Damon Lindelof's Watchmen

Laurie suddenly deciding that Veidt needs to be arrested

We don't know if it was that sudden... Veidt disappeared over 10 years ago, maybe Laurie changed her mind during that time period, regretted that Veidt had most likely died and she couldn't bring him to justice, and now, as soon as she finds out Veidt's still alive, and after the immediate threat is over, she finally gets to arrest him.

Well, it wasn't like she was out there telling everyone that the Squid attack was a fake. She also made the arrest before Mirror Face produced the evidence, so it was just going to be her word.

going back over the eps, I'd rank 'em something like

6 > 8 > 3 > 1 > 7 > 5 > 2 > 9 > 4

Wasn't 4 the Laurie episode?

That was one of my favourites

Anyway, IMO this episode basically confirmed my earlier thoughts that it was a mistake to make this series into a Watchmen sequel rather than to keep it as original alternate history story. As Mordy points out, the whole racism/police/justice plot that made the early episodes so good was mostly sidelined in favour of the "who gets Manhattan's powers" plot, and the (white) comic book characters mostly stole the show from the one (black) protagonist that was original to the series. Even Trieu turned out to be related to one of the comic book characters, and motivated by his relation to him. So yeah, it was still quite good fanfiction, but it would've had potential for much more, if it hadn't been fanfiction.

that was 3 xp

in the end i thought this was kind of inert and unnecessary. the stuff about liberal hegemony and racist conspiracy was hamfisted. started out strong and then got lost

started out strong and then got lost

― goole, Monday, December 16, 2019 12:07 PM (nineteen seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

lol

do you see.

The Leftovers remains a towering achievement

I wouldn't go that far; ending was a little flat but it didn't diminish what came before to me; this wasn't one of those instances where the ending felt like it was meant as the overall conceit

Laurie suddenly deciding that Veidt needs to be arrested

We don't know if it was that sudden... Veidt disappeared over 10 years ago, maybe Laurie changed her mind during that time period, regretted that Veidt had most likely died and she couldn't bring him to justice, and now, as soon as she finds out Veidt's still alive, and after the immediate threat is over, she finally gets to arrest him.

Well, it wasn't like she was out there telling everyone that the Squid attack was a fake. She also made the arrest before Mirror Face produced the evidence, so it was just going to be her word.

Without Veidt, no one would believe her. We know that Rorshach's journal was published, and most people have written it off as a loony conspiracy theory. But maybe she thinks that by arresting Veidt, she can get her to confess. Also, while they're still in his lair, she can get all the physical evidence she needs, like the squid machine. So it's the perfect time and place to arrest him.

"she can get him to confess"

I liked Looking Glass' "does everyone in the FBI know?!"

Veidt's arrest was the most slapstick moment of the series

"That guy talks too much" was pretty funny

hah, the FBI line, too

lots of good mirror guy humor

just Mulder

i could just listen to tim blake nelson say shit in that accent for a while

We are pretty much led to believe by this week's Peteypedia that Laurie's arrest of Veidt is getting hushed up by the FBI

I guess my biggest overall issue was the baffling need to keep this to nine eps when 12 would have both matched the original run and provided just about the right amount of time to sufficiently explore the missing or insufficient backstory elements (eg Trieu's motivations) and/or give us a little more time with the most interesting second-stringers.

I thought there was just enough Trieu content and I don't really care about more backstory!

9 episodes because it's all about family. The egg ties into that, too.

Eggs come in dozens

The comic book had a pattern where every other issue was a "plot issue", moving the main plot forward, followed by a "character issue", where they focused on the past and motivations of one of the protagonists. I thought they were doing something similar here, but then they had the Hooded Justice episode right after the Looking Class one, and then the Jon episode right after the Angela one, so I guess not.

Though obviously they did do the same as the comic by leaving the antagonist's backstory for the last, because earlier we didn't even know he/she was the antagonist.

Thinking about the supposedly open ending, I think it's pretty clear Jon did put his powers into the egg, because in the previous ep he was walking on the water of the pool, and then he said "this will mean something to you later" or something like that. Why would he have done that, if he didn't plan on Angela getting the power through the egg? And there was also the omelette hint he gave to Will, as revealed here.

