funnier does not = better tho
the game is great
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:27 (fifteen years ago) link
I am always confused by the Fight Club backlash
― BLACK BEYONCE, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:28 (fifteen years ago) link
too many people think its great
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:29 (fifteen years ago) link
so contrarianism then. thats kind of what i thought.
― BLACK BEYONCE, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:32 (fifteen years ago) link
its nihilism is boring and self-congratulatory and the basic premise is a bunch of nonsensical macho fantasy bullshit
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:32 (fifteen years ago) link
the basic premise is a bunch of nonsensical macho fantasy bullshit
O RLY???
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:34 (fifteen years ago) link
this is going to get into a source material problem again i think. not that i agree w/your summary, but you can hardly blame fincher for that. xpost
― BLACK BEYONCE, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:35 (fifteen years ago) link
hey he made the movie
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:35 (fifteen years ago) link
similar to what i said about tdk & all adaptations: who gives a shit about the source, & why is that in any way relevant to the discussione??
its basic premise IS a bunch of nonsensical macho fantasy bullshit, like, literally - i dont get how thats a valid criticism
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:39 (fifteen years ago) link
Shakes, have you read the Palahniuk? It's more a tap-in to depressive/sadomasochistic issues than "macho bullshit."
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:41 (fifteen years ago) link
who gives a shit about the source, & why is that in any way relevant to the discussion
Because, except for a little wobbling before the climax, it's a fairly faithful adaptation (tho a tad more romantic-comedy) and reading it might help people who are seeing things in the film that ain't there.
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:44 (fifteen years ago) link
FC being about nihilism doesn't make it nihilist.
― ryan, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:47 (fifteen years ago) link
guy seems like a terrible writer from the flip-through I gave it. granted that was years ago.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:50 (fifteen years ago) link
most of his other books are much worse
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:51 (fifteen years ago) link
FC>Zodiac>Seven>Alien3>The Game>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Panic Room
almost otm though i would switch zodiac and fight club and put a lot more distance between the game and alien 3
― omar little, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:51 (fifteen years ago) link
i disliked the movie for its 90s-style ahistoricism. ends on a 'revolutionary' note w/o even a hint of real politics leading up to, beyond contempt for ikea and fat women. seemed to reconfirm every stereotype that men of my generation are clueless. bolsheviks, who are they duuuude
― goole, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:52 (fifteen years ago) link
how is a conclusion wherein the protagonist kisses his g/f with half his head blown off while buildings explode all around him NOT nihilistic?
(ftr the split-second porn insert is a much-needed bit of levity and I appreciated it)
x-post
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:52 (fifteen years ago) link
ends on a 'revolutionary' note w/o even a hint of real politics leading up to, beyond contempt for ikea and fat women. seemed to reconfirm every stereotype that men of my generation are clueless. bolsheviks, who are they duuuude
yeah this really REALLY bothered me too. movie reduces insurrectionary politics to "lets blow stuff up hurhrurhur - oh wait I R SAD"
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:53 (fifteen years ago) link
the problem is that shakey isnt seeing anything that isnt there hes just being a stubborn dick about it
wtf goole??? xps
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:54 (fifteen years ago) link
One of my best friend's thesis is on Chuck P. He didn't listen to me.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:55 (fifteen years ago) link
i think you guys are confusing the characters being psycho dicks with the movie endorsing their viewpoint.
― omar little, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:55 (fifteen years ago) link
shakey & goole = stalin + tolstoy
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:56 (fifteen years ago) link
explain to me how the movie is critical of their viewpoint
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:56 (fifteen years ago) link
or else its OFF TO THE GULAG
oh no, omar otm?
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:57 (fifteen years ago) link
spending time with people who love fight club did more than anything else to make me never want to think about it again
― max, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:57 (fifteen years ago) link
the cult's Iron Johnish myth is just one more sales pitch, the narrator comes to realize
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:58 (fifteen years ago) link
fight club FAILED as a movie because it did not start THE REVOLUTION
xp 2 max who doesnt love fight club other than wannabe commie insurrectionists
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:58 (fifteen years ago) link
i'd say the main plot is a bit of a traditional rom-com...hero learns to grow up and accept love (yawn, right). in fact id even suggest that a certain reading of the movie would say that it's MARLA who really saves the narrator and that Tyler was the last gasp, the nihilistic burst of freedom, needed to set that process of maturation in motion.
as Aldous Huxley said, fascism responds to real human needs, we just need to be grown up enough to resist them, to an extent.
