A new 30 Rock thread because I can't find the old one

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it's a funny joke, the 'rural juror'. she doesn't know the name of the film! i lolled without shame.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 10:52 (nineteen years ago)

it is slightly funny

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 10:53 (nineteen years ago)

"i'ma make you a mixtape! you like phil collins?"
"i have two ears and a heart, don't i?"

this has people shouting and weeping w/ laughter, upthread

it is slightly funny

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 10:57 (nineteen years ago)

alec baldwin is funny, though

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 10:58 (nineteen years ago)

I don't really like it.

Apart just not finding it funny a lot of the time, the race-related jokes make me uncomfortable. I have not read all this thread, it seems that no-one else has been offended by this, but I will try to explain anyway.

I think there is a big difference between jokes that are about questions of race, drawing humour from the awkwardness and taboo nature of the subject (eg Curb Your Enthusiasm) and jokes that just play on racist assumptions for their humour. Sometimes, though, it gets a bit hard for me to tell the difference.

30 Rock has a black character whose hilarious quirk is that he is well-educated and pretentious. In one episode (was it the first episode?), the other guy says to him "Are there any other black nerds or is it just you and Urkel?"

I am really not well acquainted with the ins and outs of American race relations, but can someone tell me why exactly that is not a racist joke? Is it just because the writers are clearly liberals who have no racist intentions?

― Cathy, Sunday, 29 April 2007 11:19 (nineteen years ago)

"30 Rock has a black character whose hilarious quirk is that he is well-educated and pretentious."

no.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 11:20 (nineteen years ago)

"superman does good"

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 11:21 (nineteen years ago)

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 11:30 (nineteen years ago)

there are too many jokes about liz lemon being a failure in life/unattractive. i still think it's awesome.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 11:35 (nineteen years ago)

http://www.emerchandise.com/images/p/NNN/pdTINNN0106.jpg

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 11:50 (nineteen years ago)

'you're such a monica'

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 12:03 (nineteen years ago)

Hey, RJG, are you trying to tell us that you think the show isn't all that funny? Is that what you're saying? Because it's a little unclear. Maybe you should subtly imply it a few dozen more times.

And Cathy: could you say why you think that is a racist joke? I'm actually glad that 30 Rock deals with the race stuff head-on and sans po-face. I'd argue that this show is far less racist in its use of black characters/actors than SNL has been, in general. Maybe a specious comparison, but still.

― Deric W. Haircare, Sunday, 29 April 2007 13:35 (nineteen years ago)

it isn't all that funny

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 13:54 (nineteen years ago)

It's usually difficult and pointless to try and analyse jokes, but I'll try.

I think it's a racist joke because it derives humour from a racial stereotype, with little else going on as far as I can see.

The guy says "Are there any other black nerds or is it just you and Urkel?" The idea of a black nerd is presumably supposed to be humorous, because of the stereotype that black people are either a) too "cool" to be nerds (very patronising) or b) not intelligent/educated enough to be nerds (very insulting).

I don't really see this as "dealing with the race stuff head on" so much as very clumsily making a joke about a black stereotype.

What am I missing?

― Cathy, Sunday, 29 April 2007 13:57 (nineteen years ago)

don't mind rjg, he will continue to download and watch this show

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:19 (nineteen years ago)

hang on isn't it tracey jordan who says that to toofer?

either way you're getting its tone wrong.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:24 (nineteen years ago)

ooga-chaka ooga-ooga

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:25 (nineteen years ago)

it isn't TJ, it's the funny guy w/ the funny hats that have funny things printed on to them, isn't it?

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:28 (nineteen years ago)

yeah, but what was it in response to again?

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:28 (nineteen years ago)

Toufer: [Complaining to Liz] Surely our massive conglomerate parent company could spring for a samovar of coffee.
Frank: Yeah, or, like, a big coffee dispenser!
Toufer: [Condescendingly] That's what a samovar is.
Frank: Are there other black nerds, or is it just you and Urkel?
[Toofer just stares at Frank]

joke is partly frank makes arse of himself, no?

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:30 (nineteen years ago)

can't remember what was printed on to his hat on that day

crosspost

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:30 (nineteen years ago)

Does "tone" just mean the lack of racist intent by the writers? A joke can be racist without meaning to be.

x-post

― Cathy, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:31 (nineteen years ago)

joke is partly frank makes arse of himself, no?

now I'm laughing

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:31 (nineteen years ago)

The best thing to come out of the Rural Juror stuff was Alec Baldwin's "They're making a film out of the Rural Juror? I love Kevin Grisham."