So, with all that, I think a better, more proper open ending would've been to show Angela hesitating whether or not to eat the egg, then fade to black before we see if she does. Then it would've been up for the viewer to decide whether even a supposedly good and just person like her deserves the power of a god.

then a dog jumps up and eats it out of her hand

And season 2 will be all about the adventures of... Dog Manhattan!

Great y'all just wrote Son of Mask 2 congrats

Dog goes back in time to 1985, avoids tire tread on burst stomach. Rorschach's journal opens instead with banality about the previous night's episode of "Dynasty"... the entire timeline changes.

If you want to look for some silly logic about 9, it'd be 9 panels to a page.

Post-finale Lindelof interview: https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/watchmen-season-2-damon-lindelof-finale-1203441149/

Bad finale. Not lost bad but still non-good and disappointing after a mostly great season. The problem was more with the execution than the story choices - the stuff with the clock was super clumsy and cheap looking; Keene Jr was a terrible actor who had to give a really long speech with a bad accent; maybe it would’ve been more effective to have Veidt arrive on earth in an earlier episode?

The Trieu stuff felt really mean in a “that bitch got what she deserved then, huh” way. And the very end? Not sure it needed ambiguity here, if it was going for an uplifting ending, it would’ve been better to see Angela walk on the water.

must defend James Wolk's honor; he's a splendid actor. He played it broad as hell, as presumably directed, for which mileage will vary.

In a show that focussed so much on breaking stereotypes, “Asian mastermind brought to disaster by her own grandiosity” felt like a bad choice.

Xpost

He was great in mad men! And obvs he looked good in that posing pouch. But Irons was a better ham, and Irons + Wolk was too much ham by half (for me).

also very good as a con man in the cancelled-after-two-episodes Lone Star

In a show that focussed so much on breaking stereotypes, “Asian mastermind brought to disaster by her own grandiosity” felt like a bad choice.

In that interview linked above Lindelof says that we're not necessarily meant to agree on Veidt's judgment of Trieu, and that she might've actually done some good with Manhattan's powers, but I don't think that idea came across in the episode at all.

Agree. Felt like it got played for comedy, in an inappropriate way (for frozen raining squid)

The path from “I disown you” to “I acknowledge you” to “I’m murdering you” felt, um, abbreviated

It would have made for another pause in the action which is presumably why they didn't do it, but a full episode on Trieu, her relationship with mother (and/or her other mother) and how she sees the world would have helped a lot in this regard xp

I didn’t watch, but judging by y’all’s comments, sounds like they really should have done 12 eps.

Basically, when you boil it down, the contrast between the main antagonists of the comic and the series goes like this:

Comic: the antagonist is a white man who manages to pull off his masterplan by not telling anyone about it before it's done, and it's deliberately left ambiguous where he saved mankind or was merely a mass murderer.

Series: the antagonist is a non-white woman who doesn't manage to pull off his masterplan, because she has daddy issues and tells her father (and various others) about it before it's done, the plan is then thwarted by said father, and there's nothing in the story to indicate she wasn't delusional when she said she could save mankind.

Seriously, there was absolutely no need to make Trieu into Veidt's kid and thus diminish her motivations by implying she just wants to prove herself to daddy. In the comic, Moore was pretty careful in not giving Veidt any such psychological excuse for doing what he did, even though he thoroughly psychologised the actions of most of the other characters.

"That’s impulsive, but that’s Angela. And so that was some of the thinking that went into at least why she decides to eat the egg — knowing that eating raw eggs is very dangerous."

Ok, now I'm questioning any brain cells I thought he had.

You won't find a better review of last night's Watchmen than this. pic.twitter.com/PYF7Rz3aQn

— Ben Towle (@ben_towle) December 16, 2019

FUCK YOU IT'S AN ALTERNATE TIMELINE

lmao

are we going to get an explanation of this next season?

Trieu is all backed-up, though, right? It would be easy to bring her back as a clone.

first there needs to be a next season.
xpost

I'm sure whoever takes over the series will allow her to rest in peace