Mostly Apolitical Thread for Discussing/Venting our Rational/Irrational COVID-19 Fears and Experiences in 2020

well, yeah.

I wish elementary schools would stop focusing on "perfect attendance" and rewarding it, because I think that really reinforces this idea that you should send your kid to school NO MATTER WHAT.

It was literally my job to do this for 5 years, to incentivize kids toward perfect attendance and give them prizes for coming to school sick basically. Not great.

Before you @ me, we had a big grant that was mandated for that purpose which we got for political/borderline fraudulent reasons because our daily attendance was already extremely high, it was just a resource grab by the principal. So I had to spend a lot of money and then show how it had "helped" but the thing I was supposed to spend it on was not needed or wanted, ie nobody has 100% attendance unless they came to school sick and their families never went anywhere.

Rapid test came back negative. Sometimes cold symptoms are just cold symptoms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WxDTEszGJQ

Our high school has a weekly dashboard with covid stats. Just for your proxy fun:

Aug. 13-19 there was one positive student, 11 students in quarantine (due to close contact), 1 positive employee, 1 employee in quarantine
Aug. 20-26 there were 2 positive students, 87 in quarantine (due to close contact), 4 positive employees, 5 in quarantine (due to close contact)

For reference, this is in a school of about 3600 kids, with approximately 73% having provided proof of vax. There is no vax requirement as of yet, but that's already been announced for staff and teachers, who are largely vaxxed but required by the state to be vaxxed by October. Kids and teachers who are vaxxed and have no symptoms do not need to quarantine, even if they've been exposed or in close contact with a positive case. We did some back of the envelope math and figure about 8 kids in each class of say 30 may not be vaccinated, or have not provided proof of vaccination, so if one kid tests positive and makes it through a day of classes, that could be 8 kids per period that would need to quarantine, barring additional vaxxed kids with symptoms who then test positive (and clearly there have not been many/any of them yet). The school, afaict, is keeping track of those that have not yet provided proof of vax, so it's less likely any of them are slipping through the cracks after covid exposure.

If one tiny shred of good comes out of this, perhaps it will be that the normalization of remote work / remote learning allows people with a cold to stay the fuck at home and still get (at least some) stuff done.

If my workplace is any indication, it isn't changing one iota. In fact, there seems to be a bizarre and even greater importance on "butts in seats" now than I've ever seen. In fact, in one of our "return to the office" Zooms, a high up essentially said "now that you've all had your 18 month vacation, there really is no excuse to not be in the office every day".

The capitalistic drive back to """"""normal""""" is in full force.

The “normal” is not sustainable environmentally or mentally. There has to be greater amount of telework in the future. Companies that insist on butts in seats five days a week should lose out to more flexible ones. I think states should also pass laws requiring reasonable accommodations for telework.

I'm with you. It's maddening to watch this from within.

Companies that insist on butts in seats five days a week should lose out to more flexible ones.

This is mos def happening in my work world, but I am well aware it's a privilege bubble. Companies hereabouts are desperate to attract and retain people, and are recruiting for almost all positions as fully remote, anywhere in the US.

i feel v fortunate that my company is fully embracing remote work and i am embracing it right back

hope all these other assholes follow suit soon

My favorite new twist in "must be back in the office" is that, quite understandably, almost no one is taking public transportation so it has resulted in 35-45 minute wait times just to EXIT the parking garage at the end of the day, regardless of the time you leave.

Started working freelance remotely again today after a few very slow months. I cleaned my home office. Have coffee, selzer, and vape pen by my side.

I was talking with my friend yesterday, noting that I haven't worn "work clothes" in more than a year, and never ever want to go back.

I taught in person in an actual classroom today; the last time I did so was in the same room 540 days ago. I had to actually think really hard about what I needed to wear after a summer of shorts and t-shirts and months of teaching online in pajama pants and a hooded sweatshirt.

My favorite new twist in "must be back in the office" is that, quite understandably, almost no one is taking public transportation so it has resulted in 35-45 minute wait times just to EXIT the parking garage at the end of the day, regardless of the time you leave.

