"oh you don't get me I'm the end of the union": lol brexit is how we're all gonna die

what does a LD voter who voted Leave look like

...a Cornishman?

xpost i agree with ||||| completely but i can also understand people taking an interest in how the leader of the labour party voted.

and sure gyac, but i don't think we should form our views based on responses to bad faith arguments. it is important how he voted. he is the leader of the second biggest party in the country. his political views are important just as the point about may is important.

bath!

xp

ooh i'm wrong they were remain :/

The vote is three years old this June and is not being brought up in good faith. Anyone seriously invested I this is doing the Tories’ work for them. I am inclined to believe Corbyn voted Remain as he said he did, and he’s since said would do so again. The rest of your point is patronising nonsense devoid of context, so it can stay there.

May voted Leave only I see thru it

The vote is three years old this June and is not being brought up in good faith. Anyone seriously invested I this is doing the Tories’ work for them. I am inclined to believe Corbyn voted Remain as he said he did, and he’s since said would do so again. The rest of your point is patronising nonsense devoid of context, so it can stay there.

i don't think it's patronising to mildly disagree with someone on a politics thread without any personal attack whatsoever - your reaction seems fairly ott.

wait is labour really the second biggest party in the country?

okay - i think how he voted is important because he is labour leader and the labour leader's political views are important to me. is that better?

xp I guess making incredibly obvious points, as though speaking to a child, and then feigning ignorance when you get pushback might be a productive approach somewhere.

I see Tusk has decided to bring out the “special place in Hell rhetoric” so I expect tomorrow to be a complete shitshow. Bets on when the lectern comes out?

the second biggest party in the country is actually the SNP

When people are talking about May lying, what sort of things do they mean? She makes a lot of 'artful' statements, but I don't think of her doing a lot of saying things that she knows aren't true (other than 'of course I enjoy football like a regular carbon-based biped' etc)

For example, the quote that started this

“She knows what she promised us,” one ERG source said. “Even if she didn’t mean what she said, we do.”

I find it a lot easier to believe that the sound of the blood thumping in the ERG's ears caused them to hear what they wanted to, than that May would tell them one thing and then someone else another.

xxp that's what you get when you sit down with a Catholic firebrand like Varadkar.

She lies all the fucking time! Really blatant lies about things that most people can't be bothered to look into the detail of, like what she said in what meeting with what leader.

Haha by terrible miscoordination it appears that the right time to announce Labour's support for an article 50 extension is the one PMQs when Corbyn can't make it.

xpost they were just rhetorical statements. i was responding to "it’s not like his vote would have turned the tide anyway". to me wondering why people would speculate at all about how he voted feels a more abstract or entrenched stance to your subsequent points about him prob voting remain.

i also haven't actually encountered the bad faith arguments tbh - not for a second saying they don't exist, i just personally avoid the kind of places where i imagine they are set out.

that may explain why i can't instantly place myself alongside your opposition to them. i guess brexit is confusing enough that his personal position is still a valid subject of interest and maybe doubt, even if his actual vote is less so.

anyway - the above meant in the spirit of defusing any rancour.

none brexit left beef

Lads I think I've found FH: https://www.conservativehome.com/leftwatch/2019/02/thornberry-cant-guarantee-her-foreign-policy-wont-indulge-human-rights-abusers-when-corbyn-does-exactly-that.html

v good look to be knocking thornberry for human rights concerns when the tories are nuzzling into saudi arabia

sorry andrew - as a labour voter i don't read conservative home

it's still incredible to me that anyone in the tory party feels like trying to score foreign policy/human rights point off labour while they support the aerial slaughter and starvation of tens if not hundreds of thousands of yemenis

strikes me we’re in a v dangerous moment for labour rn - lot of effort and cunning required to thread the needle in the coming weeks. jim pickard article in the FT re unions interesting

meanwhile, the ever-churning mind of sammy wilson has flopped out this gem

My response to the devilish, trident wielding, euro maniac, Donald Tusk ⬇️ pic.twitter.com/wguBeW6mn9

— Sammy Wilson MP (@eastantrimmp) February 6, 2019

trident, pitchfork, close enough

xp what do you expect, him to respect a Catholic?

