Mostly Apolitical Thread for Discussing/Venting our Rational/Irrational COVID-19 Fears and Experiences in 2020

it feels very sudden! monday!

oh totally. it's just unbelievably frustrating that the bottleneck is not vaccine manufacture. there's millions of unused doses in the US. more than half. there should be none.

I heard someone on the radio yesterday (where they take covid calls with a doctor every Friday) talk about her late '20s daughter who had a very mild case but then started to develop migraines not long afterwards, and the doctor of course said it can't be ruled out as an aftereffect because no one knows what exactly what damage covid does. Personally, I find that kind of stressful. I'm pretty sure I had it with mild symptoms last March, and indeed the first couple of times I donated blood I tested positive for antibodies with a couple of different types of tests. The last couple of times, though, including blood draws for a study I'm participating in, they informed me I tested positive for the initial antibody test but not the other, which is called an inconsistent result. The guideline on the Red Cross site explains:

Inconsistent test result: Indicates that your initial antibody test was reactive for COVID-19 antibodies, while your secondary test came back negative for COVID-19 antibodies. As with all tests, false positives, or a test result that incorrectly states the presence of antibodies, can occur. Alternatively, the level of COVID-19 antibodies may be too low to be detected by the second test.

One reason a donor may have an inconsistent test result is that they received a COVID-19 vaccine. This is because the initial and secondary antibody test target different parts of the COVID-19 virus. It is possible that the initial antibody test used detected the presence of antibodies to one viral region (the same one used in the vaccine), while the secondary test (targeting a different region of the virus), was negative.

Now, I haven't had the vaccine, but I'd like to think that I have at least some sort of vaccine-like immunity from (probably) having covid. At the same time, knowing or even suspecting I had it, even a mild case, I still every once in a while wonder if a stuff nose or a fleeting chest congestion or anything like that is a lingering symptom.

you need to act like you’re just as susceptible as anyone else

1- you may not have had it
2- you may have had it but the case was mild enough that your antibody response was so weak that you’re not as protected in the future
3- a mutation could mean that none of that matters anyway

so it’s not worth stressing or thinking too much about imo

I know that already. But I'm assuming I had it, which is what the Red Cross told me both in writing and over the phone when they called me, based on the stricter secondary test they used multiple times. My only personal stress is that if I had it, however mild, I might have some mysterious related ailment pop up months later, too. Keep in mind, I am to blessed to be stressed.

I somehow totally missed that we had two days in a row with over 4000 COVID deaths. Fucking horrifying.

"somehow" -- maybe because there was a coup attempt

we had two days in a row with over 4000 COVID deaths

I don't feel very hopeful that there won't be at least one day over 5000 before mid-February or so, because when hospitals and healthcare workers exceed their maximum capacity the negative feedback loop will accelerate.

meanwhile in the uk, they have resorted to tv ads apparently featuring the chief medical officer saying "act like you have it" and "stay home or people will die". People are starting to get shook at how dire things are becoming. haven't seen my bubblemates since before xmas, we have agreed to cancel our weekly film night at least until he gets vaccinated - he works in the elderly care sector, but at a day centre where ppl are coming in and out and he also does relief work at a couple of other sites, which all feels like a recipe for disaster so I hope he gets the jab soon! He also told me a friend of ours just lost both parents to covid, a week apart. Awful :-( so it's all feeling closer than ever

how shook are ppl really tho? my bus to work isn't much less busy. I had to go to the supermarket yesterday and although ppl are wearing masks nobody is bothered about keeping distant & there were way more ppl in there than would have been allowed last summer. During the first lockdown I could p much step out into the road without looking, now there are fucking cars everywhere. The severe messaging has come too late and it just isn't sinking in, there has been so much vacillation - ffs the stupid cunts opened schools only to close them after 1 day all "oh actually you're right it is pretty drastic and they are a significant vector for infections, must have been looking at it upside down whoops" (& even so schools are a lot less closed now than they were in the summer)

fundamentally too the stay at home or ppl die message is pointless when they haven't abandoned their murderous "everyone get back to work" policy in any significant way. You are allowed out once a day for exercise and there must be absolutely no mixing of households - but you can still have a fucking cleaner come to your house. there is needless construction going on all over the place. as posted in the ukpol thread there are way more ppl taking the tube than there were last spring and the situation is far worse. we're fucked because the dipshits in power are allergic to helping ppl too much

it's ok tho because there's a plan to have all the over 70s & clinically extremely vulnerable ppl vaccinated by the middle of next month. The health service is being overwhelmed *now*. I haven't done the maths or read the sentences I just typed so I think it's all going to work out folks!

Yeah I'm wondering where all these people in cars are actually going, seeing as how no-one's supposed to be going anywhere. Scenic drives along the A406 or something?

I think a part is click and collect of one kind or another - food and shops are all still open, unlike March. That plus many more workplaces making people come in and I guess people trying to find less crowded parks.

(Parks are also likely more crowded because there are fewer hours of daylight. Ours are too busy but at least the big mixing groups have gone - as far as I could see it was mainly families and couples with the very occasional extra people)

masks have made people feel safer, which might explain the distance thing.

the stay at home or ppl die message is pointless when they haven't abandoned their murderous "everyone get back to work" policy in any significant way.

