Outside Cats - is it a sin?

there are some seriously delicious vegan "meats" and "cheeses" out there ... like, hey, you care about the bird population and ecosystems and you are keeping your cats inside because of it, that is a thoughtful thing to do ... another environmentally thoughtful thing you could do is reduce your own meat consumption.

The wildlife issue with domestic cats is far less killing and eating than killing for sport.

The “oh but you eat meat” argument would work if you’re talking to someone who goes out in the neighborhood killing birds and squirrels for the hell of it.

The first, Bruce, was a total stoner pal, and loved to climb into the large pot where I'd sown catnip and just laze around and occasionally smoke a bowl eat a leaf.

We have friends a couple of blocks away whose dog had clearly eaten something that was making it act off, and it turns out she got into the stoner neighbor's yard and went to town on a pot plant. The vet essentially said she just needed to sleep it off.

also imagine a factory farmed chicken would behave a bit like Sporky if released in the wild. the evil is baked into the bird's existence.

the problem with eating bird meat isn't that we are depleting a once thriving bird population. The problem is that we are fostering a monstrous bird population incompatible with the natural world, similar to fostering a monstrous predator cat population. In this comparison, eliminating the factory farmed bird population entirely is more similar to keeping your cat indoors. It makes no sense to draw comparison between eliminating the factory farmed bird population and eliminating the wild bird population.

considering that the majority of ILX is not vegan, (I'm not either), this whole "how dare you let your cat eat animals" stance feels a bit hypocritical

Considering that the majority of ILX eats meat, and people are made of meat, and people are very environmentally destructive, then the whole "don't eat people" stance is also a bit hypocritical.

I mean, since I eat bacon and hamburgers I might as well eat bald eagles and spotted owls and my neighbors' children, right?

Any other stance would be... hypocritical eek

I feel like we've collectively addressed the weaknesses of sarahell's 'hypocrisy' argument now.

"still think that if y'all are merrily eating meat yourselves it still seems hypocritical"

Then I still think you're not grasping the argument being put forth. But I get that it can be pretty difficult to part with a "the people I don't agree with a just hypocrites" comfort blanket.

(Tho fwiw I'm not a staunch "you shouldn't let your cat go outside" person)

as milo already correctly pointed out, the emphasis on cats being 'allowed to eat birds' is somewhat misplaced since non-feral cats that hunt and kill small birds and animals rarely eat them anyway; they are usually very well-fed and do it for reasons other than appeasing their hunger.

because they're adorable little psychopaths

I was inspired to become vegetarian by a lost cat poster. I realized I couldn't justify my compassion for a cat while eating a different animal.

whenever you have the choice between killing and not killing, not killing is best. keep kitties safe inside, play with them a lot, provide stimulating environments and experiences so they don’t get bored, be a good servant and steward to all the creatures around you.

some cats won’t ever be happy with that, though, and some cat owners can’t provide it. then you have to balance the happiness/misery of the animal whose life you’ve personally taken responsibility for with the dangers and vulnerabilities of your immediate ecosystem, which can differ vastly from country to country, region to region, neighborhood to neighborhood.

gonna paws here to reiterate, keeping kitties inside is best and everyone shld try it wherever feasible

but there’s no pristine ecological system left to preserve, those horses escaped that barn centuries ago, and the barn is on fire and the horses are on fire and everything is on fire and the rising seas will swallow it all up anyway

https://www.britannica.com/science/invasive-species

https://www.un.org/sustainabledevelopment/blog/2019/05/nature-decline-unprecedented-report/

this is not to abdicate responsibility! even if everything’s burning it’s still morally indefensible to just give up and add to the blaze for the numb nihilism of it. but a dozen ilxors and their pets, strewn across the globe, will have no impact either way.

so hug your cats, spay and neuter your kids, skynet for presidetn 2024

also what is the root of Neando’s rat antipathy, i met a rat once and it was a very nice person

https://imgur.com/a/XYhJYft

Pele sez go veg

https://imgur.com/a/B7F4Iql

also buy four of horses by softer drive, available at a bandcamp near u

https://imgur.com/a/m6Lvd1V

FTR I am well aware that when I open a can of cat food for my inside cat, what he's getting is bits of birds and fish who were once alive. Further, I know that I regularly nom on animals. That doesn't mean that letting my cats loose inside the Small Mammal House at the zoo would be okay. There are differences in degree and in kind at play here.

