Impeach Trump Y/N

Ventura in a landslide

If there are specific issues at play it's the allegiance of 63 million Americans, in a political sense, to the interests of their tribe to the exclusion of everything else. That's clearly a serious problem, but it doesn't make them "completely deranged"

yes it does

rush, you took one thing i said and spun it off into many directions, which is fine. it's hard to respond to because of the number of different points you made, several of which i think are incorrect. to pick one in particular, though, that affects the rest of your argument, i disagree with this on multiple levels: "There are a few people, maybe as few as one, causing whatever this fucked up shit going on right now is". clearly the problem goes beyond Trump. you partly address this by saying that the republican machinery plays a role by "working to make this man, who is clearly a deranged lunatic, appear to be a respected authority." but i think of them as also actively causing the problem, rather than just playing a cheerleader role on the side.

i also disagree with the idea that 63 million trump supporters are innocent bystanders who happened to be fooled by the republican machinery. "The everyday people, the 63 million? Mostly, from what I can tell, they're just along for the ride. They're going along to get along, they're trying to be Good Americans." - i completely disagree with that. they know what's up. they know what it means to support trump. when there's a president that is so publicly racist and corrupt, from before the election to today, voting for him means SUPPORTING his behavior. remember the desmond tutu quote? “If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor." That is still true.

xp

and if you think there's a sizable portion of those trump supporters who have somehow remained oblivious to who this man is, you think even less of their intelligence than i do. and i see them as human brainstems, bumping around and scraping against each other until they finally die and fuck off

i also disagree with the idea that 63 million trump supporters are innocent bystanders who happened to be fooled by the republican machinery. "The everyday people, the 63 million? Mostly, from what I can tell, they're just along for the ride. They're going along to get along, they're trying to be Good Americans." - i completely disagree with that. they know what's up. they know what it means to support trump. when there's a president that is so publicly racist and corrupt, from before the election to today, voting for him means SUPPORTING his behavior. remember the desmond tutu quote? “If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor." That is still true.

― It is my great honor to post on this messageboard! (Karl Malone)

Oh yes, it's absolutely true. Those 63 million people are all _responsible_ for their actions. Their actions and the beliefs which enable those actions are a problem.

Where I draw the line is the idea that those problems are our responsibility. We are literally powerless to do anything to fix their fucked up shit. The extent to which I don't worry about them is the extent to which even though they may support politicians who want me dead, they will always, in practice, consider me one of the "good ones". It's, how far do we need to go to protect ourselves? How dangerous are these people and in what ways?

Given the right circumstances, in the right situation, yeah these are dangerous people. I wouldn't make any of them prison guards (wait, what do you mean they already are?). So I try to manage the situations in which I encounter these people.

I try to stay out of dark alleys, both in the world and in my own head.

yeah we’re talking 3-4 million salvageable Trump voters TOPS. any attempt by democrats to woo the other 60m is just the dumbest shit ever, and anyone telling you differently actually wants the Democrats to lose.

I think a lot of these people are dangerous because they are idiots, which is not necessarily the same as being dangerous idiots. That is, they are profoundly ignorant of politics and policy in all but the broadest sense, if that, but those broad feelings and beliefs are what (unfortunately) drive them to vote. The flip side of these folks is I suppose the people profoundly ignorant of politics and policy who *don't* vote, who are no less dangerous in effect. I think a very small fraction (though big enough) of these people in both groups are actually dangerous individuals, but maybe no more than the general population. I also don't think most of these people are necessarily bad people who mean harm and hurt on others. It's just that they are, again, so profoundly ignorant of politics and policy (for lots of reasons) that they might not consider how the politicians they support enable bad things they may not believe in. Or may not realize the ways the politicians they *don't* support could help further the *good* things they believe in! Doesn't make them entirely defensible, but they're not as bad as, say, someone like Stephen Miller or Trump himself, or militia people or whomever, who are outright sociopaths.

That's to say, I think that most people, on a micro, case by case, person by person, neighbor by neighbor basis, would offer aid or support to their fellow American if asked. But many of those same people vote for assholes, or don't vote at all.

the good news is there are literally no bad people

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBCw4_XgouA

I can't cosign map's post in a world that contains Logan Paul

lol

Chris Hayes asking a good rhetorical question: why was the US Ambassador to the EU, of which Ukraine is not a part, apparently handling anything involving Ukraine?

xpost (Obviously there are plenty of terrible people, just not that many, probably, but it doesn't take many to ruin things for everybody.)

Ventura in a landslide

― maffew12, Friday, October 4, 2019

Finally, The Rock has come back to Washington, DC!

However, the defeated Trump will make noise about running again, keeping them all looking small.

Trump is not going to be capable of making comprehensible noises in 2024, or of controlling his own bowels. Like Bush going down the memory hole, the second he is out of office the media will feel safe accurately describing him as a senile, racist, incompetent idiot.

totally agree with Josh's take

but that's not Bush anymore, he's that nice fella who gives Michelle Obama candy at funerals

so sez Val Jarrett and those other cogs

xp

also trying to predict anything about 2024 now is like trying to predict President Trump in 2013

or tomorrow.

I had a guy in his early 20s recently ask me "so I've been hearing about democrats and uh what's the other ones? repulicans? yeah. what's the deal with them, what are the differences?". I don't think he's all that unusual in just being totally ignorant wrt politics.

yes that was normal even 30 years ago

meanwhile:

Economist/YouGov Poll:

should House try to impeach Trump?