In real terms it's plain that the first message is pro forma and intended only to cover their arses and give the appearance of action, while the back to work policy carries the only message that's serious. good luck uk.

Woke up in the middle of the night to a brief wave of nausea/sweats on the second night home after spending a week visiting my father-in-law in hospice at my sister-in-law's. Started freaking out, but it has apparently passed.

Well damn, this quote knocked the wind out of me. This is the chief of emergency services at the hospital I work at (normally on-site, not now obv.)

"We are still admitting more than we are discharging which is obviously not sustainable long term," he said. "We still have capacity and are still able to care for both COVID and non-COVID patients, but filling up faster then we can sustain. We have never seen it this bad. I was the physician at the scene at the Columbine High School Shooting and in the ED for the Aurora Theater shootings and this is just as bad. Different, but just as bad."

I've seen people say similar about the 7/7 bombings. Hideous as it was, it was a one-off event and they had loads of outside support available.

ned, as a littleton resident present in area for both Columbine and Aurora i feel crazy shook reading that, and i hope you all to stay strong and smart. so sorry to read that, it's very rough news.

Hey, just an update from my last post of my elderly mom being released from the hospital.

Ok...so if your elderly parent/friend was given a prescribed steroid to combat covid, just know that your parent/friend can (and probably will - Christ, no-one told me of this was a very common side effect) suffer from mania! My mom is trying to buy me a condo, lol. I've been able to convince her that she's chemically instable for the next few weeks.
All the medical records tell me I have to navigate her for the next few weeks.

It's never over.

To be clear, I've done some drugs in my life - some of which made me feel like superman. And my mom is now feeling that way. LOL

I could tell she was way off after a minute or so of talking to her. She feels amazing now (of course, lol).

It’s very very very common to experience hypomania when taking steroids

That's what t was about when he had the vid. Innit.
Hard to tell what with the normal mania.

Or to put that another way t was trying to make out it was no big deal and he'd never felt better. Hope it didn't prompt magaheads to go and get the rona in sympathy. Cos I bet they wouldn't have watched where they were spreading it like.

I got a Bell's palsy for christmas, so have been on steroids - I was surprised my GP didn't warn me about interaction with my bipolar disorder! Was not a fun couple of weeks. Face is working again now though.

Glad you have a working face again dowd, sorry you had to deal with that.

Thanks, but it wasn't a big deal.

Obviously it's a small concern when compared to the still terrifying levels of deaths and hospitalizations we are seeing, but I have been spending a lot of time thinking about live concerts and how we really haven't had any sort of reckoning with how far away we are from being back to anything even remotely approaching "normal".

Obviously with the vaccine on the horizon and Fauci's comments about live events returning, in some form, maybe as soon as this Fall, people are thinking about it again. And these are undoubtedly good signs and puts us in a better position than we were six months. And, I am really thrilled that musicians will be back on stage and earning some money, that's a net good for the world, for a whole lot of reasons.

That said, I think it's going to be time measured in years, not months, before concert goers are back to any sort of regular attendance. First, and most obviously, we don't know what ramping this industry back up will look like. Capacities will likely be down, but does that mean 75% of pre-COVID crowds? 50%? 25%? Time will tell and it may be a slow climb back up, particularly for smaller, indoor venues.

But the one thing I haven't really seen anyone grapple with is how the demand for live concerts is going to be absolutely astronomical when they start up again, and rightfully so. People are hungry for it and will undoubtedly jump at the chance to see bands live again. Setting aside the logistical concerns of online sales selling out even more faster than ever before, I fear seeing what the ticket prices are going to be. I won't be at all surprised to see national touring act tickets being 3-5x what they were in pre-COVID times. Ticket prices on the secondhand market (fuckin' thanks again for that, Ticketmaster) are going to be unimaginably high for some time.

Hopefully I'm wrong and things will settle down sooner rather than later, but even pre-COVID times it felt like popular national (and international) touring acts and festivals were slowly becoming the playgrounds of the rich and I fear that situation is only going to be exacerbated when the industry ramps up again.

I mean, I'm not really concerned about those popular national touring acts? If you're enough of a dope to spend a ton of money on concert tickets for a stadium or arena show, then that's on you.

Bit more worried about smaller bands and venues, but maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

My concern is small arts organizations not making it.

Exactly. The number of literary arts venues and groups is going to drop precipitously the longer this continues.

Oh absolutely I'm most worried about the small, local venues and organizations. Definitely.

My point was separate from that, tl;dr I think the demand is going to drive ticket prices up to really high levels. I don't think it will impact the local jazz shows, house punk shows, DIY stuff in that respect, but I'm talking anything from the latest Pitchfork hyped bands on up to the Taylor Swift/BTS level mega-stars - I think those ticket prices are going to shoot into the stratosphere.

As a random example, let's say someone at the level of a Jason Isbell. Not exactly selling out arenas, but a lot of hype and support from indie radio stations. Last time he came through Chicago, I think ticket prices were around the $40-45 level. I won't be at all surprised that it costs three figures to see him on his next tour.

