bomb alerts and stuff

why intrigues me is why they left it to the point of getting to a tube train before stopping him.. maybe there would have been more options available for restraint etc?

They were following him, you loon. Then he went into the tube station and they decided it was unsafe to let him carry on.

Someone texted into 5Live with an unusually good point this morning:

If the policy is to stop a suspected suicide bomber the only safe way, by shooting them in the head, for fear any other course of action will allow them time to detonate themselves, then the logical conclusion of that is that it's also unsafe trying to shout "stop or I'll shoot" or whatever (at least if they're in a crowded area) – that also gives them the chance they need. So we're left with a real shoot-to-kill policy, rather than something that police chiefs are currently trying to describe as a "shoot-to-stop" policy that has the unfortunate but inevitable side-effect of killing people.

from this pov, it would have made more sense to confront him outside, cos the bomb would have been less effective in the open if he had gone that route.

x-post

exactly. the radio-texter's point is a very good one, but this is surely the only solution: try to challenge suspected bombers when they're out in the open, surrounded by as few people as possible.

it's amazing how little they're letting out, really, because it's making everybody paranoid.

exactly.

police hanging out stop'n'searching anyone of "asian" appearance randomly. maybe if there isnt another attempt imminently then it wont come to pass, but such a policy of basically putting all asian people under suspicion will be the nearest they can find to searching bags on the tube/all people (as was suggested immediately after the second attempts). it is a tactic that looks like it is pretty efficient to those who really want all "potential suicide bombers" to be shot, or nearest equivalent, and yet just about passes the "non-police state" test.

In russia anyone of a vaguely caucausian (chechen, georgian, dagestani, central asian generally) apperance, is checked by police who patrol ever metro station and major sites in cities. this is generalluy because they often dont have the right citizen papers so are bountiful for bribe taking, but in theory its for security.
of course, the multitude of bombings in metro stations and underpasses reveal just how effective this tactic is in keeping the city secure.

my friend (who was a scouser) for example got stopped 5 times on one journey of 30 mins duration.

Err, couldn't an electrical impulse from a stun gun have triggered a device?

depends on the device -- same goes for shooting, i think. i don't think *all* explosives go off if you shoot them.

This is probably Londoner-speak for "Leicester".

i like OTMBOT's post where he said we shd all ask people what's in their bags -- i'd reverse it: we should show the person next to us what's in out bag. it should be considred rude not to.

isn't this part of why they are shooting at people's heads rather than their bodies?

You told me that RJG, and then I heard some police guy on the radio contradict it. Who here knows about explosives?

but the real reason to shoot the head is to destroy the brain so the bomber (or electrician) cannot use his hands to detonate the bomb. a body shot has less immediate impact.

SPANKED UP MADMEN

HAVE YOU LEARNED NOTHING?

Tsk, Ed, "careless talk costs lives" in wartime.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/newspapers/today/img/1.jpg?Tuesday,%2026-Jul-2005%2000:49:28%20BST

http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/newspapers/today/img/8.jpg?Tuesday,%2026-Jul-2005%2000:49:30%20BST

Re: Acetone Peroxide from Wikipedia

"commonly used by amateur chemists and explosive makers, often for detonators, and is sometimes found in improvised explosive devices. It takes the form of a white crystalline powder with a distinctive acrid smell.

It is highly heat, friction, and shock sensitive. Professional chemists have been injured attempting to use it. Once manufactured the material can degrade during storage, becoming less likely to explode."

This was the stuff that was used on July 7, I think. I'm assuming that a gunshot could provide the requisite shock to set it off.

blimey they were on *benefits*? dyou think they were into kiddie porn and all?

Yeah I know tabloids and logic etc etc but still.

Anyway, I'm sure I'll be told off for that opinion.