not read Caste, but i read a review, and it seemed like it was much more interested in applying the idea of caste to US society than casteism as practised elsewhere, so IDK if I need more about racism in the US in my life.
― candyman, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:28 (three years ago) link
xpost casteism was not imposed by european influence but it was affected by it, at times manipulated by it, and other times used as an opportunity to exacerbate pre existing divisions.
― candyman, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:29 (three years ago) link
FWIW, I recently heard some commentator (can't remember where) define Racism as a product of the scientific age, and dated it to the 19th Century. It used the flimsy veneer of science (or rather pseudoscience) to categorize different groups, with white anglo-saxons perched atop everyone else. Of course prejudice and bigotry have been around forever, but racism and racialism are decidedly modern ideas (according to this author and I can't recall her name).
― Andy the Grasshopper, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:29 (three years ago) link
Was it one or both of the Fields sisters (authors of Racecraft)?
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:34 (three years ago) link
I honestly don't recall.. I think I was making dinner with the radio on
― Andy the Grasshopper, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:37 (three years ago) link
yeah, racial science is def a big component.
did you guys comment on this?
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/04/19/uk/un-uk-race-report-intl-gbr/index.html
― candyman, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:37 (three years ago) link
the development & formulation of scientific antisemitism, from but distinct from anti-judaism in the revolutionary/colonial era, is instructive here I think
― Left, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:46 (three years ago) link
UK pol thread talked about the report I think, which was clearly intended as a deliberate fuck you
― Left, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:48 (three years ago) link
the UN criticism being on an empirical basis seems to miss that part of it
― Left, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:50 (three years ago) link
I thought Angela Saini's book Superior was very good at debunking Race Science while covering its history and looking at its reappearance in recent years. Also left me even more disgusted at the theatre group I talked about above since she showed why the project we were working on was looking at things in a very wrong way. Quite apart from the tokenism and supporting what I had been thinking at the time.
― Stevolende, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:53 (three years ago) link
Oh & that was before Black lives Matter became a worldwide movement with great momentum.& I would think most things would need to be reassessed in teh light of that.So hope more things are before somebody manages to whitewash everything again.Would be so good if that farcical UK report acted as a catalyst more than anything else. I know a lot of people are seriously angry about that and should be
― Stevolende, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 16:57 (three years ago) link
It may well be Saini that I heard on the radio.. I just looked at a Guardian review of that book
― Andy the Grasshopper, Tuesday, 11 May 2021 17:10 (three years ago) link
One thing I tend to hammer on in periodic Facebook posts — a very effective way of influencing people, obv — is the specific economic underpinnings of American racism. (True in many other varieties of racism too, of course.) Slavery was an economic system, as was sharecropping, as was convict-leasing, as is the low-wage work performed by undocumented immigrants, all of them made palatable by the encouragement of a belief that the people performing the enslaved/low-wage work are inferior in one way or another.
American discussions of racism have for so long focused on individual thoughts and attitudes, without engaging with the forces that fostered them.
― a man often referred to in the news media as the Duke of Saxony (tipsy mothra), Tuesday, 11 May 2021 17:14 (three years ago) link
I am intrigued by how a person who can be seen to have a white saviour complex does see themselves. Is the answer in the question in as much as they're seeing their inept misapplication of misunderstood thought to be purely benevolent and more conscious than the people they're treading on.Assuming that it is a basic misunderstanding of things and that anything more intentional would go by another name. BUt it may be more harmful in its ineptness. I dunno.Like struck by the idea that a perfect parasite doesn't kill its host too.
― Stevolende, Wednesday, 12 May 2021 09:25 (three years ago) link
discussed on the desus/mero thread but here's ziwe on showtimehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP8xKsIpxAI
― Draymond is "Mr Dumpy" (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 12 May 2021 17:17 (three years ago) link
ok, lol @ all persistence matters
― Deicide at Chuck E. Cheese (PBKR), Wednesday, 12 May 2021 17:36 (three years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY6_QrOdwfo
― Draymond is "Mr Dumpy" (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 12 May 2021 18:22 (three years ago) link
swinging back to that depressing SNL video upthread
Bless this guy and his new series: “How everything on [TikTok] originated from Black culture” pic.twitter.com/nNOWfEJaLc— black boy bulletin (he/him) (@blkboybulletin) May 12, 2021
― Draymond is "Mr Dumpy" (forksclovetofu), Friday, 14 May 2021 18:47 (three years ago) link
The NFL says it will halt the use of “race-norming” — which assumed Black players started out with lower cognitive functioning — in a $1 billion settlement of brain injury claims. The practice had made it harder for Black players to qualify.https://t.co/OQpzSD88xM— The Associated Press (@AP) June 2, 2021
― rob, Wednesday, 2 June 2021 20:27 (three years ago) link
uh
― 80's hair metal , and good praise music ! (DJP), Wednesday, 2 June 2021 20:31 (three years ago) link
I have profoundly low expectations for the NFL, but this is still shocking
― rob, Wednesday, 2 June 2021 20:32 (three years ago) link
"The standards were created in the 1990s in hopes of offering more appropriate treatment to dementia "
"more appropriate"
― DJI, Wednesday, 2 June 2021 20:53 (three years ago) link
wtaf?
