Marvel Cinematic Universe, Phase 4 & Beyond (and a chance to change your vote)

pic.twitter.com/e5RXCOBt5e

— Ignatius Goodle (@Goodle__) December 16, 2021

(tbf, "Into the Spider-Verse" already used that joke)

not live action tho

Just got out, thought it was pretty good, canoes and Easter eggs everywhere. Honestly didn’t expect it to be so heavy at points (within the scope of these universes etc etc).

New "Hawkeye" ep was pretty good, and the perfect platform from which to launch my new Marvel all-in crossover event, "Everyone's a Ninja."

Florence Pugh is so effortlessly funny and charismatic - felt bad for Steinfeld and how easily she was eclipsed in that scene in the apartment.

the post-blip return scene was cool but no one ever talks about the people who blipped out say, at sea or on a plane or in a renovated building. Yikes.

They should all have blipped back naked, that would have been something.

I did think it was funny how Barton, who seems like a guy who hates being dragged off the couch when SportsCenter is on, apparently turns into Batman when he wears a hoodie.

It's really odd to me that they didn't include any scenes of Clint being impressed by Kate at all. He sees that she has trophies, ok, but then she goes beyond that and does superhero-hawkeye level archery and Clint seems unfazed by this. They even set it up nicely in the car chase by the circumstances forcing Clint to drive. He says something about her driving so he can hawkeye all the bad guys, but there is no time and it's up to Kate. Beautiful, cue her hitting impossible shots that are far beyond what anyone can expect even from a champion with a bunch of competition trophies, show Clint glancing over in disbelief because he's never seen anyone else anywhere close to his superhuman archery skill. Hmm... hey... uh, hey guys, it looks like that important scene that I just described that validates Kate's ability to the audience is missing?

The obvious pushback to this comment is they show how good she is to the audience obviously, but still without Clint shown explicitly being even a little impressed (he really does seem to not care at any point from what I saw), as a viewer I'm still unsure whether we're meant to assume other elite archers could also do what she has done so far, or is she the best of the best (actual superhero ability) like him? He isn't just well trained, he has superhuman perfect aim.

I can't remember, doesn't he concede that she is indeed really, really good? The vibe I get is that he is impressed but keeping his feelings in check because first and foremost he wants her to be safe. He doesn't want to encourage her even though he recognizes her talents because he knows the price she'll likely pay (which he did explain to her). Has this show depicted anyone actually killed yet? Will this particular show *let* her be a killer?

Yeah, Ronin offed Echo's dad, for one.

That's Ronin in a flashback, though, before Hawkeye reformed. And of course Widow's sister has killed a million people, too. But will they let her kill here, going forward? Will Hawkeye? Will Kate? Will Kingpin? Certainly won't have a death count like the Daredevil show.

(Also, fwiw, they didn't show Echo's dad getting killed, they showed him dying. Not saying he wasn't killed by Ronin, just wondering what Disney's standards of violence might be, or what they're going to let the good guys get away with.)

To answer the first question, I honestly don't remember Clint having a scene of acknowledgement, so as a viewer I'm left wondering if she is good or superhero good. Clint stamp of approval is the only way we would know. Did I forget about the sort of scene I'm describing? It's possible I missed it.

Good question about whether they'll let Kate kill. The tracksuit mafia are lovable comic relief dopes so they're a little off the table. The ones Clint shot at the warehouse were sort of ambiguously injured (except for that one that got shot in the hand). If she ends up killing someone it will probably be a heavy scene and would represent a point of no return.

Sorry I was sort of both talking about deaths in this show in general and the prospect of Kate killing in the same breath, hopefully not too confusing.

Pretty sure in episode 4 Clint acknowledged that Kate really was one of the best archers in the world (can’t remember the exact wording)

That's what I thought.

Well that's good! I guess all I remember is him brooding the whole time so it must not have stood out for me.

I think he was brooding because he knew she was really good but saw where that was going and didn't want her to get hurt. But iirc there's a trick shot during the car chase the other ep where he shoots an arrow at her descending arrow to direct it or something, and I think that was meant to convey (through the act, through her reaction) that he's still a lot better than she is. She did pick up on the coin trick pretty fast, though!

I just double checked the episode.
When they're on the subway train after the car chase he says "You're not wrong to call yourself one of the world's greatest archers" while she's talking about walking the dog.
Also he shoots her arrow to hit it with a Pym particle arrow and massively increase its size to take out a tracksuit mafia truck speeding up to crash into them.

