GET OUT: US politics November 2020

seems like the lawsuits and recounts are just meant to delay certification in states like MI, PA, WI, NV for so long that they then lose their ability to appoint electors?

recounts don't delay certification afaik. in Georgia, the recount that was done was an automatic one, but Trump is allowed to request one of his own...*after* the vote has been certified. which will happen today.

Michigan will be meeting on Monday to certify their results, Wisconsin already certified today (and this evening was the deadline for Trump to request a recount, which it seems like he did).

good to know

https://www.bridgemi.com/michigan-government/michigan-gop-canvassers-under-pressure-ignore-votes-help-trump

lot to unpack in this

They are facing heavy lobbying from pro-Trump forces such as activist Shane Trejo, who in a Wednesday email blast urged fellow “patriots” to flood Republican state canvassers Norm Shinkle and Aaron Van Lengevelde with messages opposing certification.

“Tell them … that you will never vote Republican again unless they overturn this steal because they will have proven that voting for Republican is pointless by refusing to use their lawful authority to stop the rape of our nation,” he wrote.

first, "norm shinkle"

what they're really trying to do is cast doubt on the validity of the election and convince state legislatures to select their own slate of electors, which would be illegal and never stand up in court. and many of the battleground states have Secs of State, Governors ,or state legislatures who have all indicated they will select electors based on the popular vote.

they're trying it, but they know it will fail

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2020/11/18/voters-pick-president-state-legislatures-no-veto-power-column/6311981002/

Boring, Maryland: not Drew, I'm just a poster who shares a lot of intersecting interests and friends and professional relationships with Drew.

I would simply take steps to ensure that the strength of unions doesn't fall.

I agree with everything you're saying here Milo about the importance of organized labor, but the strength of unions has already fallen precipitously. We're looking at labor force of millions of low-wage workers who are emphatically not going to be unionized any time in the near future. But the federal government has a lot it can do to make their lives a lot better even without a union. So I think you can do both, defend and expand unions as much as possible but also build up the safety net (and honestly, I think the latter is politically a lot more doable than the former).

"convince state legislatures to select their own slate of electors"

yes, I guess that what what I was thinking some of these efforts were aimed at

Dems actually tried to object to the Ohio vote in 2004 on the January 6th joint meeting of Congress - https://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/01/06/electoral.vote/

From that article about the Michigan state Board of Canvassers:

They are facing heavy lobbying from pro-Trump forces such as activist Shane Trejo, who in a Wednesday email blast urged fellow “patriots” to flood Republican state canvassers Norm Shinkle and Aaron Van Lengevelde with messages opposing certification.

“Tell them … that you will never vote Republican again unless they overturn this steal because they will have proven that voting for Republican is pointless by refusing to use their lawful authority to...”

This would be awesome. Please never vote Republican again!

I’ll believe it when I see it

however, even if Republicans objected to every battleground state, the vote to accept the objection has to be approved in both houses, and it'll never pass the Democratic-lead House (which would require at least 7 Dems defecting, possibly more depending on final House count).

so, basically....we're gonna know things are *ok* by December 14th, when the electors vote. Supreme Court has reaffirmed states rights to punish faithless electors. No faithless elector has ever voted for the candidate of the opposing party - just other unaffiliated people (or other members of their own party).

xxxpost this is referring to January 6th joint session

'Either help our party cheat their way to a win or we will never vote for our party again' is the very essence of upstanding citizens acting in good faith.

Is there a volcano somewhere that all of these people can be dropped into?

... Yes?

The return of the covfefe

The most we’ve heard publicly from the GSA Administrator this week appears to be an inadvertent pocket tweet pic.twitter.com/5tt4AN1vs1

— Betsy Klein (@betsy_klein) November 19, 2020

With Vincent Peef

that's not inadvertent or pocket, it's a Q drop

really? context? plz tell me yr joking

I love the little “Translate Tweet” in that screen shot.

did she tweet that and delete it?

