"oh you don't get me I'm the end of the union": lol brexit is how we're all gonna die

Feel like Cameron (and Brown?) used to do this a lot too. Blair didn't. (xxp)

She gets the lectern out a lot because it enables her to control the messaging. She can do pre-rehearsed statements, she's terrible with anything off-the-cuff.

OTM though she's terrible with anything on-th-cuff too.

bbc decision to let the football bump her from the news top slot was good and correct, the one thing they've got right in the current affairs realm since alastair campbell got greg dyke sacked imo

I just think understanding UK voting history and demographics is probably key

xp
she did a cracking one after pissing away her majority in election '17 "time to go to work" like as if nothing to see here folks, just another day at work.

Southampton vs. Derby County, FA Cup 3rd Round replay. Bit too much fucking perspective there.

I have a lot of thoughts about the outfits Theresa May chooses to wear and when she chooses to wear them. Like the one she chose to wear when she held hands with Trump - exact same one she wore to attend her count the night she lost her majority.

the viewers would have expected her to get booked for time wasting.

Just been sent this old Barry Gardiner leaflet and actually cannot stop laughing pic.twitter.com/fW9ETqX1oK

— Jack Blanchard (@Jack_Blanchard_) January 17, 2019

feel like aldos been a bit unfairly mischaracterised there

"the uk votes tory at the drop of a hat" seems fairly defensible as a statement

Yeah the same once that booted out Churchill to vote Attlee and who cherishes the NHS above all other institutions? But what would I know, right? I only live here.

LOL Baz Gaz.

he's a classic!

But what would I know, right? I only live here.

― gyac, Thursday, 17 January 2019 10:44 (three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

thats a bit of a turnaround from yr half-quote of aldo a few mins back!

I'm out.

were i building a strategic defence of corb's two A50 moves i'd begin by fashioning it round the fact that at that point (= first 6-7 months of her being PM) no one had yet grasped quite how irresponsibly reckless and useless she would turn out always to be. lock her into a timetable, pressure her by setting her (pre-referendum) eloquent remainer mode against her task, manouevre her into a limited space where splitting her party is the only route out of wrecking everything she'd hitherto said she stood for! yes, i can see how in a war-gaming scenario these made sense (tho i think the first, the dare, was an unguarded and unwargamed error (at a moment when everything all around was absurd chaos and skreeking).

in fact the pressuring and manoeuvring have done exactly this, albeit incredibly slowly and painfully. but of course ultimately their strategic effectiveness still depends on her not bringing the temple down with her power and her party. which we know know (or anyway suspect and fear) is indeed a bad strategic judgment call, bcz it fundamentally misunderstands her. it's good practice not to underrate yr opponent! but i'm not sure as of late 2016 that even her strong non-fans (mainly angry HS watchers at that stage) grasped the extent of her self-immolating self-isolating stubbornness. if the guiding assumption is that, in a pinch, the tory party will adapt and mutate to survive, that assumes malevolent self-awareness and self-preservation… but is this a solid assumption right now?

xp almost as if the context is different when talking to someone who doesn’t actually live in the UK?

Thinking of canvassing STV to get Barry G to present their Hogmanay Show next year.

yeah look i dont wanna fight on aldos behalf either

my cousin has left his city boy structural engineering consultant life to raise pigs in the philippines ive not asked him if its brexit related or if he knows something about pork futures i dont

not bringing the temple down with her power and her party

this is a bit unclear. i mean: not pulling temple party and power down around her

Blair puts the boot into Corbyn: If in a moment of national crisis the PM asks the leader of the opposition for talks you should go. #today

— Beth Rigby (@BethRigby) January 17, 2019

my cousin has left his city boy structural engineering consultant life to raise pigs in the philippines ive not asked him if its brexit related or if he knows something about pork futures i dont

Why not both? Starvation for some, plentiful pork products for others.

On balance it would probably be better for Corbyn to go, outline his No Deal red line to her face, and then immediately tell everyone about it.

I don't think it's inaccurate to say that the UK tends to vote Tory more often than not? Is there some nonsense about them being the most successful political party in the Western World - or am I confusing that with Rangers fans claiming Rangers is the most successful football club in the world? Somewhat appropriately.

I think I agree with MDC - the risk here is around who the public see as being reckless: may for countenancing no deal or corbyn for refusing to “grow up” and come to the table

I mean she obviously can’t be trusted and this megaphone diplomacy is fundamentally in bad faith but labour have to be careful. they can’t touch the shitty stick but need to be seen to be being collegiate to an extent

That’s a very different beast from “naturally Conservative”, though.

