love* in the time of plague (and by love* i mean brexit* and other dreary matters of uk politics)

The today programme and the papers do not set the agenda any more because the agenda is flooded with shit.

If the media were less compliant it wouldn't go away - however

I think (and hope) you need a Fox news to make that work, and we're not quite there yet. He's also struggling to turn this into a culture war thing – and Labour aren't obliging there either.

Our papers are evil and expert at turning the public away, but they're also good at channelling their readerships' anger (and the majority hate Cummings to boot.)

Penny from Hampshire, that was not the question which needed asking.

Kind of sends the message out that lockdown time is over, which is what they wanted I guess. Not that they're bright enough to have planned the whole thing this way, but it's working out for them if the press don't follow up on it - which they probably won't. Herd lolmmunity here we come.

If you want a media thats not compliant buy some media. That's what they did while your were wasting it all on avocado toast and weekends away in Gothenburg

I don’t disagree that the media is compliant, but you’re missing the point if you think the problem is that. It’s that they’re chasing shadows created by an unbelievably cynical government. Look at the guardian liveblog. It’s gibberish. Not having Fox News is not going to save you.

There are a bunch of people on this thread whose “this is big! He has to go!” predictions used to be reasonable and correct, but they don’t seem to get it any more. Nothing is big. You’re not going to see many resignations from this government.

ian from the bbc observing social distancing until he runs into technical difficulties there

Peston is fucking useless.

Resignation make no sense. Resigning is what losers do

How is Peston so bad at this?

lol nothing matters

wow they've literally muted a journalist (even though it's one from the BBC) talk about a heavy handed metaphor

What the fuck was that with the hedging and the second unrelated question, fucking peston

guidance retconned, question ignored, quietly saying "there's no lockdown rules", sweet

I don’t disagree that the media is compliant, but you’re missing the point if you think the problem is that

I don't think the problem is that per se, but it is an element - but you have to have it over time. Decades of repetition. Piers Morgan deciding he's annoyed by it doesn't undo years of that

caek otm, not going to show anybody up but I’m pretty sure you could do a post search for the phrase “this isn’t going to go away” that would bear this out

"as I've said just now" fucking cunt

boris really dngaf

it's masterly stuff tbh, like watching Ali rope-a-doping

This is it, just spout some shit which answers nothing, then keep referring back to your previous answer, a complete charade, and he'll get away with it.

how can Boris claim to understand Cummings' decisions when he cant even tell you how many childen he has himself

I don't know what that means – they willingly chase shadows because they're compliant.

The way this happens if they keep hammering it. And yes, they're pretty reluctant to do that because they just wouldn't do that to a Tory govt. Unless their readers demanded it – which they really might. This isn't abstract rules-breaking, it's really easy to grasp. That's why it's big, not because it's manufactured big, but because it actually makes a lot of people pissed off, even if they don't yet have an outlet for that.

This is the sort of big that led to Brexit – this government should surely understand that.

I'm still not convinced he's going to go either, but uber-cynical nothing-matters apathy can do one.

‘I completely understand why people are angry, but i don’t fucking care’

Essentially confirming the Barnard Castle story.

also not addressing the Barnard castle question at all

Ian was still talking and was muted again, this could almost be funny

also Johnson is now fucking up that "nothing is true" defence, because he's clearly getting rattled

he’s shit under fire, he gets easily pissed off, but again lol nothing matters

BASED ON THE SCIENCE is my favourite magic spell, you can make it justify anything

I'm still not convinced he's going to go either, but uber-cynical nothing-matters apathy can do one.

It's not cynicism, it's a reflection of the current makeup of the country. This will change. The Tories have thrown their lot in with boomers, this is a time delineated advantage they have. Lot of talk about how Labour threw away certain voters in the 80s/90s and it came to haunt them later. Tories have done same

But what different does it make whether Cummings stays or not?
Its not that nothing matters, its that it doens't matter today.

how can Boris claim to understand Cummings' decisions when he cant even tell you how many childen he has himself

This is a mistake, this thing about how many children Boris has is an irrelevance and a mistake

when a question about people dying because you fucked up is a breather

mind you if she'd've got the question down to under 3 paragraphs it might've had more impact

It isn't about whether anyone is a bad guy or not, its about whether they can put the ball in the back of the net.

The boomers are angry about this, is the thing. The way we get past nothing-matters is to make cracks in their death cult, and this is almost tailor made to do that, I’d say.

lotta complaints to the manager coming in

A lot of people are angry, but there is no outlet for that xp lol

This is what you’ve got coming and what I mean by “chasing shadows”. It doesn’t matter if the media aren’t compliant.

Steve Bannon to Michael Lewis: "The Democrats don't matter. The real opposition is the media. And the way to deal with them is to flood the zone with shit." https://t.co/YuCqFJZ6M5

— Brian Stelter (@brianstelter) February 12, 2018

The questions didn’t help. Long waffling multi-part rambles that let Johnson pick and choose what he wanted to respond to.

This is what you’ve got coming and what I mean by “chasing shadows”

The shadows are good business. Russiagate was win win

I'm still not convinced he's going to go either, but uber-cynical nothing-matters apathy can do one.

I also wouldn't confuse frustration with endless little battles which constantly lead nowhere at all with cynicism. This is the shit we are being flooded with.

We'll see how effective it is.

Look I haven’t lived in the uk for the best part of a decade, and admittedly the first text I just got in the boys chat about this was “who’s watching the briefing, I can’t remember being this angry in my life”, so maybe I’m wrong about the scale of this particular story. But I don’t think so, and in any case my point is more: in the presence of a government with no shame and a media strategy to flood the zone, the press do not drive the agenda any more. any individual scandal might seem like the wedge issue you’ve been waiting for but it’s not, and limmy is right that you only have to power through a couple of them before public fatigue sets in. I’m not sure what the solution is.

Owning the media does make a difference but your results don't set in straightaway. Its the long game. You turn the oven on it doesn't get hot straight away, you turn it off it isn't suddenly cold

Describing cynical tactics as effective is pretty much the essence of cynicism.

i talked to my wife about this and she was like “i don’t care. who is he? who cares what he does?”

she successfully predicted trump and brexit, against my “wiser” hunches and i think she’s right on this too unfortunately

I’ve got some ideas, but I wouldn’t write them down ;)

Watching the aftermath and Sarah Jones MP (Labour) is answering some questions (which are a total joke) on the BBC but she didn’t call for his sacking! Again, an inquiry! Fucking hell, why?!

What are they going to flood the media with that isn't connected with the pandemic and which can't find it's way back eventually back to the Dominic Cummings story?

It’s cynical to look at opportunities for change and shrug “nothing is big”. Big things are still big; anger without an outlet is still anger.

The deck is utterly stacked here and things are dreadful, but the situation isn’t hopeless. Hell, even if he stays there are a lot of ardent supporters who are being turned into conditional supporters today and that’s worth something. My Tories twitter list is quite the sight. Even Lolico is reduced to “well, they can’t prove it”.