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WHAT MORE SPOILERS OH MY GOD WHY HAVEN'T YOU STARTED A THREAD WELL I GUESS WE ARE IN A THREAD YOU MAKE A GOOD POINT

Honestly didn't even occur to me that Marie might kill herself on the beach! Obviously your take on he power dynamics is valid and I'm not sure what I wanted or expected... a horrible painful ending where everyone acknowledges that even when the bad guy goes down and justice is in some sense served that the system is equally culpable for generally allowing these sort of assaults to go unreported, uninvestigated and unwitnessed wasn't going to do anybody any good when the actual story does have clearer, less horrendous closure.

I guess I saw an opportunity to use this story to call for change in the way rapes are investigated, reported and in the way police and communities deal with victims and I'm not sure this ending did that at all. My sense was that the directors named the problem but then mostly acted like it was unavoidable. I would've liked more of cri de coeur than a general thumbs up to "good policework". But I can certainly understand how an ending in which repercussions for horrible actions are repaid with imprisonment amidst a great cast of strong, intelligent female leads might trump that concern for you. I guess what offended you about the mack the knife bit was what offended me about the larger, pro-police structure of the whole episode: I don't see how this pertains to the story I've been told up till now and it seems in bad taste.

in the propublica story, i think the other cop is either dead or retired by the time marie comes back so that was probably there to provide some narrative balance.

I listened to the This American Life episode they did about the real life case in 2016, and it's pretty stunning that even after everything that happened the foster mom still thinks it's kind of Marie's fault for not acting the way she should have after being raped

ugh, one way to remove her responsibility from what happened to Marie.

the show writers went out of their way to show the humanity of pretty much all the female characters except for her.

i did think the show did an excellent job of illustrating the lifelong reverberations of sexual assault, and that it actually takes a special sort of investigator to interview victims. it highlighted a lot of the failures of the system without being super obvious about it because they were highlighted by the way the two women investigators handled things in contrast to...everyone else.

it did a good job of dismantling elements of rape culture that seem extremely difficult for many people to grasp.

including the shitty foster mom

perhaps worth adding, shitty foster mom who made it clear that she too had been sexually assaulted

IME this is a generational thing.

like....I saw my mother recently (she's 72 now) and she laid this bomb on me: that one of her friends had had a child in the late 60's and has maintained that she was raped. She also let it slip that my uncle or someone else may have been the father. and then my mother just said "she says she was raped but I don't believe that." She's still friends with this woman. They're in their 70's. THis woman has said she was raped for over 40 years. And my mom still doesn't believe her? Maybe because she implicated her brother? I don't even fucking know. But there is a generation that looks at everything askance if it doesn't fit into their preconceived notions of how people should be.

MORE UNBELIEVABLE SPOILERS

Just wanted to chime in that I binged this last night and today, because I wanted so badly to see Marie get some kind of win while she was drowning in a sea of people of couldn't or wouldn't offer the smallest bit of empathy for her.

What else I liked was how the series showed how much backbreaking, beach-combing work the detectives did to find the guy, picking up on the most tenuous threads that led to an enormous pool of suspects and still making sense of all that noise.

But all the same, I kind of agree with Ulysses, that the exceptional case of the system, that's so stacked against women in assault cases, might allow some kind of retroactive justice seems to justify the existence of the same system. OTOH, it does underline how badly the system also depends on empathy for it to have any semblance of serving the public -- in stark distinction of justice being blind. I don't know if it's an optimistic reading or a bittersweet reading, that something abstract like justice depends on people overcoming so many systemic biases, to spend so much time and energy struggling against and through the status quo, when in a better world it should just work.

I'm definitely going to read the PP story at some point, as the miniseries has a few moments that were clearly designed to educate viewers ("this is how Y-STRs work, young intern") and I want to know what's rooted in the actual case.

ONE MORE SPOILER

One dangling thread is how the guy's encrypted drive remains encrypted, how the prosecutor seems absolutely indifferent about trying to crack that.

Oh and for a family that are both cops, the Duvalls have a hell of a nice spread.

I kept wondering what happened to the encrypted drive as well. No answers on that was disappointing. Who knows what else that malevolent creep did.

The Laundromat is good. It felt quick but I enjoyed it. It's pretty infuriating how little consequence occurred from the Panama Papers.

UNBEIEVABLE SPOILER

It's a overused statement at this point but the whole time that Rose McGowan quote played in my head “The only perfect rape victim is a dead rape victim."

Tell Me Who I Am was good.

Though it felt a bit voyeuristic to hear the allegations at the end.

the ProPublica article that inspired the show was expanded into a book - "A False Report" - if anyone wants more background on the case

i would actually! will hunt it down. Everyone should read the readily available propublica article; it's stunning how closely they stuck to the facts. Some of the dialogue is lifted verbatim!

and along the same lines RE: that encrypted hard drive via reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/UnbelievableNetflix/comments/d59o54/encrypted_hard_drive/

From the epilogue of the book:

"[John Evans, the computer forensics expert] sent the file to the FBI's geek squad, the Cryptologic and Electronic Analysis Unit of the Operational Technology Division. One of the most secretive branches of the agency, the cryptology unit had helped the National Security Administration comb through millions of emails. And its scientists, agents, and coders had helped numerous local law enforcement agencies with tough computer cases. But even the cryptologists could not break open the Wretch."