Oh yeah, for sure. I guess that I just *personally* don't care for any of that latter stuff, and can't imagine ever spending more than like $75 on a concert ticket. Most I ever spent was $250 for two tickets to see the Scissor Sisters open for Lady Gaga in early 2011 that was a gift for an ex.

(I also don't even know who Isbell is, which shows how much I actually keep track of this stuff)

Isbell is like one of the only bearable people in the universe adjacent to country

Oh yeah, I cringe at ever spending that much too, I just think that the higher prices are going to trickle down and even "known" touring bands hitting up 1,000 seat theaters (like, say, the Metro in Chicago) are going to be seeing triple digit ticket prices for awhile.

I mean, I hope I'm wrong! I just think the demand is really going to drive up ticket prices for a few years as things open up. But let's get there first and keep supporting the small, local places so they can still be around as an alternative!

Agreed!

the small arts org/venue that i am (was) on the board of tanked in June :/

I am really curious about the touring demand question, tbh i'm not 100% sold on the idea that there will be an explosion of pent-up demand for live entertainment, i am wondering if the opposite will happen, if the effect of 2+ years of fear and trauma will make many people reticent to immediately go back out and cram themselves into packed clubs and arenas. i think it could be just as likely that there will be a glut of supply as every act jumps to get back on the road while the audiences are still taking baby steps to reacclimate to normal pre-covid life

Pretty sure demand is going to be huge. I was thinking of this exact problem the other day and came to my personal conclusion that even if all of the bands I actually care about sold out too quickly or cost too much money or whatever, I'm going to go to as many shows as I can. Could be MC Hammer at a state fair or whatever.

There's always buying digital music and mail-order merch to support bands. Went much harder on that in 2020 than I have in many years

https://mixtapeclub.net

There's always buying digital music and mail-order merch to support bands. Went much harder on that in 2020 than I have in many years

Been doing a ton of each, to be sure! Still not a patch on the live music experience at all, imho. As of today, 361 days since I've seen a live show.

Sort of hit a point where lock downs in the UK feel weird - sort of wearying but not strict enough at the same time.

totally. feels too loosey-goosey to me. there are prets that are still open.

My parents should get vaccinated soon, and we are so desperate for the kids to go there for a while and to get them out of the house so everybody can have a fucking break. Kids have been virtual this entire time. I was thinking that this should be able to happen in a month or so, maybe spring break?

Then wife sent me links to articles about how it still might not be safe and whatnot. I am leaning hard towards FUCK THAT SHIT THESE KIDS HAVE TO GO SOMEWHERE OR I AM GOING TO LOSE MY GODDAMNED MIND. My conservative parents have been pretty understanding about not being able to hug the kids and have them over, but they will flip if they've had both shots, waited three weeks and still can't see kids.

The kids aren't going to get them sick probably, because the kids and my wife have been very isolated. I get tested once a week. Technically my parents could still get the kids sick?

I can not with this shit any longer.

if i were you, and as long as my vaccinated parents weren't licking doorknobs and going to choir practice in a basement, i would send the kids over.

basically for the reasons under "Can Vaccinated People Spread COVID?"
here https://emilyoster.substack.com/p/post-vaccine-behavior-can-i-go-wild

one of my best friends from high school is an upstanding dude but he has a tendency to spread nonsense rumors, and though usually they're about NFL trades, today he briefly sparked a panic on a FB feed because he said the Orange County Convention Center site ran out of Moderna vaccines and they were replenished with Pfizer only, implying that people who got their first shot as Moderna won't be able to get their 2nd anytime soon (or that they might be given Pfizer's instead).

so he has people freaking the fuck out for their parents on FB, and I found an article that within 5 minutes had the health director indicating they had vials of both. there were literally people in a panic because their parents had been vaccinated there and were about to start a mini-uproar.

granted, I don't BLAME people for being freaked out because this rollout has so far been a complete mess, particularly in Orange County (which is not where my folks got vaxxed). but man I wish people, even close friends of mine, would WAIT to confirm things before they get everybody in an uproar. especially since he probably just overheard something in passing and misunderstood it.

and..the article was from yesterday which is a day after my friend claimed to have overheard there was no Moderna left.

there were also two friends who aren't elderly, but one's a teacher working in a classroom (so she'll be part of 1-B, which is the next phase), and there were extra, leftover doses that were about to get thrown away at a facility (and no more appointments for the day), so they went and got them, and now people are giving them grief.

they were going to go unused if nobody claimed them - i don't get why everything has to have shaming attached to it.

Back to issues with restarting live performance, as it's my field of business and has me terrified, here's some pertinent links that i've been reading lately:

https://gothamist.com/arts-entertainment/cuomo-announces-plan-bring-back-live-events-fueled-rapid-testing
https://www.gothamgazette.com/opinion/10070-plan-save-the-arts-in-new-york-broadway-beyond
https://www.billboard.com/articles/business/9509810/save-our-stages-act-passage-niva-director-next-steps
https://musicxcorona.substack.com/
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/arts/fauci-coronavirus-performing-arts.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2qjmuZ11fw