I'm sad

Eat me.

No, it's OK, Kenan. I didn't understand that you were trying to be lighthearted to break a mood.

One of the worst things about hardcore depression is that you lose your ability to see humour in everything. The world really gets reduced down to this black and white flatness, where everyone is either with you or against you - usually against you.

I managed to not cry for most of the day yesterday, and then collapsed into bawling on the bus home, and stayed that way for the rest of the evening.

Today it's completely gone, like it was never there to start with. Maybe it's cathartic or something.

Kate, for me it helps realizing it will get better. This state isn't eternal. Also, it's not bad to cry. You should not feel guilty for crying.

i don't cry when i'm depressed -- that's when i'm the least emotional. the breakdowns happen when i'm a collection of raw nerves -- like when i haven't slept and i'm exhausted and anxious.

^

I have various "hues" of depression. When I'm so far into my depression, then I usually don't cry anymore. I guess I don't cry because I can't imagine a different state of mind. At one point death seemed "understandable".

At one point death seemed "understandable".

It seems like a serious downer, and yet I really hope I get ot the point before I die.

I'm too old to be depressed, I have family to take care of, but we had a death in the family and I can't get out of bed sometimes. Not the same as being depressed and not understanding why, but I hate myself for not getting out of bed in the morning.

It took me changing my gender to understand that Kenan is right about women and crying. Certainly men can and do cry, but you'd be surprised how much crying is linked to hormonal changes. There are actually chemical reasons why girls can suddenly feel like crying for no particular reason at all and there are also chemical reasons why a boy can feel sad but somehow, strangely unable to translate that into crying. It doesn't even have anything to do with societal pressure on them not to cry. I've been on both sides of the fence and I continue to be.

Not the same as being depressed and not understanding why, but I hate myself for not getting out of bed in the morning.

This could be a sign of depression. Not necessarily, obv., but it's possible. How to Diagnose Clinical Depression Symptoms("Hopelessness is one of the major depression symptoms. This is the feeling that there is no point in getting out of bed in the morning.").

There are actually chemical reasons why girls can suddenly feel like crying for no particular reason at all and there are also chemical reasons why a boy can feel sad but somehow, strangely unable to translate that into crying. It doesn't even have anything to do with societal pressure on them not to cry.

I wonder what that is all about. Surely it's not any one chemical that makes you cry, or even allows you to cry. Maybe -- and this is my flimsy hypothesis -- maybe testosterone suppresses that impulse, which would otherwise be fairly fundamental. I have always wondered why my girlfriends (and also girl friends) cried when they were sad, or angry, or even sometimes orgasmic, and I only cried during movies. The fact that I know songs that never fail to make me cry and yet I have had grandparents that passed without a tear from me has made me feel cold and wrong-headed for a long time.

the feeling that there is no point in getting out of bed in the morning

Another confusing topic for me. I certainly know the feeling of believing there's no POINT in getting out of bed, but I have also very frequently been UNABLE to get out of bed. I used to think it was blood sugar, and that's still possibly a part of it, but lately I think it's all about dopamine levels. They seem to have their own schedules and rules. My doctor can't even begin to explain. The main thing that the meds I'm on do is to jack the fuck out of my dopamine levels, which oddly not only wakes me up much more quickly in the morning, but enables me to get better sleep. Dopamine is not only the chemical that seems most related to physical movement, but also to sleep paralysis and hard REM sleep. Nobody really knows exactly how it works, because it works in tandem with SO many other brain chemicals... anyway. It's hard fro me to know some mornings if I'm unmotivated andsad and my day seems hopeless, or if I really honestly just can't move.

There's a stress hormone that women generally have higher levels of, prolactin, which has been studied as an agent for easier tearing up. I don't know if there have been any definitive results, though.

I believe estrogen plays a role as well, if you don't mind me saying so. What I do know is that often on the last day of my testosterone cycle (i.e. when T is at its lowest point and conversely, estrogen at its highest) I have these sudden involuntary tics (or jerks, whatever) where I nearly burst out crying over nothing at all. Of course I suppress these tics when they happen and do not actually cry, but I find them very irritating because there is no logical reason behind them and because they remind me I'm transgendered. I've talked to transgendered folks who are going in the other direction than I am and I believe they've experienced something similar.

Also, I mean...there has to be a reason why my mom cried uncontrollably when she hit menopause. There was no real reason behind any of it, it was just...what was happening to her body.

But yes, in general, I believe testosterone acts as a suppressant to crying, as Kenan said.

I think progesterone is a more likely agent than estrogen, though mainly from personal experience - progesterone peaks every month before menstrual bleeding begins (the bleeding is actually caused by progesterone withdrawal), and that's when I'm most prone to both depression and unstoppable crying. It fits with your mom's experience too - menopause in many women is characterized by high progesterone levels that no longer drop off. But sadness is sadness and whether exacerbated by uncontrollable hormone fluctuations or not, it's rough when a person is that low.

