Democratic (Party) Direction

luv2choose between two septuagenerian gropers, good luck usa

Exactly

I dont like it but hard to see joe not running

You don't think his single-digit successes in his first two runs will dissuade him? I do.

bg, i don't know. No geezers, esp assholes like Biden. Turn the fucking page.

For real despair, look at how Sen. Rodham Clinton is pandering to libs and righties on alternate days. "Congress run like a plantation," "I'd bomb Iran," etc.

Please God, take Hilary quietly so she won't fuck up the party with a presidential campaign. WORST POSSIBLE CANDIDATE EVER.

― elmo, patron saint of nausea (allocryptic), Thursday, January 19, 2006 12:54 PM (twelve years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The Berniebros must have a time machine to be planting this seed all the way back in 2006.

Dude

morbs otm

Biden's only appeal is that he seems like a guy who might stand up well against Trump on a debate stage. But tbqh Hillary stood up against him better than most of the GOP guys who he demolished in the primary, and that wasn't enough.

Biden’s only appeal is that he symbolizes a return to the Obama era. Retreating to the past can be a winning move for conservatives, not so much for he democratic primary of 2020

biden's only appeal is that people confuse the actual him with the onion version of him

Biden's only appeal is teeth.

I still have no favorite candidate for 2020. I'm not keen on Bernie running again either. But that's why you have a primary rather than anointing someone in advance.

gazzara and man alive both otm. i was just saying that to the missus last night, that the only good thing about Biden being the nominee would be that I think he's the only one who would be willing to absolutely clown Trump. and while it's nowhere near the top of the list in terms of priorities for ending our current nightmare, I have to admit part of me really wants to see that happen.

in seriousness, I just have a bad feeling that a lot of other potential candidates are going to try and engage Trump in good faith, and maybe that will still work out anyway and they'll still win, but it could also backfire, plus I'm just really fucking sick of seeing it. I so desperately want someone to get up on a debate stage with him, listen to his gibberish and then just say "How the fuck do I even respond to that idiocy? This motherfucker doesn't know what he's talking about."

Booker would look like a giant idiot against Trump.

Agreed

not sure he needs trump's help for that tbf

depending on his opponent though, I could certainly see Trump just refusing to do any debates. (and I know I'm placing outsized importance on them).

Maybe someone should finally call trump on his idea to “do IQ tests”, on live tv

what's marilyn vos savant up to

bg, i don't know. No geezers, esp assholes like Biden. Turn the fucking page.

― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, July 25, 2018 10:29 AM (fifty minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

otm

yeah the party that is currently finding its new icon in AOC is definitely gonna go for an extremely old white dude

thread really fucking delivers, guys

so who are they gonna go for? aoc is indeed extremely good but the dem benches are not exactly packed deep with committed socialists whose hands are clean of the dem's past mistakes, and even if the midterms see more of their number join the party they're gonna have to move pretty fast to make it to 2020 candidacy

It’s Gillibrand’s if she wants it and she’s made it pretty clear she does.

How about we wait to see what happens, as it's about 17 months to the first caucus and we have NO idea where this country is going to be then (including the possibility that Klaatu's race will exterminate us for stupidity)?

enh where's the fun in that

NYT has a long profile of Gillibrand today and, hmmmmmmm, I don't know

there's a pretty wide range between "a committed socialist wins the nomination" and "Joe Biden" fwiw

also, hurry the fuck up klaatu

There was a poll of New Hampshire where the top 3 was Warren, Biden, Sanders. Warren pretty handily in front.

yeah, regular ppl aren't even thinking about the midterms yet for Chrissake

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwSxBiS0rHY

Bernie Sanders introduces bill to end money bail https://t.co/xYGLWi0EmB by @aidachavez

— Luke Savage (@LukewSavage) July 25, 2018

How the @Ocasio2018 cohort of leftists, including @KanielaIng, are transforming our understanding of the left. pic.twitter.com/B2mxvQBKhk

— corey robin (@CoreyRobin) July 25, 2018

what i love about this is that it follows closely on bernie's apparently recent first encounter with the fact of the cash bail system, which itself led to a lotta yelling about how it was wild he'd never heard of it and proof he's just another privileged old white man--his team learns and moves forward.

