Marvel Cinematic Universe, Phase 4 & Beyond (and a chance to change your vote)

is anyone going to see this new movie? feels like it was unwise to release this to theaters only right now.

Nope, gonna have to wait the 45 days until it comes to Disney+. My son was disappointed we have to wait, seeing as how close this came out to his birthday, but not ready to take him, unvaxxed, in a crowded theater (nor does he really want to, he just was hoping it would have been handled like Black Widow).

I'm going, probably Sunday if the day job doesn't get in the way. Maybe tomorrow.

Going back to at least like Iron Man 3, I'd previously seen every MCU on opening weekend. Won't be seeing either of the last two until next month on D+.

And I agree that it's unwise for them to be releasing this the way they're releasing it. I might even say outright stupid.

My guess is a reaction to ScarJo's suit? They have to make good on the "in theaters only" exclusive thing?

Obviously I have no idea what it might mean from a legal standpoint, or what they are contractually obligated to do, but I wouldn't be surprised to see the "Premier Access on D+" kick in after just a few weeks if this underperforms.

I think I read it's going to standard Disney+ sometime in October, just after Black Widow does likewise.

I spent way too much time going "how would her costume affect the way they release these movies, that makes no sense"

xpost - Right, that's the current plan. I'm just wondering it this underperforms they might say, "screw it, let's see if we can milk some more cash out of the Premier Access thing until it hits the free tier". I mean, I know we can't be the only family that would willingly plop down the $20 to watch it sooner but won't go to a theater now.

lol DJP

"i mean sure it's a racist backstory but we're pretending that doesn't exist anymore WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM US HERE"
https://screenrant.com/shang-chi-marvel-china-release-movie-backlash-explained/

i'm guessing the real reason is more related to chloe zhao tbh

Why? I'm assuming that would be the case for Eternals, but not sure why it would impact the Shang-Chi plans.

china being an 800 pound gorilla to marvel studios in general is my thinking?

anyway, if you care (spoilers obviously):
https://www.vulture.com/2021/09/shang-chi-legend-of-the-ten-rings-post-credit-scenes-explained.html

I don’t know what it’s like elsewhere but cinemas in London have not been crowded, or anywhere close to it, since before the pandemic. Even for opening weekends of big blockbusters.

i hope marvel takes advantage of the irony of letitia playing a scientist

“what you’re saying is completely unscientific!”
“i just want you to think for yourself..”

How is the fight/stunt choreography in the new one?

Will know tomorrow.

TEN-RINGS TONY - the good!
Combat scenes in the early stages are quite coherent by Marvel standards.
TONY LEUNG!
MICHELLE YEOH!
Fight scene between Leung & Fala Chen is unusually erotic by Marvel standards thanks to Leung’s micro-expressions; getting his ass kicked is a turn-on!

— Anne Billson (@AnneBillson) September 4, 2021

TEN-RINGS TONY - the not so good!
Directing is opposite of fleet-footed; should have channeled Tsui Hark/Lau Kar-leung.
Usual dreary Marvel father issues/dead mother woes. Yawn.
Third act degenerates into the usual Marvel CGI sound & fury n’importe quoi where you cease to care.

— Anne Billson (@AnneBillson) September 4, 2021

Looks like it's a big hit.

I generally find Marvel combat scenes quite coherent by modern franchise blockbuster standards.

Yeah, I think they've been okay on coherence since the (terrible) end of the first Avengers movie. The fight scenes at the end of Black Panther, GOTG1, WandaVision etc. are definitely coherent! They're just a bit shit compared to what came before.

Reviews seem uniform in saying the Shang Chi movie doesn't rely on lazy Asian stereotypes, which is really hard to believe given the trailer, but if it's so it's so

Most of the movie bends over backwards to skewer lazy Asian stereotypes

anything otherwise would be profoundly stupid given the importance of chinese audiences for these movies

and for other reasons too obv!

Fighting was good, probably the best we've seen in the MCU. Tony Leung was fantastic particularly. Movie overall was just solid, not top tier Marvel. I'd place it a notch over Black Widow. Had to be happy just to see every Asian and Asian-American on-screen, honestly.

Made the effort to contribute to this weekend's opening box office, as afraid as I was of the pandemic. Went to a very late showing last night with like six other people in the theater.

The third episode of What If…? was ridiculous in leaning on the grimness

I felt like it would have been more in the spirit of What If for Nick Fury to put on the Iron Man armor. Its whole thing is "things are different but somehow end up being kind of the same."