Tusk doesn't show contempt for the voters at all. He's explicitly showing contempt for the politicians campaigning 4 brexit without knowing how to deliver it.

*replaces parliamentary mace with trident*

There’s some good colourful language in there though, “devilish Euro maniac” and “stiffening the resistance” - ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) - leap out but “fanned the flames of fear” just elevated the whole thing.

You can almost feel the spittle!

the paradise of a free and prosperous united kingdom as foretold in the rangers xmas annual

Blair was right, politicians are our betters

i srsly regard the DUP as people with something fundamental missing

I can imagine Sammy Wilson saying to a parliamentary aide, "So this, Donald Tusk, is he a left footer or what? He is? Right, I'm going after him with the full Papist antichrist routine, so I am".

donald tusk, yesterday:

https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fuproxx.files.wordpress.com%2F2015%2F08%2Fanchorman-carell.jpg%3Fquality%3D100%26w%3D650&f=1

i guess it's useful to have the DUP around as a reminder of what people were like hundreds of years ago

More like a hundred seconds ago in some parts of our wonderful nation.

Yeah thank god they don't represent a constituency in 2019

i guess it's useful to have the DUP around as a reminder of what people were like hundreds of years ago

those marches are only supposed to happen a few times a year

This is horrendous misreporting by the BBC. I try really hard not to criticise it but the bias here seems undeniable. https://t.co/TsUfiZu4Cd

— project beer 🍻 (@skdougherty) February 6, 2019

Responsible reporting here. There’s no doubt Tusk isn’t the most tactful person, but I find it really relatable. People feigning ignorance about this are just expecting him to take the widespread abuse of Polish people in the UK as given, are they? Not to mention, like, literally everything else.

the paradise of a free and prosperous united kingdom as foretold in the rangers xmas annual

― FernandoHierro, Wednesday, February 6, 2019 12:56 PM (twenty-seven minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Note that the word "United" was cbia

i think this person's saying "Brexiteer" means anyone who voted Leave, but I've usually seen it in reference to prominent Leave politicians i.e. D Davis, JRM etc

xpost

> "I have been wondering what the special place in hell looks like for those who promoted Brexit without even a sketch of a plan how to carry it safely"

> Donald Tusk: Special place in hell for Brexiteers

it's not THAT far away from what he said. the main bone of contention seems to be caused by the brexit voters / brexit promoters / brexiteers conflation.

xp

It makes a big difference because first one makes it sound like he’s attacking the voters.

It makes a huge difference. I don't understand how one can say "it's not THAT far away from what he said'. Doesn't matter how near or far away, it's not what he said. It's not complicated.

The disinformation age is just so disheartening.

it's a paraphrase. it'd have quotes around it if it was a direct quote.

Brexit voters were not expected to have a ‘plan’. The politicians who have been bitching about the EU and demanding we leave - let’s call them Brexiteers - have had 40 years to come up with a plan. This ‘look, he’s calling you proles names’ thing isn’t washing with me.

In the Commons the Tory Brexiter Peter Bone described Donald Tusk’s anti-Brexiter comment as a “completely outrageous insult”, adding:

I don’t recall any president insulting members of this House, members of the government and the British people in such a way.

(Reminder: during the EU referendum Bone campaigned alongside Nigel Farage, the then Ukip leader, under the banner of Grassroots Out, the organisation they both founded. Farage’s offensiveness towards EU politicians is legendary. He famously described Herman Van Rompuy, Tusk’s predecessor as president of the European council, as having “all the charisma of a damp rag and the appearance of a low-grade bank clerk”.)

fact checking we can believe in

(from the graun live blog)

Britain's politicians compare these guys to Stalin, Nazis, or whatever else comes to mind, and just expect them to take it. But the minute they answer back they're "showing contempt".

Britain is in an abusive relationship with the EU. And we're the abusive partner. https://t.co/VufFQ0Z8tm

— Jonn Elledge (@JonnElledge) February 6, 2019

brexit is an attempt to take us back to the glory days when britain was the world's abusive partner iirc

"people who campaigned for something they had no credible plan to achieve are bad" is exactly the same as "FUCK YOU TOMMY ROSBIF" tbf, can't see how the elision possibly changes the context