xp

the common thread robin's pulling out here is that these people were organizers before they were politicians: learning to be ever better at weaving your personal biography into your work for your hobbyhorse issues is a core practice of organizing work. in a class i took marshall ganz (UFW organizer & legendary movement scholar who Obama himself surely studied) broke down obama's 2004 dnc speech schematically, how he narratively moved from his personal story to the story of american progressive forces to the story of the country as a whole and wove them into a single powerful thing.

yeah everything I've seen from Ing suggests he is a whiz at that

really appreciating your perspective here HOOS.

HOOSpective

ditto

this is the video CR references, presumably

A Hawaii for the many is possible, but we have to take it, together.

On August 11, this movement can make history, but I need your help.

Please Retweet this video, Donate, and sign up to knock on doors, send texts + https://t.co/dELbZgUFNP#Ing2018 pic.twitter.com/aGXwSj4m5f

— Kaniela Ing (@KanielaIng) July 25, 2018

for any interested folks here are a couple (prolly hueg sorry) graphics i made coming out of that ganz course that speak to that movement between narrative structures:

https://i.imgur.com/EGH1Ecc.png

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15027629_10102943919643485_6109731694427890042_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=5e454c297835bfe754d310f4d82c994b&oe=5BD501A2

I know one of the other candidates for that district. Beth Fukumoto who was the one that switched parties from Republican to Dem last year after her party left her hanging after she spoke out against Trump.

AOC and Ing's videos had the same filmmakers. I could be wrong since I have lived in very few places in the US (oddly enough, most recently AOC's district and Oahu) and it seems like this type of narrative is easier in these locations which have a more vibrant identity, still retains a sense of community. Like, when I think of places out in 'coal miner' america, I think of families sitting in their homes miles apart or separated by privacy fences from their nearest neighbor. Privacy, and minding your own business, completely rules over community. I could be wrong.

you forget church!

I don't even want to get into that shitshow. My brother (in Virginia) became a late in life Christian. Whenever he used to talk about it waiting for me to say something mean, I would just say "well, people need to feel a sense of community somehow. Good for you if you found friends." hee.

There's a sheer geographic issue that goes beyond "vibrant identity" (which I don't really think explains AOC's victory), and that's density. It's easier to organize and canvass when people live close together.

Yeah, I didn't do a good job of implying that in both people have to live on top of each other and actually interact on a daily basis.

also think "vibrant" is really tricky --- it's a real thing but also in some hands it codes as exotic/other, one of these weird "white people don't have a color" kind of tropes. not saying that's where you're at obviously!

Yeah I wasn't trying to "call out" Yerac, but there is a media myth that AOC won because the majority of her district is people of color, and a competing myth that she won because white liberal gentrifiers, and actually both are partly true and even both together don't fully explain it and don't give her and the people organizing for enough credit for their ingenuity and hard work.

Oh it's fine. I didn't take very much care in my word choice because you know, it's a messageboard and most of this thread sucks. Please, someone talk more about Hillary.

I don't know what it is. AOC ran a really good campaign, is utterly charismatic and inspiring, her posters were amazing and she speaks to issues that are important. I showed her and Kaniela's video to some chileans last night and they were surprised that they were considered far left. I live (at least part time) in her district (the Queens part) and one of my good friends lives in the Bronx part. Selzer knows more about the demographics. Where I live at least, it's pretty european white, although there is one street where all the egyptian, middle eastern restaurants, hookah lounges are. There is a gay community that has been growing too. To buy a one bedroom apt is pretty much in the >500k range right now. I really have no clue how much people (white or non-white) make in these neighborhoods. But when I lived in Oahu, I was actually stunned how low the wages were when food and housing were on par with NYC prices. I would constantly have this discussion with Hawaiians that I worked with. Some lived in subsidized housing but most had to rely on their families owning property already. It felt completely unsustainable for most native people to live there.

Maybe the real divide is whether a place has people who walk their dogs outside multiple times a day or whether they just let them outside in the backyard.