PMs change and lol we're all gonna die (but brexit will never end)

My question to ilxor brits: why is Corbyn still in charge of the opposition? He has been there for what? 4 years? He's had the referendum, a general election, and the entire EU negotiation process to rally the nation against this scourge, a scourge that is the largest existential threat to his ideology and he just seems unable to stop it. Is there really no one else more competent for the situation?

[popcorn.gif]

Considering the intense media antipathy, general lack of Remainer/counter-No-Deal backbone and the parliamentary math he seems to have done fine to me? But I'll let the UKers weigh in lol

He has solid support from the party membership is why. The portion that hate him look around and see that all the wets that could/would/tried to challenge him are incapable of doing so because they mostly rode in on Blair's coattails and it seems like they don't actually know how to win things or plot. Plus -- even if they were it's hardly a good time because we're in a permanent state of crisis/"don't interrupt your enemy" territory rn.

tldr: they came for the king, they missed.

A joint statement from @UKLabour, @theSNP, @LibDems, @Plaid_Cymru, @ForChange_Now and @TheGreenParty as we work together to stop Boris Johnson's smash and grab on democracy: pic.twitter.com/e8fd2uSstS

— Jeremy Corbyn (@jeremycorbyn) August 29, 2019

the last time the UK had a remotely centre left-ish government was the early 1970s if i'm being exceptionally generous, Labour under Corbyn would have faced massive obstacles to power without Brexit, and Brexit has split the country down the middle across traditional party allegiances and pushed the state's unwritten constitution to possible breaking point so maintaining forward momentum (cough) for the last four years has been a significant feat

also leaders, schmeaders

ffs how many more years do we have to explain Crobbyns

have to do the occasional "for those of you who've just tuned in"

Listen up Van Horn Street (and all of you flakes) Corbyn and his momentum thugs are going to do a Venezuela and there is nothing you can do to stop it.

Momentum national co-ordinator Laura Parker calls on the group's members to “occupy bridges and blockade roads” in protest at Boris Johnson suspending Parliament.
She says: "Our message to Johnson is this: if you steal our democracy, we’ll shut down the streets.”

— Kevin Schofield (@PolhomeEditor) August 29, 2019

corbyn is playing the long game against the neoliberal order.

we will crash out with no deal
??????
labour wins election

we completely extricate ourselves from NATO, the WTO, the EU, etc. etc.

everyone has an allotment, not just corbz. agriculturally self-sufficient in 5 years.

no more rules against state aid. so we reopen tata steel. specializing in drain covers now obv.

homelessness solved by expropriating the 100s of 4000 sq feet apartments in london that oil despots keep their exotic animals in.

will the real prime minister please stand up

Tory MP Ken Clarke tells Sky he "probably would" support @jeremycorbyn as a caretaker PM to stop no deal. But only if he could be kept "under control" and "wouldn't have the slightest chance of implementing any bits of his Labour manifesto"

— Rob Powell (@robpowellnews) August 29, 2019

sign me the fuck up tbh xp

I've been jesting but on reflection this sounds good.

i'll be growing potatoes and collecting dulce on the barren hebridean island my great great great grandparents were evicted from if you need me

The end of goal has always seemed to be to turn the United Kingdom into Singapore.

This is true when it comes to Singapore’s ‘competitive environment’, not true when it comes to Singapore’s gigantic network of affordable public housing.

Whats the actual reason proroging is bad? If its a tool thats on the books and available to use how can parliament complain? Especially as there was plenty of advance notice the tories were likely to pursue this path, and they decided against preventing it.

I don't see how its undemocratic if its part of the rules and the people who had the ability to prevent decided against it

he's prorogued it for longer than usual, in order to limit the time parliament sits before the deadline, in order to not allow parliament to debate

no it's not technically illegal so it's totally fine

almost everything about the UK constitution is undemocratic

Yeah, I realize that but its in the rules isn't it? And when corbz gets in we can used it to confiscate all the garages and golf balls

Especially as there was plenty of advance notice the tories were likely to pursue this path, and they decided against preventing it.

refer you to mark s’ wise words upthread:

as well as being byzantine and unwritten, the rules change and the meanings of the rules change!

this is what politics is, and the active space of politics is how much change can be made and how much will be tolerated

proroguing is legitimate. the expectation is that it’s for a couple of weeks prior to the Queen’s Speech. five weeks just before a potential deal is let’s say pushing the envelope of what people will tolerate. the extent to which tories won’t tolerate it is to be seen.

xpost to anvil.