"On some days, when he is running a route high in the mountains, Bob Weiner's [the DA] thoughts will unexpectedly drift back to the Wretch. It has been years since O'Leary pleaded guilty. He is in prison for the rest of his life. He has never revealed the password. Weiner wonders what it could contain. 'Maybe there's information in there of a murder. I don't know,' Weiner says. 'My mind, periodically reverts back to 'What's going on, what is in there? I still think about it.'"

i mean, he called it "the wretch," yikes

"Living With Yourself", the Paul Rudd clone series, was only ok; actually a little disappointing. It's fine for what it is and you can binge it in 3.5 hours but when it was over I thought it could have been much better.

The music (by Anna Meredith) is fantastic though. Although it's often too interesting for a soundtrack.

The Game Changers is pretty good if you are considering a plant based diet. It goes through high performance athletes that are vegan and how meat eating was marketed as manly and required for power and strength and virility.

Living With Yourself felt empty on finishing because of the obvious bet-each-way ending, not knowing if he'll get to write any more so half-arsing between a cliffhanger and a wrap-up

loved the structure though: jumping back every second ep to recontextualise things from the other Rudd's perspective, but then overtaking and moving forward with the plot

i liked that but it also meant eating up time with stuff we'd already seen when there were ancillary parts that I thought needed more exposition (like the guys at the cloning company and the daughter? and Uncle Junior's turn as the CEO of the telecom company and his weird ass pig farm). It could have been 10 episodes long and I think would have been better for it.

I like Rudd, I like the premise, but 3 episodes in yeah it feels undercooked, especially next to similar fare they've bankrolled like Maniac and Russian Doll.

The scene with Hesch (not Uncle Junior!) at the farm also struck me as really weird/badly written. A Jewish Holocaust surivor that... runs a pig farm and force-feeds other men pork? That just doesn't make sense. And the pseudo-Mad Men pitch scenes also felt awkward.

The Paul Rudd show is so much worse than expected. I've nearly watched all of it (seven episodes), but yes, totally predictably written and the women in it are the most wildly unbelievable female characters I've seen for a while.

Daybreak is so stupid but I like it.

Oh and yes, the Anna Meredith music is totally overused! I love that album, but it was just used very prominently in Eighth Grade, and I don't think it can be used again to the same effect so recently

yeah the thing was Uncle Junior and the pork was really weird. Which is why I thought it required more exposition. I imagine it'll come back in season 2 and I can see this show going in interesting directions, but it felt slight, perfunctory, and a bit repetitive.

the Jenny Slate special is really good, wish it was a tiny bit longer.

Tell Me Who I Am is pretty great, though also at times felt a little slower than it needed to be; and I also want to know who the fuck the mom's friends were.

counterpoint: the Jenny Slate special is really bad and we turned if off after about 30 minutes. Relies a lot on finding her constant nervous laughter entertaining imo. Has she ever done standup before? Cuz I've liked her acting in various things but this was like watching someone who had literally never done standup before. Seemed to have no concept of how to set up jokes/build a set.

had the same experience wanted to like it but alas

i found it ok. i like jenny slate and find her charming, the stage show performance itself is just lacking

Slate used to be a stand-up, but afaik hasn't done it much in the last decade

yeah the thing was Uncle Junior

this is a wild double-down

lol I thought he said that just to annoy me

i have a massive crush on her and am inclined to watch this even with your forewarning because i'm okay listening to her giggle for an hour

I like the new David Chang show (watched episode 2, 3, 4). I used to think he was too bro-y. He's gotten a lot better.

i have a massive crush on her and am inclined to watch this even with your forewarning because i'm okay listening to her giggle for an hour

― Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Friday, October 25, 2019 1:45 PM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

same but it wasn't great imo

Daybreak is so stupid but I like it.

on the fourth ep now - first ep and the top part of the second seemed a bit off pacing-wise but it starts coming together around the time they end up at the mall. i agree it is super dumb but really fun at the same time - i think i would have loved this if I was 16.

first episode of the new david chang is unwatchable due to stoned seth rogen and his v.annoying reflex laugh

I had no desire to watch that one but finished and and was rethinking going back. Chang seems to be trying so hard to fill the Bourdain gap but serious misstep in having the first episode with Rogan.

i want to watch his shows but i can never get past the “just hanging out shooting the shit” vibes

He has more interesting people on epis 2, 3, 4 and tries to provide more cultural depth now.

Daybreak - i love apocalyptic, teenage movies with scenes in a mall, questionable acting and random but funny oneliners. It has surprisingly good music too.

Yeah Mountain Goats at end of ep 2 made me grin. Its not a bad show - a little tooooo aware of itself/its metaness but good fun anyway. Also agree 16 year old me would have loved it.

I did like when, after 10 mins of blatant "Ferris Bueller" action, he sat down on front of his new principal who actually is Matthew Broderick and just ... has this look, but doesnt say anything, they never underline the pun, just left it hanging.

RZA episode was great!

Agree with |||||||| about the new David Change. Just a really poor choice of guests, on the whole, and you have to wonder if anyone actually did any work on the show before the cameras started rolling. They are so underprepared. If it was intentional, it doesn’t work, it just comes across aimless. Rogan is unbearable (that laugh!) Kate McKinnon, who I like well enough otherwise is annoyingly performery, like some irritating acquaintance that talks in funny voices all the time. It’s almost pathological. No idea who Chrissy Teigan is and the crew clearly had no idea why they were in Marrakesh or what to do there.

BUT the Lena Waithe is really great because she’s so smart and interesting. She seems to have to intention of trying to please the viewer other than being incredibly sincere. Even how polite she is to waiting staff is touching. It’s strange mix of coolness and guilelessness, which is fairly rare for TV people.

I like David Chang and always have but this is 3/4 trash.

*Seems to have no intention, that should say.

Loads of typos there. Apols.

can't get past Rogen's voice, almost 100% of the time. that weed resin mucus phlegm filter sound is too much.