Probably, but I'll be honest, until my son gets vaccinated I'm not exactly liking the idea of adding a crowded train on top of being back at the office full time. Seems like an extra vector that I can easily avoid for now.

I just encountered a new one (for me). My ... wife's stepsister's husband is a very smart guy who claims various medical conditions mean he should not get vaccinated. He is not a doctor, and this is no one's medical opinion, just his. And yet, he takes Covid very, very seriously. He wears an N95 mask whenever he leaves the house, which is exclusively to go to his home office, of which he is the only employee, at a different house he owns. Otherwise, he essentially never leaves the house. My mother in law and her husband were just there to hang with their granddaughter and offered to babysit so the parents could go out, and they even said no, because he's unvaccinated! That's ... I was going to say crazy, but he takes Covid so seriously even the prospect of vaccination is not enough for him to let his guard down, I guess. Irrational, I suppose? Which is also surprising from an MIT grad.

That's sad, but it makes sense to me that someone prone to health-related fears could be equally scared of illness and medication. I'm a bit like that myself - I have an irrational fear of allergic reactions that had me in a state of intense anxiety as I was getting my shot. Luckily I'm not that phobic and my fear of Covid outweighed my fear of the vaccine, but I feel bad for anyone who has that kind of phobia to a degree that's paralyzing.

"who claims various medical conditions mean he should not get vaccinated"

unless it was a previous severe reaction to a vaccine I can't imagine what that would be

Any time someone says they have a medical condition or allergy that keeps them from getting vaxxed, the first question that pops in my head is "did you discuss this with a doctor?"

Yeah. And as I posted, this is not a doctor's medical opinion.

There probably are a few among the unvaxxed who may have heard the worst about the side effects of the vaccines and it just short circuits their rationality.

Honestly over the last year I have been kind of annoyed by people going on about their vaccine side effects. I give myself an injection of beta interferon every week that has much worse side effects

I slept several hours longer than usual after each of my jabs. It was horrifying, truly the stuff of nightmares.

:)

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-58410584

Oh hey look

really don't know what your point is but glad someone has found the data now

we will never have better data about the long-term effects of covid-19 than today

kids can't just wait around 10 years for longitudinal studies to live their lives, they grow up

depressing to go down to the local men's shed and find out that everybody is a covid conspiracist. Maybe it should be expected.
BUt I don't think I was . From geezer i hadn't met who was repeating stories of how it had been proven that the virus was created by the US in a Wuhan lab to an old acquaintance who was talking about how everything was an attempt to control the public and we were going to have food shortages by the end of teh year as further control. Before lap[sing into some Climate change doubt.
I guess this is what people have been having to put up with regularly from people and it did seem that most people had been vaccinated.

But god I had hopes for what that resource might mean.

maybe covid conspiracy theorist.
NOt good taht one of them was also going on about the misuse and sale of National resources which was an actuality. maybe that is a mix people are also aware of elsewhere. Really was hoping for something else though.

I am in the middle of a four-week trial in downtown LA. We have 12 jurors and had three alternates - until one tested positive on Tuesday, and was excused. They notified the other jurors yesterday AFTER a full day in court. If we lose one more juror, we will have a mistrial and it won't get tried again until the middle of NEXT year. Of the 12 left, I could see several of them saying "Fuck THIS" and just not showing up, claiming a positive test.

I went and got tested yesterday and it came back negative. Will go and get the PCR test in about 5 days.

jesus. that sounds hellish.

(data reported from hospitals directly, beyond DeSantis's reach, so no concerns of accuracy)

BREAKING Florida

Continued slow improvement!

Hospitalizations down below 15K for first time since 8/8.
(Still WELL above earlier peaks).

ICU COVID down.

Still critical occupancy levels, but improvement is good!

Mask, Vaccinate, Test, Avoid high risk situations. pic.twitter.com/545DdBMFxy

— (((Howard Forman))) (@thehowie) September 2, 2021

Welp I already have a confirmed Covid case in one of my classes. That was fast!