It's a coincidence that the D&D thread's active this week because there are a lot of similarities between the UK constitution and a badly run role-playing game

I actually agree that the underhandedness of the proragation is not in proportion to the vapours displayed by some folks but it also represents an opportunity to attack the government so it has to be done

when are you guys gonna get around to murdering the queen

Surely the fault is with those who failed to close the door on the possibility of prorogation at time. If i dont close the door behind me and it rains on my carpet, I have to take some blame, can't put all the blame on clouds

I mean he said he was going to do it and everyone said ok striker knock yourself out

yes that is fair enough, they did have a chance. but the process of the last three years has been quite often a case of factions unable to avoiding the unavoidable until it actually became unavoidable and even then not quite managing it and relying on eg Theresa May to bail them out.

Oh there's plenty of blame to go round, we've been rolling our eyes for months at the inability of the opposing pols to get their shit together

the government’s path to this point has been facilitated by a desire not to oppose the government by people who claim to oppose what it is intending to do.

when are you guys gonna get around to murdering the queen

I wonder if Jacob Rees Mogg stares up the ceiling at night knowing he lied to the Queen.

Because he did.

— Emma Kennedy (@EmmaKennedy) August 29, 2019

There is something -- not nothing -- to be said for Johnson calling out all of the hero soft Tories.

I mean I haven't heard shit from Dominic Grieve in the last couple of days. I take the good news where I can find it.

Even now parliament is actually proroging itself, surely? If it didn't want to be prorogued they could just do a vote of no confidence, unless I'm missing something?

So the idea this is happening against parliaments will doesn't add up. It is parliaments will, or they would do something different

https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/NINTCHDBPICT000517078409.jpg

"can't put all the blame on clouds"

is that a land bridge between britain and a metastasising ireland?

I liked Emma Kennedy when she was Nostradamus, that was a while ago though.

there is a very weird strain in americans, whose political system is an absolute mockery of democracy and who are the most brutalized and incarcerated people by their own state in the developed world, finding the ceremonial functions of the queen or the constitutional conventions of the uk beyond the pale.

i mean yes the uk constitution is terrible ruritanian garbage

xpost to anvil

and its an absolutely fair point anvil especially as it gets to the crux of the matter that parliament, ie including the tory rebels so-called, have not collectively had the desire to defeat the government in meangful legislation.

aiui they can’t now unilaterally avoid proroguing, but they can still pass legislation to seek an extension or vonc during the time available to them.

When Americans are appalled at our "constitution" I basically feel flattered that they've bothered to take an interest.

Maybe we can have theirs, don't think they'll be needing it soon

Surely the fault is with those who failed to close the door on the possibility of prorogation at time.

As I was slowly scrolling through this thread and saw the tip of Calzino's image post, I thought it was going to be this - which I'm sure could easily be adapted into a pro/anti brexit image:

https://www.music-bazaar.com/album-images/vol3/221/221203/1579170-big/CAN-cover.jpg

More like CAN'T...

Corbyn brought the anti-prorogue amendment before the summer recess and unfortunately the noes had it, to much haw-haw-haw from Tory benches. Rare outburst of yelling from Corbyn: ‘you won’t be laughing in September!’

at this difficult time id like to point you to the irish model of "two big parties that do p much the same thing, vote one out when you're sick of the other" with a dash of actual political theory based sprinkling coalition partners

I was reading you guys trying to define FF and FG the other day and I can still never remember what the difference is but my friend's got a cousin who's a big cheese in the one of them

FF was founded by the long fella and FG was founded by the big fella.

FG had a fascist movement in the 30s called the Blueshirts.

FG is Barry’s tea and FF is Lyons.

FF gets a mention in the national anthem and FG doesn’t.

finding the ceremonial functions of the queen or the constitutional conventions of the uk beyond the pale.

tbc I'm just a defenestration fetishist

RTÉ’s insistence on calling them “Fianna Foyle” is much more annoying than “Fine Gwael”.