BREAKING

A federal judge in Pennsylvania has formally canceled an evidentiary hearing scheduled for Thursday after Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani admitted in court on Tuesday that the case does not involve fraud.https://t.co/whazrr4l06

— The Intellectualist (@highbrow_nobrow) November 18, 2020

has heard enough and hopefully will just get it over with

All sorts of LOLs in this one:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-election-strategy/2020/11/18/94fbe50e-29c9-11eb-92b7-6ef17b3fe3b4_story.html

A key bit:

Trump is increasingly relying on Giuliani and campaign advisers Jenna Ellis and Jason Miller for legal guidance, several campaign officials said — in part because Trump has stopped listening to the original legal team and in part because of those lawyers’ decision to distance themselves in recent days from the president’s increasingly erratic effort to reverse the election’s outcome.

As a result, Trump increasingly is hearing only from aides who are maintaining that the election is not over. He remains hopeful about Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania largely on the advice of Giuliani, who is close to Bannon, and Trump has urged Giuliani to continue the fight, several officials said.

Giuliani “is crazy and actually believes Bannon,” one senior Republican adviser said.

Giuliani could not be reached, and Bannon declined to comment. On his conservative podcast, Bannon said Trump should continue to urge Michigan Republicans to block certification.

“You can’t certify Michigan,” he said. “You don’t have to put up a slate of electors.”

The president was furious Wednesday morning about the decision by election officials in Wayne County, Mich., to certify their results after initially deadlocking along partisan lines, according to aides familiar with his reaction. He is also increasingly angry at Georgia Gov. Brian Kemp and Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger, both Republicans who have given no indication that they will intervene to block certification there.

Arizona judge skeptical of GOP arguments in election case that could delay state certification of ballots
From CNN’s Erica Orden

An Arizona state judge said he will issue a written ruling Thursday in the Arizona Republican Party’s lawsuit against Maricopa County, as he expressed skepticism in a case that could delay the state’s certification of ballots.

On Wednesday, the judge heard oral arguments in the Arizona Republican Party’s lawsuit against the recorder of Maricopa County, the most populous county in the state, which alleges the Secretary of State’s manual violated state law because its hand count of a random sampling of ballots was conducted based on polling places, not precincts.

Judge John Hannah expressed skepticism of the arguments made by a lawyer for the party, pointing out that an audit already found no errors. “How is this re-audit that you’re advocating for going to make a difference in the outcome of the election or create any type of tangible difference in the real world?” the judge asked a lawyer for the party, John Wilenchik.

When Wilenchik replied that “if there were to be some hacking of machines, it would be done by precinct,” the judge questioned him, saying, “What evidence is there of that?”

An attorney for the county, Joseph LaRue, said the party waited too long — until Nov. 12 — to file its lawsuit, given that it was aware as early as 2012 of the wording of the Secretary of State’s election procedures manual. “Waiting a few days to file a lawsuit isn't a big deal in most litigation, but it is in election litigation,” LaRue said.

The county’s deadline for certifying ballots is Monday and a delay, LaRue has said, could impact the state’s ability to meet the Electoral College deadline. The state certification deadline is Nov. 30. The Electoral College votes on Dec. 14.

Meanwhile, in Michigan

New from Michigan: Now Wayne County Republicans want to “rescind” their votes to certify election results... pic.twitter.com/2tgT70JuHo

— Donovan Slack (@DonovanSlack) November 19, 2020

so far every article about that I've found has been some OANN-esque crap, so I'm unclear if they even have the right to rescind their votes at this point (their claim is they were told it's non-binding, but that sounds like bunk - the deadline passed and being able to reverse now would deprive the state of canvassing time since it would then fall to them).

idk what the point of even trying this is other than PR shit and Trump admin probably called them to tell them to do it. it's really dumb though. it's not going to stop the certification from happening prior to the Dec 8th Safe Harbor deadline. If for some reason it did happen, and different state officials submitted different results (one favoring Trump, one favoring Biden), Congress would have to decide which to accept. If the Senate and House can't agree (which they obviously won't), the vote certified by the state's governor (Whitmer, a Democrat) wins.

