Your next 2020 Democratic presidential primary thread: Now we're serious

whatever ceiling exists for sanders has very little to do with extremely online shit like "mean bernie bros" and more about the perception the media has pushed that he's too risky in the general election compared to biden which appears to be the main factor behind biden's surge.

While Biden couldn't remember Obama's name today.

Reading through what happened in the thread overnight, and it's mostly the same discussion we've had a thousand times. But where did that whole 'snake emoji' thing come from, that was weird as fuck

It's the 2020 corncob

Fred - get off twitter, mate

lol and now you two are gonna scrap in here now after all that

I'm not, no

whatever ceiling exists for sanders has very little to do with extremely online shit like "mean bernie bros" and more about the perception the media has pushed that he's too risky in the general election compared to biden which appears to be the main factor behind biden's surge.

^^^^^

My primary concern is that Bernie will stick to the issues and not go for the jugular re Biden's electability

He's hitting him on trade/the rust belt, seems like the biggest electability concern he can go after since cognitive decline is off the table.

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/486212-biden-opens-up-double-digit-lead-nationally-over-sanders-poll

A 24 point swing? Why are these polls so volatile?

If the chapo people and the branding of bernie as the candidate for anti-pc edgelords had something to do with this, then fuck them

Bernie’s a great candidate who left and right is being painted as some sort of firebrand. It’s completely against the spirit of his campaign which is oriented toward elevating the voices of struggling americans

If the chapo people and the branding of bernie as the candidate for anti-pc edgelords had something to do with this, then fuck them

there is no evidence of this. by and large the stuff we argue about in here is Online Only Discourse, at least compared to the other 10,000 more important things that are on fire

If the chapo people and the branding of bernie as the candidate for anti-pc edgelords had something to do with this, then fuck them

― treeship., Friday, 6 March 2020 10:35 PM (two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

as i said that has really nothing to do with it, it's because biden winning south carolina + all the establishment endorsements made biden seem electable again after people were doubting his capability due to his previous poor performances (both in primaries and debates) and the media has been strongly pushing "biden is electable bernie isn't". that sudden shift right before super tuesday meant the sanders campaign didn't have time to react to biden suddenly being a major threat again, they got outmanoeuvred. they'd been softer than they really should have been on biden in the last few debates too due to bloomberg's presence taking up the spotlight etc.

I thought snakes were a Taylor Swift thing, too. Maybe that was the previous primary/album cycle.

Bernie’s a great candidate who left and right is being painted as some sort of firebrand. It’s completely against the spirit of his campaign which is oriented toward elevating the voices of struggling americans

I don't necessarily think it's strictly an anti Sanders media push, it's that in many ways his message (maybe thanks to many of his messengers) left the impression his brand *was* firebrand. That's where a lighter touch could have and maybe would help. Anyway, I saw this twitter thread that I thought was pretty interesting (maybe she's media biased, I can't tell anymore):

Some thoughts on what I’m seeing tonight...

There are offensive votes and defensive votes.

Many older black voters sacrificed by making defensive votes their entire lives in order to free up younger generations to be able to step out on faith and make more offensive votes.

— brittany packnett cunningham (@MsPackyetti) March 4, 2020

And re: stuff like "While Biden couldn't remember Obama's name today." Yeah, Biden is old. But he's the same fucking age as Sanders, and this kind of shit could happen to Sanders today, tomorrow, next week, in a year. That's why I want to see VP picks. I don't even know who Sanders would pick, but Biden seems to have a lot of good options.

Tipsy's post about Warren was great. We're so used to dysfunction, or the appearance of dysfunction, or the reporting of an appearance of dysfunction, that it's refreshing to hear stories of the system and/or people actually working, or doing work. My older daughter was recently in DC for an activist service trip, to learn how to lobby and/or work with congress, and the stories I got back stressed how responsive and respectful all the people she met with were. None of the primaries, no congressmen or senators, but their aides (to iirc Durbin and Danny Davis), who not only listened and offered advice, but to the one at the end encouraged a career in public service and at the least continued engagement with politics both local and national.

"Biden's brain is failing" is not going to be a winning attack line when that's true of many of his voters

And often all of us.

Sanders badly needs a win, endorsement, or some kind of announcement to signal that he's up for this fight and not just "the risky outsider", and if it's not going to be an assist from Warren I don't really know what it could be.

sadly otm

The long list of recent high-profile endorsements for Biden requires a counternarrative imho

You mean one that's not "he's a moron neo-con experiencing cognitive decline, and so are his supporters?"

...yes?

I'm not the fuckin Sanders head of comms man, I'm just an asshole on a message board

I think that's actually a job requirement

The gap btwn what ppl perceive as The Discourse of The Sanders Campaign and the actual things that are spoken at rallies etc is hilarious to me. I tuned into one of them a week or two ago and one of his openers was literally defining intersectionality.

lol why open with a joke?

