ok what the fuck is happening in ukraine

Why make value judgments at all? Things happen. They are neither good nor bad. They just are.

Dude are you like 16 or something

Lol, I wish.

"I'll still take US "free press", warts and all, over the Russian news media"

ok I'll quote this bit instead. you fucking tool

Anyways, like many of us, I fear that Putin's normally sociable and agreeable nature has been adversely affected by covid-related isolation.

Cool, another thread devolving into sniping and point-scoring. No wonder the activity levels seem to have fallen over a cliff in recent weeks.

I read that as, "these both suck, but I think I kinda prefer our shitty press to that other shitty press" and I don't get at all why that would be a controversial statement.

shut the fuck up

you wouldn't get it because it's a condition called American

It just comes across as horribly naïve in a post Iraq war world when the press obviously showed that they were not capable of uncovering the truth.

I don't get the aggressive tone. I never said I praised or trusted the American press, I just don't think it's quite as dire as the Russian press, yet.

anyone who still thinks a the western/US media being fed dubious bollox by the WH for weeks now, is still something more trustworthy than Solovyov or whatever, needs to think again imo.

xp

and shut the fuck up again dickhead!

Russian dash cam footage beats the New York Times for reportage, every time.

Why are we all pretending that we read the Russian press now?

Always a healthy sign of a thriving forum when the responses to a slightly differing take is "shut the fuck up" and "shut the fuck up again dickhead".

I'm sure it's bad and all but to give this order of preference like anyone here except maybe ShariVari has the slighest grasp of what the Russian media landscape is like feels pretty off to me.

That's a fair point. I still don't think anything itt warrants that level of aggression. But people seem to like that kind of discourse around here, or at least don't mind it so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

It isn’t trusting one press over the other it’s just//again I must say “naive” to say that the western press is more trustworthy re:Ukraine than the other.

I mean I’ll take the us press over the Russian press any day cause they have the funnies I like. But trusting them
On the Ukraine situation? Get real.

Well, yeah.

Mary Worth has been insane lately.

Would read Russian Mary Worth for sure tho ftr.

i don’t particular give a fuck but as somebody who actually reads russian press on a daily basis - yes,
i will take the us press over the russian press any fucking day

fuck the American Press. fuck the Russian Press. look to the Turkish Get-Up for the best full body workout.

i heard french press is pretty good

The reportage can be a bit gritty.

Mary Worth has been insane lately.

Would read Russian Mary Worth for sure tho ftr.

Russian Calvin & Hobbes, Hobbes is a real tiger

The US strategy of providing information about coup plots, invasion dates and false flag attacks to the domestic press and not the Ukrainian government is, at least, very odd.

A relative who worked for the OSCE in Ukraine was telling me about the increasingly frantic messages from the State Department warning everyone to evacuate their families and then themselves. Completely different messaging from previous run ups where the rule was to not worry unless you see Russian tanks in the Maidan.

what is the consensus view here about what is actually happening? Is it that this is a defensive move by Russia in response to overly aggressive NATO expansionism?

maybe i don't understand the big deal with them joining nato (aside from simply proximity to russia)

It’s pretty clear that Ukraine is never joining NATO—but Putin wants that in writing, and Biden is unwilling to do that because it looks “weak.’

sowing discord between the US and France/Germany/Europe in general is a benefit to Putin

I know this is coming from the US press which are running dogs for the imperialist war machine, but it's hard to read this article without coming to the conclusion that Russia has some understandable grievances with the increasing US military presence in Eastern Europe, and reasons to be unhappy with the way the US unilaterally withdrew from the anti-ballistic missile treaty which was a cornerstone of nuclear detente:

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/16/world/europe/poland-missile-base-russia-ukraine.html

The best comparison I heard was that Ukraine joining NATO is the equivalent to the Russians of Russia putting missiles in Cuba.

is this not obvious

would this not be an obvious thing to consider within one second

which was like the US putting missiles in Turkey which was like

JCOS working on a plan as we speak, though

https://www.denofgeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/dr-strangelove-3.jpg

It's OK 'cos we're the good guys.

yep I've just read an Anne Applebum piece in the Atlantic and can confirm that

Hmm is it safe to assess western media coverage as anything less than pure garbage without getting carpeted with F-bombs?

For anyone still asking “what’s it all about?” — that Time article posted up thread had a lot of pertinent info that I hadn’t seen in other coverage. (I didn’t make it past the paywall on o. Nate’s NYT piece but the point about the treaty also stands out.)

As a citizen of a Russia-bordering country, from a Russian-speaking household, having travelled in Ukraine, Moldova, Russia and Georgia, it is pretty fucking offensive reading people describing Russian positions as «sabre rattling», but perhaps I shouldn’t be surprised

Care to elaborate?

Just people upthread being totally dismissive of the experience of having Russian aggression as a constant presence, because NATO or whatever.

It’s good to know there’s someone else with a passport, not great when poster Mule pops up to aggressively condescend as they occasionally do (recall them tone policing calzino in the unhappiness of ilx) ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I’m not going to apologise for describing obvious dick waving as such; that doesn’t mean it’s not unnerving or upsetting for people in the area though!

xpost

Oh cheers. Feel free to f-bomb me cause I assumed based on the Russian-speaking that it might be the opposite.

Full disclosure I did just read a Guardian article and a Russia Today article side by side and the RT article wasn’t as bad as I thought it would be. Heavy use of scare quotes tho. (Also remarkably hard to find on Google at all now.)

And gyac your perspective is appreciated too, I didn’t recognize the name. I do also have a passport for what’s it worth. Ask me about China (my mom is a Tibetan Buddhist and my ex was Tibetan so I may be less than 100% unbiased.)

The unfortunate nature of china’s role in the world means they’re never going to get held to account ito what they’ve been doing in Tibet/Xinjiang, Russia to a lesser extent has a position of power because of its role shipping gas to Europe and its location. It takes a lot for a war to kick off because of these realities I guess, so Putin et al can really act as they like with impunity because what’s going to happen to them? And does Western Europe even care beyond keeping the gas on? And if there’s no danger of military pushback then Russia doesn’t have to do anything besides move some troops around and make some verbal threats, so yeah, that’s really my thinking on “sabre rattling”, that and the only people really going hard for war are the only people who always are, ie Atlantic Council shitheads and dopes like AA.

Jus «obvious dick waving», right. But whatever, gyac. We’ll never see eye to eye.

To be clear: had no issue with what you wrote, viborg

All this ^ has been covered thread and in more detail by others previously, if you’d like to talk more about your opinion then I’d be interested to read it.