― ryan, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:59 (fifteen years ago) link
morbius i am consistently otm everywhere i go
― omar little, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 20:59 (fifteen years ago) link
'the movie doesn't endorse their viewpoint' is the oldest apologist trick in the book -- viz a viz kubrick fans claiming for thirty years that a clockwork orange doesn't endorse alex despite the fact that he's glamorous and cool and charismatic and everyone else in the movie is portrayed as ugly and square.
― J.D., Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:00 (fifteen years ago) link
"Tyler, I appreciate everything you've done for me, but this is too much." it's right in the dialogue, brahs.
― ryan, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:00 (fifteen years ago) link
ummm really. is that why he shoots himself in the face.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:01 (fifteen years ago) link
that said i kinda like fight club, but dirty harry prob dealt with the same issues a lot more coherently.
― J.D., Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:02 (fifteen years ago) link
i have no idea what the book is like, for the record
the movie wanted to have its outlaw character win, so revolution it is, bombs away. but it had the typical hollywood allergy to real politics, so the motivation gets chalked up to male depression and office drone uselessness, not any kind of program. that's just nuts, it's like, you do realize that people have blown up the state and taken over, in the 20th century, a couple times?
if it's not endorsing their view it's at least holding them up as a potentiality to fear, which is pretty congratulatory, in a way -- falling down redux?
deeznuts stfu and learn to read
many xps
― goole, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:02 (fifteen years ago) link
I mean come on escaping a destructive cult by an act of self-mutilation, how is that not completely nihilistic
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:02 (fifteen years ago) link
in fact, i'd say it's pretty touching that the movie suggests that, you know, real human love and connection (the image of them holding hands as the world collapses all around them) is the only salvation in the materialist hell portrayed at the beginning of the film.
― ryan, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:02 (fifteen years ago) link
frankly a better revolutionary ending would have calm and fair minded public employees figure out what was going on, capture him and lock him up.
― goole, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:05 (fifteen years ago) link
^^^^lolz
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:05 (fifteen years ago) link
"it had the typical hollywood allergy to real politics, so the motivation gets chalked up to male depression and office drone uselessness, not any kind of program. that's just nuts"
wtf goole??
xp ok this man is a troll
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:05 (fifteen years ago) link
also, Brad Pitt will never be that motherfucking hot again.
The film and book aren't particularly interested in 'real' politics.
escaping a destructive cult by an act of self-mutilation
Shakey, you know I luv ya, but cmon, that face-shooting bit is totally in la-la land, making it way clear by then that it's likely a symbolic act / fantasy to rid himself of the alterego.
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:06 (fifteen years ago) link
'the movie doesn't endorse their viewpoint' is the oldest apologist trick in the book
it's also pretty much true, not only for this movie but for a lot of movies from the past 100 years or so. some movies have speeches about how bad these shitty characters are, and some just kind of show how shitty they are and expect you to be smart enough to figure that out yourself.
― omar little, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:06 (fifteen years ago) link
I think i would agree that FC drops the ball on any potential political readings...there is a bit of incoherence on that front. One might say it is nihilistic because it DOES seem to me to recoil from any political statement. maybe that's cowardice, maybe it's saying that there sincere limits to the political.
― ryan, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:07 (fifteen years ago) link
real human love and connection (the image of them holding hands as the world collapses all around them) is the only salvation in the materialist hell portrayed at the beginning of the film.
except that, you know, the implication is that mass murder and property destruction on a grand scale were required for them to reach that completely banal rom-com conclusion
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:07 (fifteen years ago) link
well, yeah! it's a funny movie.
― ryan, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:08 (fifteen years ago) link
IT'S ONE MAN'S DERANGED FANTASY
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:09 (fifteen years ago) link
OFTEN MATCHING UP WITH MINE
on another point, i don't think we should use the subsequent popularity of "alex" halloween costumes and the real-life fight clubs as something indicative of anything other than people "not getting it".
― omar little, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:09 (fifteen years ago) link
that face-shooting bit is totally in la-la land, making it way clear by then that it's likely a symbolic act / fantasy to rid himself of the alterego.
I guess - pretty nihilistic symbolism going on there nonetheless (not to mention lovingly shot and made as grotesque as possible)
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:09 (fifteen years ago) link
there are sincere lols to be had! i love the cop banging on the door when marla threatens suicide. "you have every reason to live!"
― goole, Wednesday, 23 July 2008 21:10 (fifteen years ago) link