Rolling Maleness and Masculinity Discussion Thread

Conversely, there's quite a bit of xenophobic snobbery about wine in France, but it never struck me as particularly gendered.

Yeah I was wondering if the UK is so tedious about the scotch and irish whiskey brand they drink. I mean I think it is pretty niche all around? Depending on the person?

― Yerac, Friday, 18 January 2019 16:28 (two minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i think, and its hard to be general about it, but its like you said about wine, really

if you know enough to know what you like you can go by style, brand, profile

if you just want to drink whiskey to drink whiskey you buy a pricey one and hope you enjoy it while showing it off

if you just want to get pissed, tesco brand or w/e

(the ppl you see acting most like what mh describes are, quite appropriately in context, probably gonna be american men)

but its gotta be skewed also by the "big tourism industry get em in" noted re vineyards above too

Do Irish men generally pay more attention to these details than Irish women?

brownie what bar, if you don't mind my asking?

Pretty sure it was on the west side, but I can't remember. I usually stick to Forage or Mahall's when I'm over there so maybe one of those?

gah, my memory

men drink with their lips women drink with thine eyes

It's funny because scotch probably seems snobby because it has some similarities of why people think old world wine (french/spanish, italian/etc) is snobby. You have to know a little about the region listed on the label to know the style of wine/whiskey you are getting. Isley whiskey is a lot different than one labeled HIghland. Chablis is a lot different than white Burgundy.

It's funny because scotch probably seems snobby because it has some similarities of why people think old world wine (french/spanish, italian/etc) is snobby. You have to know a little about the region listed on the label to know the style of wine/whiskey you are getting. Isley whiskey is a lot different than one labeled HIghland. Chablis is a lot different than white Burgundy.

fucking hell

Do Irish men generally pay more attention to these details than Irish women?

― pomenitul, Friday, 18 January 2019 16:35 (two minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

irish women dont drink

is that true?!?

there are a few local dudes who I enjoy running into at the bar who, for some period of time, we bartenders themselves at a local music venue

one now works for a local craft brew place and generally just has one of their standard beers if he's drinking a single beer

otherwise I typically see many of them drinking a can of cheap beer with a shot of whiskey, very granddad-style

however, after bartending at a local music festival they were drinking "the festival cocktail" all summer which was a shot of vodka w/ice and then topped off with White Claw (basically the newest "flavored sparkling water with booze in it" product)

of course I'm like, sure, why not and poured myself a few

lol

no it is not true

Feels like the single malt companies have decided on a blizzard of one-off bottlings so there's no chance of knowing what the hell you are getting, forcing you to buy based on name and price.

the equivalent irish woman to irish whiskey dude does it with gin, is my narrow experience

xpost damn you! the most shocking thing you have ever said.

lol

the french and their wine, I don't know if it's xenophobic. I think they are just protecting their product. They have so much of it, how dare you bring another country in.

Like when Cono Sur was sponsoring part/all of the Tour de France and the french got PISSED.

if you reframe ppl thinking the perceived french snootiness is less about a bourgeois superiority and is more about a populist pride in the fruits of their labor a lot of things really make more sense

More broadly, agree that the bottom line is that men are not supposed to be too "fussy" or nuanced about their drinking. However I think it's interesting how successful the craft beer boom was, suggesting that there was actually a lot of pent-up thirst among men for drinks that, you know, tasted better? And it seems like that in turn has led to the craft whiskey boom etc. There still has to be this sort of playboy-esque air of "sophisticated manliness" to the whole thing sometimes, and that gets a little tedious.

― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Friday, January 18, 2019 11:00 AM (thirty-seven minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I saw an ad for Bud Light where one guy in a bar was like, "no no, I don't want Bud Light; I want such-and-such craft beer!," pointing out what an effeminate nonconformist schmuck he was. Later I saw an ad for some obviously-corporate-but-trying-to-be-craft beer ("we use the finest hops from Old Man Wilson's privately curated reserve...")

... and it was made by Budweiser (and I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the exact same marketing dipshits worked on both ads).

Oh I meant more in the sense that some tend to assume that foreigners already know everything there is to know about oenology, as though all climes were equal or it were mandatory to read treatises on France's terroirs in elementary schools the whole world over. It's doubly ridiculous when you realize that very few French people know all that much about wine beyond a handful of vague appellations.

xps

as long as we're detouring through marketing of masculinity (although we have a thread for that) I had to figure out how the aforementioned White Claw is marketed

their instagram feed has pictures of waves, some healthy cooking recipes (?!) and whatever this is (man holding drink while his shadow boxes):
https://www.instagram.com/p/BgorlKTHs63/

I guess the market is "millenials"?

competing hierarchies of beer masculinity, all monetized

xpost, yeah although in france I feel like most people only know about their aoc wine and that is it (because also that is all the stores carry and they of course think their wine is the best).

but i mean we're all on record that marketing is bad tbf

Mad rhetorical skills, though. Gotta admire that.

That hilarious Rogue beer IT job posting that was circulated a while ago. http://i.imgur.com/cfGFm5j.png

good lord

I guess not having an HR dept means you can write want ads that strongly imply you should be male

can't wait to join the revolution by fixing printers in Newport

Is the revolution already underway?

oh barf

we are free thinking rebels!! now here are a bunch of arbitrary and subjective standards you must conform to and words you can't use

work your ass off for not enough money because... beer!

We do not budget or forecast. The balance sheets are MAYHEM.

Cue De Mysteriis Dom Sathanas.

i remember when i was young, 90s and maybe early 2000s, this being the west of scotland and me being in a mainly working class milieu, i almost never saw men drinking wine - other than my chilean father. then as the years passed i would see working class men drinking wine sometimes, but exclusively red wine. never white. seems like red wine - tannic, higher alcohol, dark fruits - codes more masculine than white wine - floral aromatics, minerality, stone fruits. very weird to me.

moving to vancouver there is a bit less of a stress on traditional masculinity in general, but i did have a funny incident when drinking in the park with some friends/acquaintances. mixed gender group, everyone university educated and liberal/leftist, mainly bougie backgrounds. the fact that i was drinking riesling was very amusing to everyone. i found that strange. it was a dry reisling with pronounced notes of petrol incidentally

we call riesling "sommelier gatorade". I take it to the beach.

The gendered red/white divide is especially odd to me. I've never seen it play out in Montreal (plenty of women I know prefer red and dudes white) but the French influence might have something to do with it.

there's also the idea of matching (or pairing, if you will) the right drink with the food you're eating, if you're eating food

but then we get back to the "well, men eat steak and not chicken so of course they're drinking red"

If you go out to eat regularly and never order the chicken you are a doofus, chicken is amazing.

chicken is so good

I've posted this before I think but this was really good about food and sexism.

https://www.dmagazine.com/publications/d-magazine/2018/july/eating-in-dallas-top-steakhouses-gave-me-a-bellyful-of-misogyny/

so are rieslings

dallas

Shockah.

Yeah, but it happens everywhere. I have it happen to me constantly no matter where I am.

lol yeah I eat as little red meat as possible these days, although as more of an ethical stance than a dietary preference necessarily so lots of chicken and seafood

then I revert to type occasionally and want a big ol' steak and a glass of whiskey and some hideous red wine

xpost Riesling is one of the most perfect grapes.

Chicken is wonderful especially if you marinate it all day

... in urine.