Now it makes sense why they asked me to leave that zoo

I have an indoor cat and I am vegetarian, hmu if you want me to post an opinion itt

If god had wanted cats indoors hed have made them with little houses already around them imo

The diversion into the morality of veganism in animals is already a strong contender for 2022 best ofs

right like church mice and barn owls

precisely

opine, rob, opine!!! and post pic of catkin?

Ya Kid K is back again
Outside cats, is it a sin?

human habits can foster an oversize population of one animal or another. sometimes we hunt them to prevent a disruption. I guess we don't generally shoot cats with rifles like deer, but we do catch and kill them. keeping your cat inside so it doesn't heathcliff the hood seems a reasonable and compassionate request that has nothing to do with veganism in animals.

All cats guilty until proven innocent does not sound a progressive starting position to me tbh

^^this is the case. Each cat has a different level of aggression, different responses to the world around them. I respect all of the arguments brought against inside cats (danger of their death, effect on the environment around them), and I think about these things before deciding to allow my cats outside and only allow them out because in my context I don't see these effects really happening. Obviously I could be blind to the mass destruction they are performing or the death-hound and band of coyotes that secretly live at my neighbours and the 11:30pm traffic rush on my dead-end cul-de-sac that I have never noticed, but hey you gotta roll with the cards you've got and I think the happiness and quality of life they are getting because of their outside privileges is worth it.

Besides, they spend 90% of the day asleep on my bed anyways, lazy bastards.

case in point

https://imgur.com/610YcKr

test post, I think this is how you post images.

https://i.imgur.com/610YcKr.jpeg

opine, rob, opine!!! and post pic of catkin?

― cat? (cat), Monday, January 3, 2022 7:25 PM (thirty-four minutes ago)

opinion: people should eat less meat!

pic:

https://imgur.com/myqe2jx

ah right I did the thing too

https://i.imgur.com/myqe2jx.jpg

The diversion into the morality of veganism in animals

this was such a badly wrought provocation that you should consider turning in your provocateur's license, deems

What if i agreed to go through an agent

those are both really great pictures

wait did i post mine wrong, did my 3 excellent portraits not show up, should i post them again

many fine cats itt

xps - said agent would simply deliver similarly dismal results at one remove

this is important, it’s worth the risk of double posting:

consume veggie

https://i.imgur.com/fLKLLwx.jpg

love music

https://i.imgur.com/986xDef.jpg

https://softerdrive.bandcamp.com/releases

I like your smudgy puff

i like her too!!!!!!! very very much!!!!!!!!!!!

https://i.imgur.com/FmJ94bF.jpg

♥️ ♥️

Yowzah!

Everyone get in here and post photos of your cats!

Gus before an arvo beer

https://i.imgur.com/tymdLT0.jpg

Gus after an arvo beer

https://i.imgur.com/F3YJvV1.jpg

lol

https://i.imgur.com/Z5hJm9b.jpg?1

bones is goin outside over my dead body

would snorgle all this kitties by golly

bones looks very proper

these cats look nice enough, but their looks belie a bird murdering rage

We had one cat who wanted to be an outside cat so desperately. In order to enter the house, you would have to open the door a crack and stick your foot through it to shoo him away and interrupt his escape plans. His escapes were successful a few times. Once, he fell out of a tall tree and ended up with some serious bruising. I tried harness training him, but he never enjoyed it.

The three cats we have now show little interest in going outside, even though two of them were literal strays we rescued from an abandoned house in our neighborhood. They have spent hours trying to get at our parakeets though and once successfully caught one. That bird survives until this day, despite having been plucked from the literal jaws of death. I've bought them feather-chasing toys such as Da Bird and Mystery Motion. Those help a lot with exercising their hunting instincts.

Murder on their minds:
https://i.imgur.com/5QZvGMl.jpg

My girl Connie, who I relate to a lot:
https://i.imgur.com/RzTRgo6.jpg

Here's the two weird ways Oscar has been sleeping lately:

https://i.imgur.com/BTlWHyi.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Afv6j0F.jpg