― Are Animated Dads Getting Hotter? (Tom D.), Wednesday, 2 June 2021 21:58 (three years ago) link
ALAB pod (iirc) did a good episode on this topic
― intern at pelican brief consulting (Simon H.), Wednesday, 2 June 2021 22:08 (three years ago) link
had to read that tweet several times to make sure i understood what i was seeing
― Draymond is "Mr Dumpy" (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 2 June 2021 22:09 (three years ago) link
That is unreal
― bruce spr!ngisH3r3 (Whiney G. Weingarten), Thursday, 3 June 2021 01:58 (three years ago) link
I thought Angela Saini's book Superior was pretty good on the history of race science and what was inherently wrong with it. Assume it's not the only one that's good and would like to know others was pretty succinct and understandable though.But sounds like just another element of misrepresentation of ethnicity in medicine and I think especially US medicine. Up with black people don't feel pain for useful knowledge for medical practitioners or more likely not. Wonder who did the research leading to this conclusion and if they had any other agenda at all.
― Stevolende, Thursday, 3 June 2021 06:46 (three years ago) link
I, too, did not realize the NFL’s racism could still shock me. Heads need to roll.
― horseshoe, Thursday, 3 June 2021 12:51 (three years ago) link
I haven't watched a single NFL game in many years now. Given the possibility of the Bears having a decent QB again, I was considering watching a game or two this fall, but nope, fuck this organization forever.
― a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Thursday, 3 June 2021 14:41 (three years ago) link
Stevolende: it's been a long time since I looked at it, but Stephen Jay Gould's The Mismeasure of Man might be of interest. It's from 1981, so I'm not sure how it's aged, but I just read this article five minutes ago, so apparently it's at least somewhat evergreen: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/pupil-size-is-a-marker-of-intelligence/.
― rob, Thursday, 3 June 2021 15:40 (three years ago) link
thanks
― Stevolende, Thursday, 3 June 2021 16:18 (three years ago) link
so this sentence:
The standards were created in the 1990s in hopes of offering more appropriate treatment to dementia patients
implies that race-norming is common practice in testing for dementia treatment?
― Muswell Hillbilly Elegy (President Keyes), Thursday, 3 June 2021 16:54 (three years ago) link
it's common in a lot of medical procedures, I am learning today
― rob, Thursday, 3 June 2021 17:03 (three years ago) link
also Simon mentioned this, haven't listened myself: https://www.alabseries.com/episodes/episode-21-baked-in
― rob, Thursday, 3 June 2021 17:05 (three years ago) link
This has been talked about for years, certainly well before this article: https://www.statnews.com/2016/04/04/medical-students-beliefs-race-pain/
― 80's hair metal , and good praise music ! (DJP), Thursday, 3 June 2021 17:54 (three years ago) link
Also this, from 2013: https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=201128359
― 80's hair metal , and good praise music ! (DJP), Thursday, 3 June 2021 17:55 (three years ago) link
And this is from 2006: https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/racial-ethnic-variables-shape-experience-chronic-pain
― 80's hair metal , and good praise music ! (DJP), Thursday, 3 June 2021 17:58 (three years ago) link
pittsburgh
A black defense attorney spoke publicly about racism in the criminal justice system. As punishment, the local prosecutor refuses to offer any of his clients plea deals. https://t.co/1BQabCZgSx— josie duffy rice (@jduffyrice) June 3, 2021
― mookieproof, Thursday, 3 June 2021 18:11 (three years ago) link
Yes, I'd previously encountered the pain issue as well as some specific problems in dermatology, where medical pedagogy is often exclusively based on light skin (e.g., "look for signs of redness" when darker skin presents symptoms quite differently).