Yeah, that's true. I mean, we're talking about this stuff, but really anybody can cry or not cry and it may have nothing to do with hormones, sure. I don't know much about progesterone. I guess a Male-To-Female transperson would know more about that. I really don't remember what it was like emotionally when I had periods either, for some reason (though I certainly remember the physical pain). So yeah, thanks for contributing that bit of information, I didn't know that.

Ever since having kids, I'm much more prone to crying. The other day I cried after reading a baby having been beaten to death by her caretaker. I would always have been sad, but now I just started weeping. (Yes, I know it's also becauseI have kids, I know what loss the parent must have experienced. But still...)

Now that I am older I am around kids more. Male or female, when you see kids cry you want to cry too. When I was a kid, I used to tell crying people to quit whining. Maybe I should be sorry I did that and this is just karma for being lacking in compassion all these years.

The problem is, there are so many different kinds of sadness, and though they may present as similar in aspect, they have totally different causes and *feel* different.

The WAAAAAAHHH EVERYTHING IS GOING WRONG wail of pre-menstrual tension is different from the JUST. WANT. TO DIE. NOW. stabbing headache of the depressive cycle of depression is different from the EVERYTHING IS JUST POINTLESS blanket misery of being unhappy.

isn't crying supposed to purge the body of certain chemicals (neurotransmitters?) so that you feel better when it's over? Remember reading something to that effect.

Bimble, I hope you don't think me rude for bringing this up - no offense is intended - I had no idea you were transgender. F to M? That's really kinda amazing. Huge respect to you.

Yes, that's right, Kate. I never really know who's gotten that bit of information here and who hasn't. And I guess that's for the best. I know there are bound to be some folks here who'd like to kill me for it, so I try not to pay too much attention to it all. I do like you though, especially because I think our posting styles are actually quite similar at times.

I know there are bound to be some folks here who'd like to kill me for it,

Excuse me, unless you have specific names and claims, this is an ugly slanderous generalization to throw out there.

You mean, when we're drunk, Bimble? ;-)

(sorry, I've been hitting the Sailor Jerry while I paint.)

I'd like to think that ILX is more open minded than that, but hey, I am kinda sick of being surprised by people.

sad in a resigned and subtle way

a sad of weariness

Oh Bimble, sorry to bring it up if you wanted it on the d/l but knowing you are f2m makes me love you like 10x more.

sublimate your mood thru a soothing keytar melody, abbott

Abbott, i send you a spark of sunshine!

also elmo, lovin your username. she will be performing at my place of work this year!

I know there are bound to be some folks here who'd like to kill me for it, so I try not to pay too much attention to it all.

Really? This seems like a pretty come-as-your-are type of place to me ... but then again, I operate at the margins somewhat, so maybe I am unaware?

it's been a sad June

sux 2 b u all

It has been a somewhat grim June.

on the KIP side, mostly dope weather and i have a stupidly easy life a lot of the time

progesterone peaks every month before menstrual bleeding begins (the bleeding is actually caused by progesterone withdrawal), and that's when I'm most prone to both depression and unstoppable crying.

I think I'm weird because I'm always pretty energetic and sociable just before, but get depressed and angry right after.

This week has been the vicious cycle of "my life is pointless, everything I do is pointless, I don't want to do anything, so I do nothing, and the doing nothing reinforces the pointlessness of my life, etc."

^ The absolute worst.

http://api.ning.com/files/7-rD7DWxX8GYbD2WCU-f5KwwoZ08XcIw2AIgTIeqAiliOBGOWYdTID1DySYYdo81HJi9dQigxTBzGpKhwFODJK-*tv0DDaLs/worlds_saddest_dog_04.jpg

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH there he is!! Pugs are my favorite dogs and that pug is my all-time favorite pug ∴ that dog is my all-time favorite dog.

I want to pet him and give him treats so that he is not so sad anymore.

ps - I'm sorry if you are actually sad and not just here to post a picture of the world's most awesome dog.

Is he wearing some kind of sweater?

YES HE IS. Oh god - there is an entire flickr set of him and each picture is cuter than the one before it. Will see if I can find it.

http://kingkongdoctor.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/pp30340sad-puppy-posters.jpg

awwwwwwwww

I can't find the flickr set but seriously . . .

http://kecute.files.wordpress.com/2008/09/cute-dog.jpg?w=350&h=475

http://freakymartin.com/nitro/fishki/4789e09a94832002_pesik.jpghttp://freakymartin.com/nitro/fishki/4789e09a75422001_pesik.jpg

Guys he's so sad. He is breaking my heart.

Thanks ENBB. A little of both. Hopefully getting out this weekend will bring some cheer.

Yes hopefully it will. :-)

awwww, the one where he's looking up is making me sniffle.

I know! He's just . . . gah. I love that damn dog so much.

Painfully sad...don't think I'm gonna post here for a while. Have fun guys. All best.

we'll miss ya ...