I have no idea what I'm actually allowed to talk about online and it's prob not hard to figure out my name and where I work if anyone tried, so I guess maybe I'll finally join the 77 borad

Sharing more of our principal's high school transparency, for comparison's sake:

First off, I’m pleased to report that our vaccination rate is at 79% of students and 84% of employees, which exceeds the original overall target of 70% for approaching herd immunity. However, the Delta variant has changed the equation. According to our most recent guidance, a fully vaccinated rate of closer to 90% or higher is what we need to aim for now.

That’s a realistic target. Vaccination is safe and effective, and it remains the number one way to prevent the spread of COVID. I urge everyone eligible to get fully vaccinated as soon as possible.

Additional good news is that three weeks into the school year, our weekly number of positive cases of COVID has remained low--in the single digits. You can check the dashboard on our website to see weekly updates on the number of new COVID cases as well as persons in quarantine. One thing you won’t find on the dashboard this year are any thresholds for moving toward hybrid or fully remote learning, because per the state, these are not options this school year. In-person classes for all is the priority, and we have a variety of mitigations in place to ensure that we can follow that directive while keeping everyone in our building as safe and healthy as possible.

Our case numbers have included two outbreaks since classes began. Outbreak is a very specific term for which the criteria has changed, according to the Illinois Department of Public Health. Currently, an outbreak is defined as two epidemiologically linked cases where transmission is believed to have occurred at school between members of different households; last year the criteria for an outbreak was five such cases.

The first outbreak involved three employees, while the second involved five students. We are required to report all positive cases to the health department, which specifically investigates any outbreaks to determine the extent of the spread. We have been in very close contact with the health department, and it is not advising that we take any additional mitigation measures at this time. Our students are doing a fantastic job of complying with masking requirements, which goes a long way toward reducing COVID cases and outbreaks. Thank you.

as safe and healthy as possible

Feel like there are some words missing from the end of this sentence.

Good luck, Lily.

I volunteered a couple of shifts for Galway Arts Festival yesterday. Both had very few attendees , one is going to be circulated as a podcast, would love to have a permanent record of the other.
Both needed people to be masked throughout and asked people to sit in pods of 2 with a lot of space between them. & had initially asked people to have covid certificates as well as the volunteers. So that's a step in the right direction.
JUst reading people's fears of indoor venues above in the thread.

We have a long-planned, delayed for a year+ family function tonight. Relatively small, just a handful of out of towners, every single person totally vaxxed, and only 6 people over 60. Of those, two are extra cautious, with double masks even outside. Another couple just got back from a cross country road trip to visit other family, but they were as safe as they could be and regularly tested. The venue itself has a big back open patio that will get much use, and a big front window that can (and will) be opened up for extra circulation. So all things considered, I am hopeful this event can be pulled off ... uneventfully. Of course, between colds and allergies my entire family sounds sick already, but 'tis the season.

Next weekend is Pitchfork, and I'm pretty hopeful about that, too. It's always been among the most reasonable of festivals, and there's no reason to believe that streak will end when reason is needed the most.

Oh, and in the meantime, I learned more about my unvaxxed peripheral pseudo-family member and yeah, he's not crazy but he's a good example of how fear and hubris can make you overthink yourself into a corner. He does have a hereditary condition that requires medication that gives him pause when it comes to the vaccine. However, the condition he has would only potentially make a Covid case *worse.* In the meantime, he's come to his conclusions through "research," but as well researched as he may be, he's not a doctor, and if there was any more proof needed that some people will justify their bad decisions no matter what, this has apparently been the progression:

"I have a condition that my research has told me may make me a poor candidate for the vaccine."
What does your doctor say?
"My doctor said to get the vaccine, but he doesn't know about it as well as I do, and he doesn't really care, anyway."
So why not get a new doctor?
"There are no other good doctors here."
Why not contact an expert in your condition somewhere else and ask them?
"..."

