Joe Biden, Senator from Citibank (oops, DELAWARE), to Run for President

I only make veridical claims when I’m mad tbh

yeah silby's actually correct here I think. you wouldn't know it from ilx of course but most liberal-minded people LIKE Joe Biden and are therefore going to give him every benefit of the doubt.

― Evans on Hammond (evol j)

even if they don't like Joe Biden, The Other Guy Is Worse, and that excuses everything

i mean, supporting Your Team out of guilt, shame, blind tribalism, do people here really think that those things only reply to _republicans_?

"supporting your team" implies there is no better or worse team. if that was true then yeah, Democrats would be just as bad as Republicans.

"supporting your team" implies there is no better or worse team.

― Evans on Hammond (evol j)

no, the patriots are clearly objectively terrible

i think that this will severely suppress turnout

i'm this close to actively campaigning for people to not vote in the presidential race

i'm this close to actively campaigning for people to not vote in the presidential race

What state do you live in?

i think that this will severely suppress turnout

― treeship., Tuesday, April 28, 2020

The youth vote didn't come out much in February-early March. Guess who did?

it's a violent crime

What state do you live in?

― but also fuck you (unperson)

i believe i already told you i don't care about anything you have to say

i guess i hope biden wins because the trump regime is a daily and ongoing threat to the survival of humanity. but jesus christ this is bleak.

i think that this will severely suppress turnout

― treeship., Tuesday, April 28, 2020 3:14 PM (six minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

I think it will largely depends on how it's handled going forward by both campaigns. But I'm also curious what portion of the electorate you think is most likely to stay at home because of it. I suspect at least some of the people who stayed at home in 2016 regret that decision today, and are perhaps more willing to approach this election more pragmatically. (And many of the others probably wouldn't have voted for Biden, anyway.) Meanwhile, reliable partisans will still vote for the simple reason that they are reliable partisans.

I completely understand the impetus of not wanting to throw any votes or support to a candidate facing these kind of accusations, of course. At the same time, I also don't see how sitting home and protesting by not voting at all helps though, surely that just ensures an (arguably, based on the allegations I've read against both) even worse serial assaulter with a larger number of credible allegations stays president?

As pointed out above, it would be great to have an election where this isn't even a consideration we have to think about. I'm just having trouble understanding how making Trump's path to reelection any easier serves a longer term goal in supporting the voices of victims. Obviously voting a candidate with zero allegations would be the preferable choice, but the fucked up reality in 2020 is that we don't get that kind of choice. I'm not in a swing state so odds are my vote won't even matter, but were it to - I would plug my nose, vote for Biden and shift my focus to support female candidates so we don't need to make this fucked up calculus in 2024.

how many times do i have to say that this isn't a fucking math equation for me

I get that its not, nor should it be. I'm just grappling with what's in my head. To me (and believe me I'm not suggesting to tell anyone else how they should or should not vote), it seems like voting for neither (depending on state and location) still helps Trump out whether we like it or not.

Like a dozen xps
“Youth turnout wasn’t enough to win the primary for Sanders, luckily this means they’re irrelevant in the general.”

But I'm certainly not intending to call anyone out or argue, genuinely! I should have refrained from posting.

your first post mirrors my state of mind

even if most voters don't particularly care about the allegations, isn't there a risk that this severely damages Biden's chances because his media surrogates/prominent Dems/left-lib journalists etc are forced into awkward contortions where they have to repeatedly try and square their support for Biden with their feminism, and either look like hypocrites and/or offering only a lukewarm qualified endorsement? essentially what was described in that Rebecca Traister article, but not just whoever end up being his running mate, but every prominent person who is backing Biden

If anyone can convince themselves that voting for the center-right senile sex criminal is going to stop the country’s descent into fascism, good for them.

who is prominently backing Biden, other than Barack Obama and some people who were running for president two months ago?

At this point I'm convinced that it's marginally better than the far-right senile sex criminal that is pressing the accelerator to fascism hell.

Jealous of them in the same way that I’m jealous of some Catholics.

Yes, milo. If voting in this election does not immediately change the course of the USA then ofc it cannot be of any value at all. Except the work of changing a nation is grueling and mostly happens somewhere other than a voting booth. It's just one small pebble you throw into the pile of (one hopes) many, many actions aimed at stopping the country’s descent into fascism.