50% yes
39% no

if House impeaches, should Senate remove Trump from office?

51% yes
39% no

— John Harwood (@JohnJHarwood) October 4, 2019

NEW: House Democrats seek Ukraine-related documents from VP Pence as part of impeachment inquiry. - @AlexNBCNews pic.twitter.com/crDfEw7TZn

— NBC News (@NBCNews) October 4, 2019

FYI, I have like 6 Gmail addresses and one of them is signed up for Trump emails (as "Bob Dobalina"). Here's the one I got today:

Bob,

I need your help.

I’m working hard to make sure the Democrats and their media lapdogs hold Quid Pro Joe accountable for his LIES and his son’s corrupt actions.

But, the FAKE NEWS MEDIA refuses to tell the truth about Sleepy Joe’s dirty past.

It’s time to take charge. If the FAKE NEWS media won’t report the truth, then WE WILL.

My team just launched an ad to FIGHT BACK against their biased coverage. We need to raise $1,000,000 in the next 24 hours to FLOOD THE AIRWAVES with this ad, so we’re turning to our best supporters for help.

Without your support, the Fake News will do everything in their power to censor this ad and prevent Americans from hearing the truth.

Please contribute $5 in the NEXT 24 HOURS to our Official Trump Ad Blitz Fund to help our ad dominate the airwaves. >>

CONTRIBUTE $20

CONTRIBUTE $15

CONTRIBUTE $10

CONTRIBUTE $5

CONTRIBUTE ANY AMOUNT

We can’t let the Left turn the tables on us. They are trying to turn a Biden Scandal into a Trump Scandal by calling for my IMPEACHMENT.

The American People deserve to know the TRUTH about Joe and Hunter Biden, and it’s up to Patriots like YOU to hold them accountable.

Please contribute $20, $15, $10, or even $5 to our Official Trump Ad Blitz Fund to help us push this ad far and wide.

Thank you and let’s FLOOD the airwaves.

"Quid Pro Joe" and "Sleepy Joe" - two nicknames in two paragraphs! That's some brilliant politickin'!

Been a while since Trump used "hereby" in a tweet, he must not be taking this stuff that seriously.

They are trying to turn this thing I'm trying to turn into a Biden scandal back into a Trump one lol this fuckin guy

can't wait til someone other than Biden gets the nomination

lol at Bob Dobalina

It is of my opinion that the people are impeaching...

if i have a point (i might not) it's this: the chuds are not our misfortune

Breaking via NBC: Weeks before the whistleblower's complaint became public, the CIA's top lawyer made what she considered a criminal referral to the Justice Dept. about the whistleblower's allegations that Trump abused his office in pressuring Ukraine. https://t.co/bVMDEveD79

— Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) October 4, 2019

amazing

#derpstate

Rumors being reported of a second CIA whistleblower with even more extensive details than the first.

not following this at all but just wanna vent that all the ppl on my twitter feed who would not stfu about how pelosi was too chicken to do impeachment are all completely silent now that impeachment is actually happening

Quel surprise

i guess i should be happy that they have at least stfu

yup I’ve been enjoying that tbh

Here we go
https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/464480-second-intel-official-considering-filing-complaint-over-trump-report

And
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/10/04/republican-sen-ron-johnson-just-did-trump-no-favors-ukraine/

The 2nd whistleblower has information about Trump’s dealing with Ukraine, right? I want the Trump tax return whistleblowers to come forward and hit him where it hurts. His credulity as a successful billionaire.

errr... credibility

was hoping someone else would post this but since no one has... kinda lol but mostly sad?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trumps-calls-with-foreign-leaders-have-long-worried-aides-leaving-some-genuinely-horrified/2019/10/04/537cc7a8-e602-11e9-a331-2df12d56a80b_story.html

not following this at all but just wanna vent that all the ppl on my twitter feed who would not stfu about how pelosi was too chicken to do impeachment are all completely silent now that impeachment is actually happening

― flopson, Friday, October 4, 2019 8:57 PM (forty-nine minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Quel surprise

― Οὖτις, Friday, October 4, 2019 9:04 PM (forty-two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i guess i should be happy that they have at least stfu

― flopson, Friday, October 4, 2019 9:05 PM (forty-one minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

yup I’ve been enjoying that tbh

― Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Friday, October 4, 2019 9:07 PM (forty minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

reporting live, as a person who stfu about it: i stfu about it because she finally did it because...she finally did it. not sure if i'm supposed to keep urging her to impeach, may consider raising it again

dunno how much credit pelosi should get for lucking into an even more blatant set of reasons to impeach, it being the right thing to do now doesn't mean it was wrong to pursue it then

she deserves a lot of credit for understanding the moment to do it

Y'know, if (IF) any of this manages to stick and/or hurt Trump, one of the more bizarre ironies will be...

Wait. Let me work up to this. The story has already involved Nickelback and Romney as partly good guys, so it's going to take some doing to get the tone here exactly right.

As it stands today, the institution that is doing the most to insist on the rule of law and call attention to unwarranted abuse of power... is... the CI frickin A?

the implication from most of those posters was she would never do it bc she didn’t have it in her was terrible couldn’t lead etc etc

ditto xxxxp (Jesus Christ, all the fucking posts)

she had no choice

her previous "he wants us to impeach him, so we won't" was dopey even for a 'cover story'

nice to see Pelosi Crew is still intact, maybe you can help her marginalize the Squad when this is over