doing anything to get healthy, and being a desk-bound American, I have swelled. NO MORE!!!

7) lowest possible carbs after 5pm

Also you have to enjoy either doing all of this or the effects it has on your body, otherwise you may not keep it up. I don't mean this to be a sledge or a downer.

Absolutely true. I know that I have the will power to push through and get past the initial difficulties of getting into a workout routine. I just need to kick that will power in.

And totally true about the lowest possible carbs after 5pm. I tend to do that anyway, with my most carbiliscious meal being breakfast.

Ah cool, sorry then.

I'm currently at 260 (you really would never know it to see me), and want to be at 240 by the middle of August. Holding at a little more than a pound a week loss, I should be able to do it.

Hoping for more, but every single resource says that a pound/week is the guideline for sensible weight loss.

I'm currently at 260 (you really would never know it to see me)

That's for sure! 260! I would never have guessed, B.L.A.M.