outbreak! (ebola, sars, coronavirus, etc)

1 - tired of this shit
2 - need to have a medical procedure
3 - need to care for a relative
4 - a million other reasons, some defensible some not

i realise the united states is big and most people don't leave it very often if at all but much of the rest of the world is not like that, and people move between countries a lot

otm

My father is dying 800 miles away.

I'm staying put (partly because there's nothing I can do, and partly because I don't like him very much, but still).

I'm sorry to hear that, YMP, even if you don't like him very much.

This AstraZeneca vaccine story is a fucking mess.

Late yesterday evening, a story appeared in the German paper Handelsblatt, saying that the AZ/Oxford vaccine only has 8% efficacy for the over 65s. When the reporter was challenged to provide sources for this claim, he leaned on “members of the government coalition”, and did a long thread about the story essentially standing by it, ending with this:

7/I understand that some would like to see the story substantiated with actual data. However, this is not an academic preprint but a sourced piece of (political) reporting that tries to shed light on the decision making processes and the obstacles in the race for a Covid vaccine.

— Gregor Waschinski (@washingtonski) January 25, 2021

statement from the German health ministry:

"At first glance it seems that the [newspaper] reports have mixed up two things: about 8% of those tested in the AstraZeneca efficacy study were between 56 and 69, only 3-4 per cent over 70 (MHRA Approval Public Assessment Report)." https://t.co/rPW7RQimiH

— Jim Pickard (@PickardJE) January 26, 2021

lol

https://t.co/OXfXIzjhcx pic.twitter.com/TeCUmt0R04

— Daniel Howdon (@danielhowdon) January 26, 2021

Responses to Tracer's reasons:

1 - we're all sick of this shit, grow the fuck up
2 - if it's not a necessary procedure, then push it back
3 - okay, then stay in the country that you're travelling to with that relative?
4 - I can think of maybe a handful of defensible reasons why anyone should be traveling to a foreign country right now, and even those are questionably defensible

I'm just sick of what seem like excuses for shitty behavior.

Great:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/25/covid-linked-to-risk-of-mental-illness-and-brain-disorder-study-suggests

xps to table, thanks so much for the empathy towards those of us unlucky enough to be foreign and living in separate countries to our families, that is how I parsed TH’s post

It's almost as if there are people on ILX who don't live in North America? Could that be true?

Love u table but you need to chill. Sometimes life throws things at you and you have to make tough choices you wouldn't otherwise make. It's not like Tracer was advocating he was tired of lockdown and just wanted to throw down nachos and pitchers of margaritas at chilis.

I might lose my livelihood if I don't cross the Atlantic at some point this year because my employer has decided that it's necessary even though it absolutely isn't. To add insult to injury, this trip will cost me a small fortune if government-supervised hotel quarantines are implemented (spoiler: they're about to be). What should I do, quit? Until the Coming Libertarian Utopia™ is fulfilled, I'm afraid that's simply not an option. I suppose I'll be lumped in with all the snowbirds even though I'm not going South and I am perfectly aware that this trip is a dangerous waste of… just about everything, really.

wHy ThE fUcK aRe PeOpLe TrAvElLiNg To FoReIgN cOuNtRiEs

and yeah I’m fucking aggro about this, it’s been almost a year since I saw my parents and Leo fucking Varadkar is today telling me I can forget about this Christmas too?

But I guess it’s what I deserve for living in a different country to the one I’m from?

My coworker, who was Covid positive three months ago, just had a hellish New Year - had her elderly parents (late 70s) and sister for Christmas. every single person ended up infected - including her own children, while her husband was hospitalized and on oxygen for a week. Because of her own antibodies from the last time, she was the only one to pass safely through the outbreak.

Just say no to family, people

I mean, I understand there is a big spectrum of reasons for travel. But I think I'm justified in being disgusted with the photos from someone I went to HS with, first skiing in Michigan, arms around loads of people, unmasked (one of those people, also unmaked, runs multiple restaurants which are still open for takeaway and in person as of this weekend). Then she "really needs a break" so flies to Cabo, tons of photos of her and a big group of people on the beach, selfies with street vendors, etc, no masks. Not sorry, fuck her.

