one out all out: a brexit from the modern world and every one of its problems please (we're all gonna die lol)

re: Lammy's "socialism in one country" quip. I thought we'd already established that there isn't really anything in the current Labour manifesto that is more radical than what is already there in much of North and Western Eurozone countries. Fucking daft talk man!

Yes, but once we're out from the shackles of Brussels we'll be able to pursue a much more radical agenda!

j/k

Current Labour manifesto, no. Wider Lexit fantasies yes, that's what he's arguing against there.

I don't even have a problem with the leadership bit per se, this is a government that is transparently afraid of the press and afraid of a handful of right-wing extremists (even more extreme right than them lol) and half of them clearly believe this the wrong thing to do.

In any case Lammy has talked about Brexit virtually non-stop for three years, including in places where people pay considerably more attention than they do to Parliamentary speeches. If that's not a constant drip-drip I don't know what is.

xp
then we became a socialist autarky with our international baking system dwarfing the banking one :p

if Lammy put as much energy into opposing gentrification on his own doorstep as he does brexit, and occasionally voted against using weapons of death on poor foreigns then I might have a modicum of respect for him. As it is I think he's totally overrated.

I feel like this will get Streetinged immediately knowing my luck lol, but Lammy absolutely did oppose what’s going on in Haringey and sided against the councillors who were trying to make out the opposition was a Momentum plot.

He didn't much choice at that point though did he? Previously I've seen him stanning for affordable housing bollox.

Lammy's always been overrated.

Yeah possibly! He’s such a hate figure for the fash though that I have difficulty holding his melty opinions against him too much.

Yeah Lammy and Kober definitely did not see eye to eye on the demolition of Haringey social housing. But if you feel Brexit is going to be disastrous for your constituents you have a duty to oppose it and in doing so you probably have bigger things to worry about than annoying a few Twitter leftists.

Is "socialism in one country" the Lexit fantasy then? That group has just as much chance of getting that as People's Vote have of a 2nd ref.

I don't think Lammy just blinked into existence after the brexit ref though did he? I'm sure he fought hard for lots of affordable housing quotas during various regeneration projects, but for some of his constituents it doesn't get much more disastrous than getting turfed out of your council home that you were happily living in.

That is happening all over London including in Diane Abbott's constituency and driven in large part by council funding shortages imposed by central government.

I dunno, at this stage this is all just tiresome, Lammy's not Diane Abbott but he's not Stella Creasy or Chuka Umunna either and I don't doubt his sincerity. There's a lot of shit about to hit the fan and actual fascists in the streets so excuse me if I don't waste a lot of energy going 'lol FPBE melt' or whatever, focus on the real enemy here.

'This is going to happen anyway' remains a terrible reason for not opposing something and has been used against the left more times than I care to think of.

yeah but you are making the same excuse for gentrification in your opening sentence. But I'm not saying throw him under a train, just saying he's just another politician basically.. nothing to see.

obv London Gentrification is pretty much a cross party continuity project that still would be happening without dramatic local authority cuts. And these zombie blairite/tory councils are the ones that need throwing under a train. But I think it is fair to say they didn't have to put up with much resistance pre-Corbyn/McD.

I'm not making an excuse but this stuff is fundamentally driven by councils rather than MPs, admittedly sometimes with their full support. I disagree with Lammy on a lot of things but he's right on Brexit and I don't think he's doing it for careerist reasons, which is more than I can say for some other London Labour MPs.

think we have to return to: "council funding shortages imposed by central government"

councils are given so little money their chops or ideology are not the main issue

Theresa May’s political epitaph:

‘All of old. Nothing else ever. Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.’

Samuel Beckett, Worstward Ho

— Ian Pace #FBPE #PeoplesVote #JC4P45 (@ianpacemain) January 11, 2019

*eyeroll emoji*

has theresa may ever shown any indication of learning anything from her many failures?

Christ, what a planet.

that quote now always just reminds me of k-punk getting cross about its overuse :(

Fisher otmfm

Fear of a BPE Prannet

that's how it is on this bitch of an earth

"I'll tell you one thing you can't do: you can't put your shoes on, then your socks on."

Flavor Flav

Stop talking this country down, Flav.

Welcome to the error dome.

Trouble without a pause.

Backstop In The Hour Of Chaos

there, I killed it

"Go back to your constituencies, put your socks on over your shoes, and prepare for government!"
— david steel in the hour of chaos

wearing socks over shoes appears to be an effective and inexpensive method to reduce the likelihood of slipping on icy footpaths

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2010/mar/09/improbable-research-icy-socks-over-shoes

Stack Bop

my MP wants to know what I think abt brexit, and this last question is the stinker:

What should be the Labour Party's priority if parliament can't agree a deal? *
1. Campaign for People's Vote
2. Continue to push for a general election until the day the UK leaves the EU
3. Accept the referendum result, but press for a better deal

thoughts anyone?

It Takes A Margin Of 1.26 Million To Take Us Back (to the dark ages)

4. Magic
5. Time Machine
6.???????

Profit

anyone who thinks the eu is gonna endlessly negotiate in the hope that there somehow will be a 'better deal' which will magically please both parties despite already saying that they're not gonna negotiate further needs to pull their fucking head our of their arse

all three of those things are quite likely to fail, it's a question of priorities

i have lost the will to understand anything anywhere any more so this may be wrong but doesn't "refusal to negotiation further" mean "we are not fkn offering up a different and more fun version of the withdrawal agreement based on the red lines staying as they are thank you please" -- rather than "the EU's trade agreements with its neighbours will never change from now till the stars fall"

the WA takes things to the next phase, but this phase is in fact both provisional and transitional (and part of the beef is that the WA is deemed *not* to limit or pre-empt what comes next, except as the agreed point of departure)

Xp I feel like the act of polling priorities is as much about finding sticks to beat political enemies with as it is searching for a genuine state of the nation solution

meanwhile the north magnetic pole has crossed the international date line heading for siberia and no one knows why :(

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-00007-1

this probably belongs elsewhere but WHO KNOOOOOWS

Stop free movement of the magnetic polls imo

When the EU says they are refusing to negotiate its basically to say we are not going where Tory Brexiteers want us to so don't even try.

Should Labour come to power they will not have as many red lines on immigration as May so the agreement could take a different shape. Its not going to be fun at any point, but Brexit may take a different road. I don't care to refresh my understanding of this stuff pre-xmas right now.

https://www.businessinsider.com/hedge-fund-titan-crispin-odey-bets-on-pound-says-brexit-wont-happen-2019-1?r=UK&IR=T

I wouldn't put too much stock in this but it does reflect a sense of growing resignation on the Brexit side of the fence.

I've said this before but the EU won't accept a hard border in Ireland, therefore they won't accept No Deal.

Oh yeah you said that earlier this week. If that is so why hasn't May used that to get more concessions out of the EU?

what would they be?

Whatever might be more palatable so that at least more of the Tories back her.

Presumably if the EU, unable to accept no deal, tried unilaterally extending Article 50, there’d be a bit of a blow-up over sovereignty

xxp
a) a hard border in Ireland that they won't accept
b) £49b cash that we said we'd give them
c) ?????
d) €€€€€€