There's no endgame that favors Republicans in this. they're just kicking the can down the highway.

I'm pretty sure they actually can't even rescind their votes at this point and that they're trying to lobby to get in GOP's good graces after likely being skewered for their 'cowardice'

Yeah, that seems to be what I’m finding, it’s just hilarious to watch them flip so easily, in both directions, in less than 24 hours.

Only people more cowardly than democrats are republicans of course

xpost the 24 hour news cycle really was a bad idea for this reason. imagine if the Michigan vote flip flopping would only be covered in later editions of the newspaper.

Lol. Clowns.

While, Palmer and Hartmann have signed affidavits seeking to revoke their certification, Vice Chair Kinloch assures me the deal is already done. Lawsuits withstanding, as election lawyers have explained to me, the deadline is also a hard stop, and the deadline was yesterday.

— Kayla Ruble (@RubleKB) November 19, 2020

Kinloch says they took an additional vote on Tuesday to "to waive any reconsideration as it relates to bringing this matter back up."

— Nick Corasaniti (@NYTnickc) November 19, 2020

I fucking hate these cunts and hope against hope that at least a microscopic fraction of the incoming administration's time is spent excoriating Trump and co for all this bullshit and the damage it is causing. Surely there's some rhetorical flourish that can emphasise Biden as a president for all Americans while also subtly shaming anyone who got on this train of batshittery and ignorance somehow?

i think you can forgive voters while at the same time shaming republican politicians to the end of their days

Biden has already said his administration does not plan to do any examination or punishment of the four-year crime spree that the current administration has carried out

That's not quite what he said.

where did he say that, Sic?

Biden hopes to avoid divisive Trump investigations, preferring unity

There's of course a difference between Biden's Justice Department finding evidence of crime and Biden ordering the attorney general to prosecute Trump and/or his henchmen.

Biden has raised concerns that investigations would further divide a country he is trying to unite and risk making every day of his presidency about Trump,

I mean, that makes sense - Trump is a flaming bag of shit who exists to ruin your best shoes - but there must be some way of balancing the two impulses. Though, as has been discussed in this thread numerous times, it's the New York State prosecutors who seem most likely to take Trump to town.

I don't know... I don't imagine Biden to be some shining light of progressiveness, but I also don't see the profit in just expecting the absolute worst from the party in this moment. I'm fully ready to look like a heel for this in the months to come, but...

Yeah, like...I'm not going to be surprised if the Biden years are a howling disappointment, but there sure are a lot of people who seem preemptively resigned to that inevitability. Dem skepticism is healthy and warranted but it too often careens headlong into dire fatalism. One thing to keep in mind is that Biden, unlike his right-wing homonculoid counterpart, does not have the balls of the entire party in his pocket.

Yes, ideally the SDNY prosecutors will crashtackle Trump through the surface of the earth, five minutes after he leaves office, and the administration can then happen upon massive piles of evidence of crimes committed by other members and alumni of the administration. That's the right approach; it's the cravenness of messaging "we're going to move foward and heal" via multiple Dom Cummings / Laura K style connections that makes one queasy about the application of the approach.


I also don't see the profit in just expecting the absolute worst from the party in this moment. I'm fully ready to look like a heel

I aim to keep my venting about the admin setting my expectations over here like this as much as possible btw - the above was meant as a flat factual response to your hope!

Oh no please keep venting here too - between us we'll maintain the Farid And Balanced output ILX News aspires to

“Fareed and Balanced”, surely?

https://joop.bnnvara.nl/content/uploads/2017/05/fareed.png

Hahaha I am so exhausted I can't type for shit at the moment

https://t.co/eZQa4duDdN pic.twitter.com/9XVvAvS6zz

— Dave Itzkoff (@ditzkoff) November 19, 2020

THE KRAKEN

If Donald Trump's arm were ever to become severed, he would just continue slipping the putrefied limb into his coatsleeve day after day, acting as if nothing at all had happened and scoffing at everyone who was repulsed by the stench.