GET OUT: US politics November 2020

Of course not, but I think we're going to continue to struggle in elections until we grapple with the likely fact that this group is much larger than we've been wanting to admit.

Messed up my tags, meant to quite sarahell and respond.

@sarahell I meant jon's, quoting is hard on the phone

having grown up around it, it's very easy to admit

Biden lead has shrunk by 10k or so in Michigan over the last hour, but it *should* be ok given that there must be at least another +60k gain to be had around Detroit (66% reporting) / Kalamazoo (80%).

I'll be asleep when AZ release their two chunks of polling data, so hopefully good news tomorrow.

like so many things this seems to be about intent vs. consequences. where one side is "that can't be true, there are not 66 million people who wake up in the morning and think "today I'm going to do some racism, starting with my daily recital of the 14 words," and the other side is "does it matter, when there are 66 million people who press the racism button, what those people had in their head?"

As pointed out several times over itt, we've got to move past the idea of "waiting for the racists to die off", because there are clearly more young ones stepping forward every day.

So my flippant post was to say, what are we going to do to combat this? I don't think ignoring them until they hopefully fade away in the next election is going to work either. I don't have the answer, but I think we have to plan for something beyond just wishing for a magical candidate on our side that will whittle that down.

I'm adjusting to a world potentially w/out Trump in our daily scrim. Imagine reverting to a norm when a Biden and a McConnell just gridlock happily ever after!

So my flippant post was to say, what are we going to do to combat this

I mean you could finally try the "lure some of the massive bloc of non-voters with substantive new ideas" approach leftists have been begging for for seemingly forever, but iirc whatever cycle it is is never the time for that

What are we going to do to combat this - planning to focus on local politics. SF voters just got rid of a ridiculous minimum police force number, so real reform is now possible there.

Indeed, that was very welcome to see happen.

Imagine reverting to a norm when a Biden and a McConnell just gridlock happily ever after!

There's also a lot of damage to federal departments for Biden to undo, his hands aren't completely tied.

as the federal government becomes reduced to haphazard executive actions with a rump legislature unable to pass anything other than continuing resolutions for the next century, local politics in our urban centers will become the focal point of policymaking in our society

Having Homeland Security out of the hands of a maniac is a huge plus, not to be underrated

There's also a lot of damage to federal departments for Biden to undo, his hands aren't completely tied.

― lukas,

^^^ exactly

I agree that not a lot can get done the way things are looking, but a lot of damage can potentially get repaired

Biden's gonna keep the deportations rolling as a show of good faith, I can't help assuming

Please don't buy into the false equivalency btw Obama and Trump era immigration policy

you have to appeal to people on the level of "what's in it for me?" if you're going to combat voting for the fascist. you can't just be sanctimonious about kids in cages while you give handouts to your rich friends and govern like hall monitors. people smell the bullshit and go for the bully if you aren't offering them something they can't refuse.

map otm

Nowhere near 100% of Trump voters are racist. Nowhere near 100% of Republicans are racist. You can never defeat the enemy if you fundamentally misunderstand their supporters.

I wish I could say I’ve read most of this thread, but I’ve been on blackout till about an hour ago. Love to you all, these are bad times. could be worse. 2004 ripped my heart out and then tap danced on it. if a sense of moral necessity is going to arrive in this country, I don’t think it will come from my people. We all can shit on that as much as we want, but that sense of moral necessity is essential to working towards justice. I feel like the mora impulse has arrived in the USA on waves of immigrants, or the ascent if the downtrodden. and was lost to those already here. Still, I’ll repeat what I said during the impeachment: FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT.

real reform

by which of course I mean firing as many of them as possible

people smell the bullshit and go for the bully if you aren't offering them something they can't refuse.

The question's complicated, obv, but your point partially explains the rightward shift in young Hispanic and Black men.

Kinda feeling this thread...

I know it's "off brand" for me. But, like, I really don't think Dems "screwed up" the election. Biden ran a campaign specifically targeted a flipping a few white college educate Republicans and some rural voters, while hope Black people and Latinos did all the other things.

— Elie Mystal (@ElieNYC) November 4, 2020

of note...

To my eye, Biden is likely hitting the targets he needs in PA counties to be on track to finish ahead. And recounts don't typically overturn the margins we're likely to see for him in MI/WI.

