bomb alerts and stuff

Aw. Could make for an interestingly baffling excelsior in a little while.

but was Jean Charles de Menezes a Muslim? It seems unlikely given his Brazilian origin.

I suppose there may be a general feeling among a lot of people who share a particular range of skin tone. This issue is worsened somewhat by witnesses of the shooting describing the victim as 'Asian'.

As an aside, news reports now claim the victim had an out-of-date Visa!

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and then they followed him for ages before pulling him over -- he went on a bus, and they followed him on to it. he could have blown the bus up.

there's still a lot that won't make sense for a long time.

it's hard to draw too many conclusions with as little details as this.

i must admit, i raised a weak smile at this. which immediately made me feel guilty.

the most chilling thing about this are the reports that the police didn't identify themselves at all. to begin with i worried that they might have shouted "police" but not identified themselves as armed; now there are suggestions they didn't even say "police".

this has to be bollocks, surely. these guys are trained professionals. there is no fucking way they wouldn't have identified themselves.

is there?

why intrigues me is why they left it to the point of getting to a tube train before stopping him.. maybe there would have been more options available for restraint etc?

They were following him, you loon. Then he went into the tube station and they decided it was unsafe to let him carry on.

Someone texted into 5Live with an unusually good point this morning:

If the policy is to stop a suspected suicide bomber the only safe way, by shooting them in the head, for fear any other course of action will allow them time to detonate themselves, then the logical conclusion of that is that it's also unsafe trying to shout "stop or I'll shoot" or whatever (at least if they're in a crowded area) – that also gives them the chance they need. So we're left with a real shoot-to-kill policy, rather than something that police chiefs are currently trying to describe as a "shoot-to-stop" policy that has the unfortunate but inevitable side-effect of killing people.

from this pov, it would have made more sense to confront him outside, cos the bomb would have been less effective in the open if he had gone that route.

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exactly. the radio-texter's point is a very good one, but this is surely the only solution: try to challenge suspected bombers when they're out in the open, surrounded by as few people as possible.

it's amazing how little they're letting out, really, because it's making everybody paranoid.

exactly.

police hanging out stop'n'searching anyone of "asian" appearance randomly. maybe if there isnt another attempt imminently then it wont come to pass, but such a policy of basically putting all asian people under suspicion will be the nearest they can find to searching bags on the tube/all people (as was suggested immediately after the second attempts). it is a tactic that looks like it is pretty efficient to those who really want all "potential suicide bombers" to be shot, or nearest equivalent, and yet just about passes the "non-police state" test.

In russia anyone of a vaguely caucausian (chechen, georgian, dagestani, central asian generally) apperance, is checked by police who patrol ever metro station and major sites in cities. this is generalluy because they often dont have the right citizen papers so are bountiful for bribe taking, but in theory its for security.
of course, the multitude of bombings in metro stations and underpasses reveal just how effective this tactic is in keeping the city secure.

my friend (who was a scouser) for example got stopped 5 times on one journey of 30 mins duration.

Err, couldn't an electrical impulse from a stun gun have triggered a device?

depends on the device -- same goes for shooting, i think. i don't think *all* explosives go off if you shoot them.

This is probably Londoner-speak for "Leicester".

i like OTMBOT's post where he said we shd all ask people what's in their bags -- i'd reverse it: we should show the person next to us what's in out bag. it should be considred rude not to.

isn't this part of why they are shooting at people's heads rather than their bodies?