Twofer is so named because he fills both the black and the ivy league quotients of the writing staff.

Many funny things have come from Twofer and Tracy's relationship. The whole episode with the n-word was very good. "It just sounds HATEFUL coming from you." "In the past ten years or so, the African-American community have reappropriated that word..." etc...

Tracy himself is a send up in a lot of ways of "crazy" African-American comedians (Martin Lawrence, Wayans Bros, etc...). "I'm so confused. My entire career is based on analyzing the differences between black and white culture". The phone dialling!

― Gukbe, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:33 (nineteen years ago)

name me a comedy show where each and every gag makes u lol.

xpost

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:33 (nineteen years ago)

Twofer is so named because he fills both the black and the ivy league quotients of the writing staff.

continuing to laugh

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:34 (nineteen years ago)

As I remember, there is nothing in the reaction of other characters after Frank delivers that line that suggests that the joke is that he has made an arse of himself. It is delivered like a punchline, that is supposed to be funny in itself, even if it comes through the mouthpiece of a character that is supposed to be a loser.

― Cathy, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:34 (nineteen years ago)

mind you i even laugh at the trucker hat. mean and jaded people like the lex think i don't like anything!

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:34 (nineteen years ago)

"Twofer is so named because he fills both the black and the ivy league quotients of the writing staff.

continuing to laugh

-- RJG, Sunday, April 29, 2007 5:34 PM (36 seconds ago)"

cf 'he's my gaysian' in 'entourage', another show you don't like but watch?

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:35 (nineteen years ago)

hardly the same

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:37 (nineteen years ago)

shows about inner working of US media | shows where minor character fills two minority quotas

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:38 (nineteen years ago)

I don't like Entourage, either. But that is more misogyny than racism, which is even harder to pin down.

― Cathy, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:39 (nineteen years ago)

isn't "twofer" the character's name?

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:40 (nineteen years ago)

fuck political correctness in my comedy, go watch the news

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:41 (nineteen years ago)

i'm not going to fight toof's battles for him, he seems okay with it.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:42 (nineteen years ago)

it's a nickname (twofer)

entourage isn't funny. family guys isn't funny. 30 rock is, though.

― akm, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:43 (nineteen years ago)

I'm sorry, cutty, this is not about political correctness

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:43 (nineteen years ago)

ha, i was talking to cathy

i know better than to argue with you about tv shows

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:44 (nineteen years ago)

twofer may as well be just a background character introduced w/ his name and its explanation

it is one joke and not a funny one

crosspost

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:45 (nineteen years ago)

"urkel" joke probably one of the low points of the entire season--not many

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:48 (nineteen years ago)

fuck political correctness in my comedy, go watch the news

That is exactly what actual racists/homophobes etc. say when defending their jokes.

I don't think that comedians should avoid race issues, just that they should be a little bit cleverer when tackling them. And I really do think comedians should avoid jokes that are racist in the sense that I described before, which I think some of the jokes in 30 Rock are.

If "political correctness" means not being racist, I am really all for it though.

― Cathy, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:48 (nineteen years ago)

OK LET'S MAKE OUR RACISM MORE CLEVER

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:52 (nineteen years ago)

I'M ALL FOR IT

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:52 (nineteen years ago)

"twofer may as well be just a background character introduced w/ his name and its explanation"

not really, the 'n-word' ep is a hoot.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:53 (nineteen years ago)

I remember when they incorporated the hoot into the dandy and it was called "the dandy and hoot" for a short while

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:54 (nineteen years ago)

in a later episode tracy calls a black extra 'carlton'.

― That one guy that quit, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:55 (nineteen years ago)

is the guy w/ the hats in the episode?

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 14:56 (nineteen years ago)

it isn't that the bad jokes are actually racist but that they are lazy enough that they are not "tackling" any "issue" they might "think" they are

― RJG, Sunday, 29 April 2007 15:01 (nineteen years ago)

i don't think 30 rock really is trying to tackle any issues besides the roffle issue

― cutty, Sunday, 29 April 2007 15:05 (nineteen years ago)

RJG, your endless string of "quips" are not nearly as "clever" as you "think" they are. Please go update your Two And A Half Men fansite and stop talking about a show that you neither like nor have anything interesting to say about.

― Deric W. Haircare, Sunday, 29 April 2007 15:06 (nineteen years ago)

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