If Biden does prevail in MI/PA/WI, then AZ/GA/NV wouldn't matter to the outcome.

— Dave Wasserman (@Redistrict) November 4, 2020

Since I took a nap, we've gotten a bit more data in Pennsylvania--narrowing Trump's margin to 8 points there.
To my mind, everything there is still consistent with Biden eventually taking the lead

— Nate Cohn (@Nate_Cohn) November 4, 2020

local politics in our urban centers will become the focal point of policymaking in our society

I want to agree with this, because I am currently working in this area somewhat.

also lol at "doing some racism" <3 katherine

lure some of the massive bloc of non-voters

Turnout this cycle was the highest since 1908.

I repeat: since 1908.

Please tell me about this massive bloc of non-voters and your suggestions for motivating them.

I'll wait.

Also, this stuff still resonates...

Biden could end up with 306 or 290 Electoral College votes and a popular vote margin of over 5 million. If Trump got this, it would be seen as a big and decisive win. https://t.co/LE290cLc3o

— Tom Wright (@thomaswright08) November 4, 2020

Trump loses popular vote but manages an EC win, GOP parties like it's the biggest mandate ever. Dems win popular vote even bigger and manage a likely similar EC victory, it's all *tug at collar* aiiiiie we better not screw this up.

The question's complicated, obv, but your point partially explains the rightward shift in young Hispanic and Black men.

― Patriotic Goiter (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, November 4, 2020 2:43 PM (four minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

I wonder if sexism and masculinist anti-wokeness also plays a role in this. Call it reverse intersectionality.

Nowhere near 100% of Trump voters are racist. Nowhere near 100% of Republicans are racist. You can never defeat the enemy if you fundamentally misunderstand their supporters.

― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Wednesday, November 4, 2020 2:42 PM (two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

this is exactly what I'm talking about; if you look at it through the consequences lens, then yes, 100% of Republican voters have done something monumentally racist, with the free option to not do something monumentally racist. which is what people have been saying all along, but most people either reject the consequentialist lens and/or reject the idea that they did something wrong and should change their behavior

people smell the bullshit and go for the bully if you aren't offering them something they can't refuse.

agreed ... or they just say "fuck this shit" and don't vote.

a lot of the resistance to anything from the right ("right" being a relative term, you also see this with liberals vs. progressives) comes from the simple fact that they do not want to be told they're wrong or, even worse, change their behavior

(see: masks)

I have said this elsewhere but this cycle's turnout was the highest in the last 120 years.

Please tell me the magic formula that will convert nonvoters into engaged citizens, I would love to hear it.

xp to katherine — that's my impression as well

yep all those black males and hispanics are monumentally racist.

In an election where the key difference appears to be losing ground with people of color, reductively arguing “people wanted to do a racism” seems ridiculous.

yep all those black males and hispanics are monumentally racist.

― Thus Sang Freud, Wednesday, November 4, 2020 7:54 PM (fifty-nine seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

you very obviously don't know any "black" or "hispanic" people let alone "asian"

are you people seriously arguing that minorities can't be white supremacist? lol get a clue

the ones i know, if they were reading this thread, would be laughing hard.

In an election where the key difference appears to be losing ground with people of color, reductively arguing “people wanted to do a racism” seems ridiculous.

― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Wednesday, November 4, 2020 2:55 PM (five minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

nobody is arguing this

i know a black Trump voter who posts racist shit all the time

If you just increase the circle of people who are unreachable and unworthy, you don’t ever have to confront why you lose elections. It’s not your fault, it’s theirs.

Do you honestly think every Hispanic and black Trump voter is racist?

Out on the town having the time of my life with a bunch of friends. They're all just out of frame, laughing too. pic.twitter.com/VCbkZwWwvs

— nathan fielder (@nathanfielder) July 12, 2015

really we'd get a lot more votes if we stopped being the racist police.

the argument is that the effect of a vote for Donald Trump is to endorse and facilitate actions that cause disproportionate harm, and that one's intent has literally no bearing on that

(people really hate this line of thinking, and it's really tempting to conclude it "...because deep down they know it's right")

Like racism goes a long way towards explaining Trump and Republicans popularity, but it doesn't go all the way. Let's leave simplistic explanations to the simpletons.