Hah, yeah, that's right. Still, I'd count hitting another arrow in mid-flight as proof that you're probably the best.

It's jarring every time I'm reminded that Clint has a wife & kids; they're trying their best to square that with his "sullen loner" vibe, but maybe not entirely successfully.

I thought it was funny that his wife didn't at all suspect him of, you know, being unfaithful – even just for dramatic enhancement – when they talk on the phone and he's all - "Yeeeeah, Honey... I dunno, things are really bad here, I think it's gonna be another couple of days. Boy, it's just a mess, the 'big man' may be involved. I'm working closely with this girl who grew up obsessed with me, it's all good, will keep you posted!"

Does she exist in the comics? Because in the show she seems very much a partner in every sense. She knows other languages (German?) to speak to him so her kids won't understand, she knows her husband was a murderer-for-hire, she researched stuff for him and so on. She clearly seems to be used to hiding out and moving around and otherwise being in danger.

I don't think so. He was married to Mockingbird at one point.

She might still turn out to be Mockingbird. She’s obviously got a past that hasn’t been revealed yet

Well Bobbi Morse exists in the MCU, right? (played by Adrianne Palicki)

Not sure that’s canon anymore, but there’s still a possibility she could be another version of Mockingbird

Hawkeye had a family in The Ultimates. They got slaughtered iirc. Fucken Millar.

...at least THAT'S non-canon.

Spidermens is ok. Feels a little overstuffed and most of the baddies are still weak sauce IMO. Zendaya gives the best performance in the film. RIP Marisa Tomei's horrible Aunt Mae outfits.

i asked my physical therapist to spoil it for me and she flatly refused saying "i wouldn't ruin it for you or for anyone," even after i told here that the chances I see it before it leaks to the internet are basically zero. Lol, fanboys are crazy these days.

can somebody spoil it for me here? what are the big SHOCK REVEALS.

(use the spoiler tags obvs) or don't i don't care lol

I mean, please don’t go out of your way to that (at least without tags). I won’t be able to take my kid for a few weeks, and would prefer to save a little mystery for myself!

all three spidermens are in this for a fair amount of the movie, like half of it at least. So are Doc Oct (no surprise there), Willem Defoe as Green Goblin, Jaimie Foxx as electro, what's his name as sand dude, and that lizard thing I tried to forget about. Garfield and McGuire both good; McGuire really showing his age now though. It's very clear how much each actor studied the others for speech patterns. Aunt Mae dies. Everything is reset and at the end no one remembers Peter at all, and he is all alone at the end. Venom makes a mid-credits appearance (voice and goo that is, not Tom Hardy).

aw, that's all stuff i already knew! i was hoping maybe lady thor shows up or something.

anyways, thanks for full spoiling. i just wanna be aware of what the popular understanding of these characters is, i don't wanna watch it.

adding on another post credits scene, a preview of the next Dr Strange film: he goes to Wanda for help sorting out the mess he started here. Might also be useful to check out the Dr Strange and finale episodes of "What If?" - parts of the preview hinted at a link to that.

I quite liked this Spidey movie, better than the last one I think, though still not as good as the first or Spider-Verse (obvs). I mostly appreciated the course correction wrt to Peter Parker's character: he isn't the next Tony Stark after all. He's just Peter Parker, no. 27 of infinity. surprisingly bleak/bittersweet ending.

oh the other cameo is charlie cox as daredevil. dunno if this means he will start showing up in other things but it was a decent little scene

hm, that explains all the static i picked up about the netflix characters reintegration into the MCU

A mere $260 million earned in the US so far, clearly a flop.

Saw the @SpiderManMovie (thank you @screenxofficial)! And I tried to be a big boy, I really did! but alas...
WARNING: BRING TISSUES!
1) For the joy jizz, when you see your favorite good & bad guys from childhood all together up on the silver screen! 2) For all the feels & tears! pic.twitter.com/55hezLnjxl

— KevinSmith (@ThatKevinSmith) December 17, 2021

At this point I think the jorts were less embarrassing than a 51 year-old man tweeting out "joy jizz".

still not his worst tweet

for sure, still gross

You remember, your childhood, when this digital image was published.

Hawkeye final episode was about what I figured, which not a complaint -- though there are a few moments I'll headscratch at. The 'Christmas gift' at the end is a nice touch.

Dang, you hit it early! Haha

One of those cases where I figured my timeline will unavoidably spoil the hell out of it, so.

I’m firing it up now…