I get that its not, nor should it be. I'm just grappling with what's in my head. To me (and believe me I'm not suggesting to tell anyone else how they should or should not vote), it seems like voting for neither (depending on state and location) still helps Trump out whether we like it or not.

― soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0)

sure. i own that, i take responsibility for my decisions. my decision to not vote for biden makes it more likely that trump will win re-election.

i'm not voting for biden because there are things that are more important to me than the outcome of this election, things i care about more than who wins in november. i am _particularly_ interested in ending the cycle of violence and abuse, and i believe that voting for joe biden, whatever the other outcomes of that decision, would be an act that would perpetuate that cycle.

this tweet from Alyssa Milano seems to implicitly accept that the allegations are true (without saying that explicitly) but we should still vote for Biden anyway - we see you and hear you, but won't actually do anthing because that would be using you as fodder?

I’m aware of the new developments in Tara Reade’s accusation against Joe Biden. I want Tara, like every other survivor, to have the space to be heard and seen without being used as fodder. I hear and see you, Tara. #MeToo

— Alyssa Milano (@Alyssa_Milano) April 28, 2020

I don't know if more of Biden's supporters will shift to this position as they decide that saying Reade is lying (or ignoring the allegations all together) are not viable options any more? could Biden actually be elected in an environment even his most prominent supporters and media surrogates are publicly saying they believe that he sexually assaulted a woman and is wrongly accusing his victim of being a liar through his denials? I know Trump was elected in similar circumstances, but more of supporters were willing to just brazen it out or deny everything

Fair enough, thanks for the honest response. Genuinely wasn't trying to call anyone out, just trying to understand.

(xpost)

who is prominently backing Biden, other than Barack Obama and some people who were running for president two months ago?

A little hint about who the surprise guest will be for @JoeBiden's 3pm ET town hall today:

(She's excited.) pic.twitter.com/iGHo6a6G1s

— Hillary Clinton (@HillaryClinton) April 28, 2020

(I'm with her.) https://t.co/jLPeaGv5Mo

— Joe Biden (@JoeBiden) April 28, 2020

aside from the question of how many voters care about the allegations themselves, if your most prominent backers are having to heavily caveat their endorsements, that makes you look weak

exactly

Yes, it's not great.

hopefully a House committee will take up investigation of Biden's sex crimes if he's elected

The Dems will likely hold the House, so don't count on it

I expect the Dems to hold the house regardless. They should investigate whoever the president is, probably.

i think he will step down. you can't be the democratic nominee in 2020, three years into #metoo, with something like this hanging over your campaign.

― treeship., Tuesday, 28 April 2020 19:36 (two hours ago) link

Lol on the contrary, it's #metoo that's finished

Notable: @SenGillibrand asked today on a conference call about Tara Reade allegations of assault by @JoeBiden. She says, “I stand by Vice President Biden. He's devoted his life to supporting women and he has vehemently denied this allegation.” Per @JulieNBCNews

— Mike Memoli (@mikememoli) April 28, 2020

Jesus Christ

many xps

well, yeah

NEWS: Top Bernie Sanders adviser Jeff Weaver is behind a new super PAC aimed to rally progressives behind Joe Biden. It's called Future to Believe In PAC.

And Weaver is teaming up with ex-Sanders adviser Mark Longabaugh.https://t.co/XhDUDLuBGj

— Shane Goldmacher (@ShaneGoldmacher) April 28, 2020

wow, really wish i hadn't read this thread or returned to ilx in the first place tbh

yall suck

(with a few exceptions who chose not to hold lengthy-ass court on the credibility of a sexual assault survivor's story)

UPDATE: Just spoke to Jeff Weaver.

He told me Bernie Sanders "is not supportive of this super PAC.”

Weaver added, "He certainly would prefer we had not done it through a super PAC" but "each of us has to make our own decision about how to move forward.” https://t.co/XhDUDLuBGj

— Shane Goldmacher (@ShaneGoldmacher) April 28, 2020

Didn't a Hoos say that Weaver was hated by rank and file Sanders organizers?

Don't remember if this got posted yesterday:

Today I am announcing my endorsement of @JoeBiden for President of the United States.

VP Biden is a deeply dedicated public servant with the ability to unite the American people. I am moved by his compassion and ability to connect with people on the most human level.

— Pramila Jayapal (@PramilaJayapal) April 27, 2020

fuck the whole Democratic Party forever

yall suck

We coulda had Warren, but she sucked at drawing out anyone not part of a white professional class.