Probably not Brexit related, just as well as the stupid cunts voted Leave.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46900918

From a French perspective, at least, the UK comes off as resolutely, almost 'naturally' right-wing (Thatcher, Iraq, obsession with surveillance, unwillingness to let go of the monarchy, rampant privatisation, almost nonexistent social benefits, insular exceptionalism, seminal role played in the invention and rise of capitalism, etc.).

the electorate didn't vote for most of them things and in the free trade empire era most of the country didn't even have a vote.

absolutely absurd rejection of the fact that britain loves the tories itt

about as controversial an idea as saying the sun will set. voting for tories is what britain does.

To each their own defence mechanism, I guess. Same goes for American dems.

Eyes gotta swivel

Mr Duncan Smith told the Telegraph: “Barnier has not only been receptive to the protocol but has already offered us a free trade agreement. The problem is not that the EU won’t negotiate but that Theresa May hasn’t ever told Brussels exactly what she wants. I’ll go over and lead a re-negotiation if she wants. Owen and I will go and do it. Anything is surely preferable to Remainer civil servants treating the negotiation like a damage limitation exercise.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/01/16/gove-writes-obituary-brexiteers-insist-moment-arrive/

Can't see it any other way myself.

xp to Hierro

let's face it folks, we love the taste of boot

I mean if people want to just pretend Scotland and Wales don’t exist either lol

You do have some nice boots tbf.

xp

A large part of Corbyn's appeal is transparently the desire to call a do-over on the last 40 years (or at least register a stream of dissent - he wouldn't have the sparkle he does if he'd been first elected in 2015, his voting history is a crucial component).

As a companion piece to the ERG one, a decent look at how the EU has negotiated (including overreach which may play against their best interests)

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/brexit/2019/01/search-lost-brexit-how-uk-repeatedly-weakened-its-own-negotiating-position

I'm not any denial about too much tory scum in the UK and my definition of tory scum would encompass lots of Labour mps as well. But suggesting the electorate had a hand in Iraq, the Surveillance state gone very bad or 19th c laissez faire free trade is absurd bollox!

the electorate didn't vote for most of them things and in the free trade empire era most of the country didn't even have a vote

The electorate didn't vote for most of them, but they don't have piss their pants when you suggest trying to take them away.

Having said that, most polling suggests that a significant chunk of voters tend to hold both left and right-wing views simultaneously.

I wasn't suggesting that btw, just pointing out how the UK is perceived by (some) foreigners.

That being said, I thought public support for the Iraq intervention was fairly high back in 2003?

xp

Nah there was a very high level of oppositions to the Iraq war, Blair just ignored it. The only one of your list that's actually unpopular is rampant privatisation, which seemingly everyone other than politicians and policy wonks hates.

I was thinking of this: https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2015/06/03/remembering-iraq

And this: https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2017/06/12/Security-Trumps-Privacy

scotland and wales like a tory too.

"natural party of government" can be read in a few ways: as statement of historical/electoral fact; as leftist defeatism masquerading as pragmatism; as a note of postcolonial caution in the face of reformist optimism esp wrt how labour govts build and manage institutions; as an aspirational part of tory self-image/entitlement; as a reminder of the ultimate fluidity of the principles underlying the tory party; as a statement abt the structural injustices of uk politics; as a boast abt privilege & perceived legitimacy; as a reminder of how deeply embedded lots of conservative views are in the populace/of how tories use the appeal of nationalism and security to play this up; as a simplistic statement abt the soul of the country - ok i'm bored but I don't see any reason to think ppl are on the same page here

and re: calzino's point I think ppl often fail to consider how the democratic parts of the uk political system are used by the ruling class esp wrt generating collective responsibility and a sense of national narrative for their terrible decisions

imo pointing out a party's success is not in any way calling them the natural party of government. it's not even pessimistic. it is just historical fact.

i mean the fact the tories are still in power and looking relatively capable of winning another election given what's gone on in the last few years should be enough to prove the strength of their base, it's ludicrous.

xp I mean, I consider that every time someone says "clear mandate" about a 52-48 result, so I consider that a lot.

xp thankfully long-term demographic changes mean they will die out in the not too distant future

They are absolutely incapable of winning the next election, provided there's a united Labour party - ah.