Nobody is justifying those fools itt, except, perhaps Dan S.

Seriously.

Pom I would be terrified of the consequences to me my wife and the dog if I quit my job rn but what your employer is imposing on you, to me that’s unconscionable and intolerable. However iirc your post is in academia so I expect it was very hard-won, and I’m just a middle manager at a housewares company.

^^^that sounds snarky it was not meant to be at all

Didn't scan as snarky in the least! And I completely agree – I was supposed to head back in October and managed to postpone my trip until this spring. Work-wise, my physical presence will not be necessary before January 2022, so insisting on having me there for no apparent reason this year is absurd and it's taking a toll on my mental health tbh. If anything, having this trip in the offing has had a negative impact on my productivity – it's lose-lose all around.

You don't have to be living in a separate country to not see your family for a year. Loads of people haven't.

(Also not meant to sound snarky! A reminder that lots of people have been locking down to this extent throughout particularly if family is old/vulnerable)

my stepmom has pretty much every preexisting condition you don't want in conjunction with Covid, so I've been able to see my Dad a few times, knowing they more than anybody have been keeping safe

my Mom on the other hand has been frustrating - she's been good (she worked as a contact tracer until the end of the year so she knows how serious this is) but her husband is still all over the place, seeing his grandkids and going sailing and all that, which means we effectively can't see her

You don't have to be living in a separate country to not see your family for a year. Loads of people haven't.

I had a colonoscopy last week, went fine. Had to get a COVID test two days prior, came up negative. everyone at the hospital was of course masked up the whole time. just saying, don't neglect your health because of COVID, all of the conditions and issues the human body may have to deal with didn't go away just because we're in a pandemic.

TMI but same here, evol. And I'm glad I had the procedure bc they found multiple (small, benign) polyps. Despite being in and out of waiting rooms full of ppl with mediocre mask etiquette I've been okay so far.

The hospital staff were getting their vax shots when I went in, so they're probably all done w the process already and it's just dodging other patients' exhalations from now on.

I've been in an out of hospital for months and will attend every weekday for the next month.

Mask wearing in hospital is a joke, with half the people there maskless or dicknosed. Many of them are coughing constantly.

Our Beloved NHS Heroes God Blessum don't do social distancing at all. One of them pushed in behind me in a revolving door today.

yeah i was in the hospital in august and the diversity of mask-wearing was surprising/alarming

gyac did you see my post saying that wasn't intended to be snarky? You blamed living in a different country for that situation. I was saying that - in addition to that situation - other people haven't seen family in a year. I didn't mean to imply anything about who does or doesn't deserve empathy.
I'm sorry but I'm genuinely not getting what point you're making about your in-laws. My reasons for not travelling abroad are also not frivolous...?

How silly of me, I forgot that if you’d been rude, immediately disclaiming it after meant that it didn’t count? By the way, the context of this is me replying to table being rude about people’s reasons for travelling abroad, so your point (which seems to be implying that I’m ignoring that people who’re from here in the same shit situation? Which I already knew because I’m married to one? Do we have to caveat every point we make in our posts so as to avoid this kind of thing now?) isn’t remotely relevant or necessary.

I wouldn't pay much attention to Leo gyac

no one has chatted more shite throughout this whole thing than him

and he changes his mind on a weekly basis

I can only apologise. No implication was intended that you were ignoring anything.
I'll leave this thread now as that's two people I've managed to upset without meaning to, for which I can only say sorry again.

He's a physician by trade, right? You'd think that would help.

xp

doctors can be pretty dumb

Especially when they’re dyed in the wool Thatcherites who enjoy human suffering.

I logically know that NN, but I know things are bad at home and I wouldn’t put it beyond them to be even worse than the public’s most authoritarian instincts.

I am this man at 1.06 forever when it comes to Leo Varadkar, basically.

