"oh you don't get me I'm the end of the union": lol brexit is how we're all gonna die

More outlander naïveté: why did the Tories win the 2017 snap election?

did they now

Shocked about what?

Like, if you placed a bet yesterday, the odds weren't generous at Ladbrokes.. (prob)

less facetiously: because they were the party of brexit, and because they still hadn't entirely shed david cameron's veneer of centrist common sense

xxxxp

where Peace grew up is an odd bit of W Yorkshire. I've rewired loads of its council estates and they are practically middle class in comparison to places like Chickenley which is a only few miles away but a completely different world.

lab collapse in scotland 2015 onwards is another part of the reason, pom

pls the tories we’re fighting on a significantly beneficial electoral map post-2015 disaster

plus*

all these "real leadership" Sturgeon fans seem to conveniently forget her 2nd indy reffing tactics are what handed SNP seats to the Tories.

Would it have helped Labour if the SNP had kept those seats? As Labour weren’t looking like winning them and had ruled out working with the SNP.

hmm .. that alleged coalition of chaos that Cam warned us about!

Which Labour weren’t keen on during the campaign. At all.

May refusing to confirm that the Custom's Union is a red line at PMQs, maybe? i dunno, i'm too hungover to parse this booshit

lol apostrophe

'support' for any of these options is always contextual though - what's been ruled out, what's left on the table, what might be brought back to the table via some sweaty fanfic you read on Twitter last night.

More outlander naïveté: why did the Tories win the 2017 snap election?

― pomenitul, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 12:00 (nineteen minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

also, they didn't. nobody won the election. they got the most number of seats but had to form a coalition gov with the DUP

so: not promising that she won't get an A50 extension, not promising that Customs Union isn't an option

i get a vibe that she'll take any deal that she can call Brexit at this point, that may be what amounts to her strategy now

If there’s a GE, can we rely on Northern Irish Remain voters to come out in their droves to kick the DUP to fuck?

revoke article 50 and call it brexit imo xp

Yes, but what she'll call Brexit is dramatically narrower than almost everyone else bar the headbangers. A Brexit that doesn't allow you to put FUCK OFF HOME posters in every shop window and on every privately-owned train is not a Brexit worth mentioning to her, and that still seems to be v. much the case xp

I should've known better than to speak of 'winning' – we occasionally get hung parliaments in Canada too. Anyway, thanks, all, for the insight.

xps

(at least, she's acting that way - i guess because the one thing that could lose her the VONC is pissing off the fash)

I’ve got a question about the potential ideal scenario

say labour wins a VONC, a GE is called and they stand on a platform to respect the result, renegotiate with different red lines, and hold a ratification referendum of some sort.

what happens if they renegotiate a norway+/permanent CU/BINO - I can see how you can maybe square it away with the public (you voted to leave, we’re leaving, the tory approach led to intractable standstill, this is the only path forward short of catastrophic no deal etc etc)

but how will they square that away with the press ? the braying will be LOUD

If there’s a GE, can we rely on Northern Irish Remain voters to come out in their droves to kick the DUP to fuck?

all these "real leadership" Sturgeon fans seem to conveniently forget her 2nd indy reffing tactics are what handed SNP seats to the Tories.

if labour under corbyn achieve power the braying will be loud anyway. fuck the press

xxp How would Corbyn's Labour in power deal with the press is a very open question though - they were largely against him at the last election and he mostly shrugged them off.

Belfast North and Belfast South are both marginals where a nationalist vote could oust the sitting DUP MPs.

They got better the better he did - at least the broadcasters did.

The press are always banging on about Venezuela and how a Corbyn government would mean people starving while not giving near as much as a fuck about the actual government talking about adequate food. I agree; fuck them, pass Leveson 2 and laws about press ownership.

my broken-record judgment on the press (if this means the papers) is that i don't believe lab *can* square with them and feebly trying will do harm so don't try -- challenge and delegitimise them instead? i'm not an OJ stan but i'm with him going in on andrew neil and the badness of writing for the sun (even if yes hypocrite much): that battle has to be begun

anyway the game is pressure and pressure back

Yeah I mainly mean the print press. You don’t get Brexit without 30 years of Sun, Mail & Express headlines screaming about the EU and those fucking immigrants.

And I’m 100% more favourable towards OJ than I was two years ago and he was absolutely right to call out Andrew Neil.

i don't believe lab *can* square with them and feebly trying will do harm so don't try -- challenge and delegitimise them instead?

this 100%. AOC is a boss at this

it's all good, the left's got The Canary

jfc i've just depressed meself

During my book publicity I wrote for/appeared in a number of publications/outlets I wouldn’t normally work with.

At the end of the last GE it was delightful to see Corbyn nyah-ing the Mail’s 20-page Labour Doom Terror Special.

BTW wasn’t it *refreshing* to see Theresa May bang in about antisemitism at PMQs as if she gives a shit about British Jewry at any other time?

apologizing and triangulating and prevaricating and all the rest of it has gotten the left nothing. AOC mashed the narrative on marginal tax rates in 5 mins more than a generation of democrats had managed. Take the game to the opposition and stop acting like your the guardians of guilty secrets

Oh how quickly you forget Novara and Squawkbox. xpost

acknowledging matt dc's point that we don't know who's ending up reading what in the wilds of the internet, the path ahead for the legacy media in the uk is continued steady collapse of readership and revenue: no one's begun to turn that round

I think they are doing this already to some degree - that video about austerity was incredible and made the case against better in a few minutes than any number of speeches.

just keep broadcasting I Daniel Blake until the GBP decides that Ken Loach must be appeased

Corbyn: this Frankenstein bill is now officially dead!

Me(small voice): Frankenstein’s monster...

Oh how quickly you forget Novara and Squawkbox. xpost

― Bimlo Horsewagon became Wheelbarrow Horseflesh (aldo), Wednesday, 16 January 2019 13:10 (seven minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

eh, I know Novara/canary etc are really depressingly bad, I try to comfort myself with the fact that its early days? I think activist media can have great potential, and I look at things like DemocracyNow and the Intercept, which for all their imperfections do something important.

austerity is nothing to see. it's the nemesis of posties - low letterboxes - that is a burning injustice. Can't wait for Loach's movie about a saintly, heart of gold postie who gets a bad back from too many low letterboxes

Democracy Now feels like a very specific product of American earnestness and industriousness, Novara always seems like a punchy startup hoping to be bought out by venture capitalists.

well sarcasm aside it's not so much the crapness of individual left-ish content providers that matters, it's the steady drain of influence from the right wing print press that's heartening

I think they are doing this already to some degree - that video about austerity was incredible and made the case against better in a few minutes than any number of speeches.

― gyac,

Yes! thats a great example

SNP straight in there on the VONC by attacking Labour about their lack of coherent policy on Brexit.

Good to see Woke Soubz on form as well.

eh, I know Novara/canary etc are really depressingly bad

no idea who these are but they look inconsequential to me?

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