Also suffered from the fact that a What If is supposed to start by DEPICTING the alteration that changes history downstream, which this one, for obvious reasons, doesn't.

I may be too uptight about what counts as What If.

On Shang-Chi -- the last big fight was disappointing IMO, overcrowded and color graded down to a murky dusk for a scene that took place at dawn, but the bus and scaffold scenes were amazing. The fewer the characters, the better the fight in this case. Good performances -- Liu and Awkwafina have a great BFF vibe and omg is Liu great to look at or what. The elements shoehorning Shang-Chi into the MCU feel forced, but the elements shoehorning him into the Marvel print universe in the 1970s/80s felt forced too*, so I'm kind of okay with that. It's a very good MCU entry. Maybe not top tier? Requires further consideration.

(*Except for the Man-Thing issue, which I've always loved.)

The fewer the characters, the better the fight in this case.

I think this is actually almost always true throughout MCU

There are a couple of big free-for-alls I like in earlier movies, but mostly yeah.

The Civil War airport fight being an honourable exception.

For some reason I really like when they end in ott melee chaos, like Iron Man 3 and Black Widow.

I did love Katy being all “I just learned how to shoot an arrow yesterday!!!!”

I thought this was a lot of fun. Sure, some of the silly stuff was, well, silly, but it mostly flows really well. And it helps to have a real movie star as the villain. Given I know nothing about the titular character and had my doubts, I give up, I think this monolith MCU endeavor is capable of keeping the imperial streak going indefinitely. Just a matter of occasionally whittling down the number of superpowered heroes.

We watched the first Captain America movie over the weekend (one of the many of these I haven't seen). It was good, somewhat better than I expected (or at least it had a modest vibe and some charms I didn't expect). We also recently watched the second of the new Spider-Man movies... didn't like that one too much, but whatever. I guess if you don't like one particular cinematic Spider-Man, wait a few years, right?

Oooh, you are in for some treats with Winter Soldier and Civil War if you haven't seen those yet

First Holland Spidey is top-tier MCU. Second Holland Spidey...nnnnnnotsomuch.

Didn't like it as much as Homecoming, but still thought it was pretty great, esp. Mysterio.

Yeah, I do think Homecoming is good, we've watched that a few times.

My kid wants to see Winter Soldier next, so guess we will (someone told me IRL that it's their all-time favorite Marvel movie).

For those who don't care to go too deep, the list is basically: Cap 1 & 2, Iron Man 1, Spidey 1, Thor 3, Black Panther. If you aren't feeling any of those, you can safely shut it down.

(NB, have not seen either of the pandemic-era Marvels)

Cool – I also saw Iron Man OG (in the theater, little did I know what it was kicking off); and liked Ragnarok a lot too.

Ant-Man is one of the others I’ve seen and thought was fun and offbeat (at least except/until some of the generic fight stuff toward the end).

We always believed in you, @simuliu. And if being a super hero doesn’t work out, our door is always open: https://t.co/GhGMYwOdom

— iStock (@iStock) September 7, 2021

Ant-Man is one of the others I’ve seen and thought was fun and offbeat (at least except/until some of the generic fight stuff toward the end).

Ant-Man & The Wasp is more of the same except better.

For those who don't care to go too deep, the list is basically: Cap 1 & 2, Iron Man 1, Spidey 1, Thor 3, Black Panther.

I'd maybe add Guardians 1?

And doc strange surely

Black Panther I think is the only one I haven't seen a second time. It may, however, also be one of the few everyone in my family has seen, even my wife, for whatever reason. I could see watching Shang-Chi in theatres a second time at some point, the action in that one I felt took good advantage of the space. Speaking of which, I'd never thought about it or noticed, but I guess all the Marvel movies are in (more or less) Scope *except* The Avengers and Ant-Man.

And also speaking of action, Shang-Chi and Black Widow do both lean haaaaaaard into the impervious human heroes mode, which is a modest problem I had with both. If they're essentially harm-proof before they even get magic rings or fresh weapons then the fighting does become just variations of pachinko with people in place of little balls. When Shang-Chi gets his special armor in the movie I thought, huh, why bother? Is it just to get him out of the hoodie he's been wearing the entire movie?

To be fair, every action movie in the last forty years (maybe even longer) grants the main characters the ability to avoid harm in a seemingly superhero fashion, not sure that's unique to Marvel at this point.