I honestly haven't paid much attention to the Sanders campaign, mostly because it feels like he's been campaigning for seven years. Sanders fatigue? But I do know a couple of people who, as of several weeks ago, said they had supported and voted for him the last time around but not this time, so I have no idea what changed.

I really don't think a Warren endorsement could do that much to change the equation, she was polling at 7% in the last Michigan poll. Instead of focusing on her everyone needs to figure out other and better plans.

xpost (oh, btw, not saying defining intersectionality is a joke, I meant that opening with a joke is the public speaking standard, and he went with defining intersectionality!)

The last Florida poll has Biden at 61%, Sanders at 12% and Warren at 5%. Sanders needs to figure this out on his own

It's not (just) about getting her votes, it's about countering the perception that he has no allies who are Serious Politicians xps

All I have is anecdotal info, and in my personal case my wife was (and is) a big Warren supporter (and I wish it was Warren, too, for many reasons), and she told me she donated to Biden last week. But she's not and has never been a Sanders fan. I should ask her about her misgivings ...

I meant that opening with a joke is the public speaking standard, and he went with defining intersectionality!

poor phrasing on my part, what I meant was that one of the speakers who was on before him was doing this

Ah, get it.

Anyway, I asked my wife about Biden support, because I was curious. And she said it was strictly because she didn't think Sanders could get enough people out to the polls, and if it was a choice between old voters who always vote and young voters who might vote, she's gambling on the sure thing versus the, well, gamble. She, like me, has high hopes in a good Biden VP pick.

So who are Sanders' VP options, anyway?

A few have been raised on here but I retain hope for The Reanimated Corpse Of Eugene Debs.

Sanders badly needs a win, endorsement, or some kind of announcement to signal that he's up for this fight and not just "the risky outsider", and if it's not going to be an assist from Warren I don't really know what it could be.

I can't really see how an endorsement from Warren is going to move the dial all that much at this point, even if she were really to give one. It would hardly be a ringing endorsement given she's not sure who's the better bet and needs to think it over.

Late to the commiseration but even if we choose to take electability seriously in the country of president Donald fucking Trump, I don't get the assumption is that Biden is *it* at all.

We'll find out soon enough!

If you know a better way, absent ringing Biden's bell at the next debate (which I really hope he'll do, but that's too far away), to change the perception/narrative that a Sanders run is too big a risk in The Age Of Trump, I'm all ears. ("He does better in head-to-head polling! Even Nate Silver says so!" ain't gonna cut it.) xps

This article on Trump and black voters deserves a read.

an endorsement from warren would certainly help sanders, idk how much, but i also don't expect it to happen, unfortunately for her agenda.

sanders has said his vp will be a younger progressive, probably a woman, who supports his policy agenda including m4a. options include warren, tammy baldwin, a close ally like nina turner, a labour leader like sara nelson, etc.

biden will probably choose a moderate women and/or poc. kamala harris or stacy abrams would probably be likely considering how much the dem establishment likes them.

I was one of the big Bernie supporters last election who is pretty cynical about him now. I would think this phenomenom is documented to death at this point.

Mentioned, yes. Documented? idk, and certainly not in the context of this one-on-one contest.

Sorry I didn't mean to do a toxicity and erase Tulsi Gabbard there

Oh, i would've assumed there were articles and blog posts and tweets about it. I don't know this contest. You guys were all really in your feelings last night it seems.

warren endorse tulsi challenge

oh the one on one about Biden/Bernie.

whatever ceiling exists for sanders has very little to do with extremely online shit like "mean bernie bros" and more about the perception the media has pushed that he's too risky in the general election compared to biden which appears to be the main factor behind biden's surge.

I agree with this. Someone I follow on Twitter posted "People are going to die in camps and from lack of healthcare because of SNAKE EMOJIS," but I'd be surprised if 10% of Warren voters even knew what that meant.

That said, her staff and campaign workers definitely know what it means and have had to deal with it, which I suppose may not make them enthusiastic about peace-building.

Hi, it's me, the woman who had to read @ewarren's replies and mentions for the past year, having a lot of feelings about this last segment on Maddow.

— Alyssa Franke (@AlyssaFranke) March 6, 2020

If you know a better way, absent ringing Biden's bell at the next debate (which I really hope he'll do, but that's too far away), to change the perception/narrative that a Sanders run is too big a risk in The Age Of Trump, I'm all ears. ("He does better in head-to-head polling! Even Nate Silver says so!" ain't gonna cut it.) xps

― bold caucasian eroticism (Simon H.), 6. marts 2020 14:30 (three minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

I do fear it's too late, and that Sanders basically lost it after Nevada. But he could do what struggling campaigns normally do. He could change his messaging (he kinda already has), he could make changes in personnel, getting rid of Sirota for instance. Do something to signal his is pivoting, and is actually trying to unite the party. Focusing on wanting Warren to rescue him kinda only makes him seem more lost and ineffectual.