An example I saw after the nfl story: https://www.statnews.com/2021/06/03/vbac-calculator-birth-cesarean/
Plus these tweets allude to systemic problems:
“Race-norming” is built into medicine: calculators for renal function, pulmonary function, fever work ups in infants, vaginal birth after c-section. https://t.co/FCQM3L9nbQ— Esther Choo MD MPH (@choo_ek) June 3, 2021
This (like the NFL's decision to stop "race norming" for brain injury) is a good start. But these racist tech and procedures are endemic in medicine (consider the pulse oximeter, eGFR tests, spirometer, just to start). We need wholesale scrutiny and transformation. https://t.co/msWIrWuhaN— Shobita Parthasarathy 👩🏾🏫🧪📚🎙️ (@ShobitaP) June 3, 2021
― rob, Thursday, 3 June 2021 19:07 (three years ago) link
This looks helpful/technical/depressing: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMms2004740
― rob, Thursday, 3 June 2021 19:12 (three years ago) link
This quote seems, um, noteworthy:
The American Heart Association (AHA) Get with the Guidelines–Heart Failure Risk Score predicts the risk of death in patients admitted to the hospital.9 It assigns three additional points to any patient identified as “nonblack,” thereby categorizing all black patients as being at lower risk. The AHA does not provide a rationale for this adjustment. Clinicians are advised to use this risk score to guide decisions about referral to cardiology and allocation of health care resources.
― What's It All About, Althea? (Aimless), Thursday, 3 June 2021 19:40 (three years ago) link
btw did you all catch this
https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/04/us/memorial-day-black-history-cut-off/index.html
― 80's hair metal , and good praise music ! (DJP), Friday, 4 June 2021 14:37 (three years ago) link
I don’t know that this has been 100% confirmed but this is allegedly the auxiliary president of that chapter of the American Legion with her son:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Ohio/comments/ns11vm/this_is_apparently_the_son_of_cindy_suchan/
― 80's hair metal , and good praise music ! (DJP), Friday, 4 June 2021 14:44 (three years ago) link
This interview with Anthony Braxton is kinda breaking my brain. I'm not gonna pull out any quotes; just read the whole thing, if you're interested.
― but also fuck you (unperson), Sunday, 6 June 2021 19:07 (three years ago) link
This interview with Anthony Braxton🕸 is kinda breaking my brain. I'm not gonna pull out any quotes; just read the whole thing, if you're interested.
― Van Halen dot Senate dot flashlight (Boring, Maryland), Sunday, 6 June 2021 20:11 (three years ago) link
i am interested. i don’t think he was ever as overtly politically radical as many of his contemporaries. but some of these (overly familiar) talking points I hadn’t heard from him before and are frankly pretty disappointing. though not at all unprecedented coming from the academy. of course he doesn’t owe me anything
― Left, Sunday, 6 June 2021 20:42 (three years ago) link
it is hard for me to reconcile this boilerplate anti-anti-white stuff with his previous criticisms of white institutions for their suppression of black/african culture. and his rosy view of american past and (?)present with his ghost dance influenced music.
most bothersome isn’t that he’s not “woke” enough by current standards but that his views here are just so utterly mundane by anyone’s standards. let alone his own
― Left, Sunday, 6 June 2021 21:07 (three years ago) link
Not sure where to post this exactly but...
I’m at a Loudoun County school board meeting. Packed room. A debate over critical race theory in schools has divided this community in recent weeks. Tonight, for the first time in the pandemic, the public was allowed back in to these meetings. pic.twitter.com/w7zslWN0FM— amna (@IAmAmnaNawaz) June 8, 2021
This exact thing happened at our local school board meeting last night. The dipshits who have been yelling for a year to "open our schools" and "masks are child abuse" have gone full-on anti-CRT. I'm guessing this stuff will be getting covered as the new Tea Party.
― Muswell Hillbilly Elegy (President Keyes), Wednesday, 9 June 2021 13:08 (three years ago) link
do racists have rights too? LIke can't be critical of them can you?Have the right to their own personal martyrdom as long as somebody else can help them with it. Is that true, no canonisation without martyrdom.?Bloomin bloom.
― Stevolende, Wednesday, 9 June 2021 13:28 (three years ago) link
Like did strike me taht critical racist theory was a little apt since it would be openly critical of racists since that would be a central tenet of the information provided. The ideas that lead to racism recognised as being misinterpretations and misinformation. Which the teaching would be hoping to address and hopefully dispense with. Valorisation - superiority/inferiority being so utterly subjective that it would be better to dispense with them rather than bolster by institutional reinforcement
― Stevolende, Wednesday, 9 June 2021 13:31 (three years ago) link