As @campaignforleo turns 40, we asked people on Leo Street for their thoughts on the Taoiseach pic.twitter.com/vo727SCiJ8

— RTÉ News (@rtenews) January 18, 2019

(xp) My God, yes.

Even Dr. Sebastian Gorka?

I might lose my livelihood if I don't cross the Atlantic at some point this year because my employer has decided that it's necessary even though it absolutely isn't. To add insult to injury, this trip will cost me a small fortune if government-supervised hotel quarantines are implemented (spoiler: they're about to be). What should I do, quit? Until the Coming Libertarian Utopia™ is fulfilled, I'm afraid that's simply not an option. I suppose I'll be lumped in with all the snowbirds even though I'm not going South and I am perfectly aware that this trip is a dangerous waste of… just about everything, really.

― pomenitul, Tuesday, January 26, 2021 5:55 AM (three hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

i don't have any gripe against foreign travel if people quarantine both ways. just obvious that there's a lot of "business as usual" foreign travel going on without quarantine and that it is ludicrous that governments haven't done something about this already. my favourite uncle died last week, i won't be going home for the funeral - although it won't be for over 2 weeks due to COVID slowing down autopsies - because i can't afford last minute air fare plus 2 weeks in an airbnb when i arrive. the fact that i saw thousands of tourists here in the summer irks.

I agree that governments need to do something about it, and it looks like they're about to. I'm just upset because I'm getting the short end of the stick for reasons beyond my control. I do not want to travel this year at all – it's not reasonable or necessary in the least given my particular circumstances, and I wish my employer would fully understand this instead of assuming a bright spell is right around the corner. By the way, my wife is currently unemployed (on call as a substitute teacher but no one has requested her services yet – which is a mixed blessing), so quitting my job is even less of an option than the non-option it is to begin with. In any event, I'm sorry for your loss, jim.

im sorry you have to fly to britain for no reason because of a daft boss

So it's sound like these new variants are looking more and more likely to rely on boosters on top of the vaccine? I mean, okay, but if we can't even handle distributing the vaccine correctly, do boosters even matter? It's just increasingly hard to avoid complete and utter despair at the state of things.

Where did you read that?

speculations of various quality are being pushed out to the public and the public is not well-equipped to evaluate their relative merits

I guess it would be more accurate to say that we have no idea yet how these new variants will stack up with the existing vaccines. Everything I've read seems to indicate that, fortunately, they aren't dramatically different enough to render any of the approved vaccines useless, but that some of them may require a booster. I don't think any of that is controversial to state, we just don't know enough yet.

My despair comes from the lagging vaccination rates and the potential spread we could yet see with these variants and, if they do indeed require a booster, just how far behind the eight ball we may find ourselves.

speculations of various quality are being pushed out to the public and the public is not well-equipped to evaluate their relative merits

nbc, npr, fox news, propublica, newsweek, cnn, hannity, cbs, chapo, lester holt, breitbart, bbc, mark levin, the Belltown 'only good news', the pastor, the doctoral candidate, the eyewitness, chuck fucking todd, larry king, action news 5 investigative journalist, time-lapse camera footage, gorka

the public doesn't know how to evaluate anything, and a large part of the current tragedy is the realization that we should never, ever, ever, trust "the public" on anything, ever. that is demoralizing for true public servants

There was this, for instance:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/moderna-developing-vaccine-booster-shot-against-virus-strain-first-identified-in-south-africa-11611581400

xps

First tweet in thread, with 4000+ retweets and quote tweets. "Good and bad news." (What bad news? It was all-around excellent news). Finally, 22nd tweet with a clarification. Only 37 retweets and quote tweets. Don't do this people. Also don't get your information this way. pic.twitter.com/9jM4mOveYs

— zeynep tufekci (@zeynep) January 26, 2021

this feigl-ding guy is a seth abramson level grifter. will FP anyone who posts him here.

caek, does that mean you have FPd yourself?

insert DJ Khaled "congratulations, you played yourself" meme here

No idea how anyone in the gen pub is supposed to parse whether an efficacy drop is or is not 1/6th of 95%, smdh