Again, as far a I can tell he's not a total loon, but lunacy runs in his family. His dad is a doctor but supposedly estranged and some kind of kook as well, and his mom is a QAnon nut who they keep at arm's reach. So I guess on the spectrum he's better than the alternative, and he's by most accounts personally pretty cautious. Still, I have no idea what his end game is. He apparently said something about a new J&J vaccine in the works that could be safe for him (?), but in the meantime he's got a co-morbidity and a young kid, so he's kind of walking around with a big bullseye on his back.

another unfollow of a scientist/MPH I used to trust, based on this skewering by Dr Angela Rasmussen, who I trust much, much more:

Yep. Monica Gandhi has repeatedly pushed her “variolation” hypothesis as part of her larger back-to-normal optimism and COVID minimizing. Complete lack of humility or appreciation for the scientific method.

— Dr. Angela Rasmussen (@angie_rasmussen) September 7, 2021

always took Gandhi with more of a grain of salt than more reputed authorities, but it's frustrating that it's hard to tell whose voices to trust. I used to just wait for news articles to 'aggregate' scientific consensus but as the latest WaPo article shows, sometimes the media has a sketchy idea of who an 'expert' is or they get their conclusions completely wrong.

really hoping he and Topol don't regret these words but:

Worried about the Mu variant?

May be Lambda?

How about C.1.2? That sounds scary

Don't

While we are still learning, doubt they'll displace Delta

And our vaccines should hold up fine

I don't lose sleep over new variants

I worry about people's fatigue with the current one

— Ashish K. Jha, MD, MPH (@ashishkjha) September 6, 2021

honestly, excess fear about new VOI/VOC while we still have Delta utterly wreaking havoc seems misplaced. Some of these variants, like lambda, are literally already in the US, but in such small numbers that it can't compete with Delta.

there seems to be this belief that variants kind of just 'stand in line' and that when one finishes, another takes over. that is kind of what happened with Alpha - Delta, but only because both happened to be more transmissible than the last dominant strain. no evidence (yet) that any of these VOC are going to be as contagious as Delta - in fact, more likely that they're not.

also no evidence that prior immunity from Delta due to infection wouldn't help prevent infection with new variant, or that vaccines would be evaded to the point to be ineffective (almost all of the newest variants, like Lambda, and Mu, have few if any studies on vaccine effectiveness). What made Delta so formidable is how contagious it is, the much larger viral load. Basically gives vaccines a 'stress test'. If Delta were more virulent (meaning more deadly), but only as contagious, or less contagious than Alpha, we would be in a much different, less horrifying situation right now.

I think it's worthwhile keeping an eye on all of these as our understanding of the pandemic has shifted many times and predictions that looked good suddenly fell apart, so I think even Ashish would say "but things could change". but it seems any time I share any minorly positive news lately, friends respond "so what, the next variant is gonna come in and finish the job".

One of the newer twists I've seen the misinformation brigade pushing on Twitter recently is that the vaccines "were pushed out too soon". Not that these folks believe anything is necessarily wrong with the vaccine but, somehow, by starting the mass vaxx campaign while the virus was still raging it "forced new mutations" that wouldn't have happened if we had waited for the virus to take a more natural course. Essentially they argue we should have waited longer to get folks vaxxed? It's weird and being pushed by decidedly NON-experts who have shared misinformation in the past, but it seems to be popping up more frequently in the past week or so and I was wondering if some more prominent armchair expert was pushing this idea.

humanity got really lucky (well, and did the work/fought like fuck) that we had a vax ready to go. just thinking about what we’d be facing with delta otherwise gives me the fuckin creeps.

Exactly what keeps popping into my head when I read those batshit takes.

also the vaccines are actually helping to stop mutations, so those loonies are completely wrong there. not that you don't know that.

frustrating to see that plus the "all studies say masks don't work" being shared as bad received wisdom.

Ugh, yeah, that mask one seems to be back in full force as of late too.

We historically have never before had this level of micro-scrutiny on the development and mutation of a virus in both science and the public media. It's helpful to remember that. COVID does not mutate more or more rapidly than any other virus -- actually less rapidly than many on an absolute basis. My default is not to worry about a new variant unless there is demonstrated cause for worry, because the clickbait is going to keep coming and you'll never sleep.