No Irish, No Yanks, No Clogs - FIFA World Cup 2018

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These England criticisms are getting ever more desperate and ridiculous.

shaqiri tip (nashwan), Sunday, 8 July 2018 14:11 (five years ago) link

who last won a tournament without criticisms of their play

brazil? wasnt germany, spain, portugal.

repartee is deft (darraghmac), Sunday, 8 July 2018 14:30 (five years ago) link

oh I definitely criticised that Brazil team

Number None, Sunday, 8 July 2018 14:31 (five years ago) link

Italy 06 got to the semis without a real challenge, although you could say they laboured with luck against Australia. Then they put in their best performance against Germany and were solid enough in the final. Liked that team a lot though.

shaqiri tip (nashwan), Sunday, 8 July 2018 14:41 (five years ago) link

yesterday it occurred to me that fifa '19 is going to need to incorporate all the fortnite celebrations if it wants to retain even a veneer of verisimilitude - at which point fortnite could sue fifa for copyright infringement? wheels within wheels

illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 8 July 2018 14:53 (five years ago) link

sons update: i pulled them up on declaring maguire "dead" and they responded that they had been talking about his haircut

illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 8 July 2018 14:56 (five years ago) link

Croatian blood pudding usually has rice in it. That’s not necessarily bad but it’s an approach that hasn’t proved effective at this wc.

Tim, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:03 (five years ago) link

http://time.com/5332548/uk-soccer-its-coming-home/

After its 2-0 victory over Sweden on Saturday, the U.K. is advancing to the World Cup semifinals for the first time since 1990.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:10 (five years ago) link

it's the UK's only remaining team in the competition, maybe that's what they meant? (probably not) :-)

StanM, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:16 (five years ago) link

I would like to apologize for offering any thoughts on the way a football team plays on the world cup thread and will restrict myself to posting slurs on Neymar's masculinity and fanfic about Harry Maguire from here on in.

he's one of our pwn (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:19 (five years ago) link

I'd absolutely forgotten about Baddiel hilariously blackfacing up on that dross tv show. Fuck knows how got away with that, it shows the so called rise of the 90's PC Brigade is a complete fallacy.

calzino, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:21 (five years ago) link

After its 2-0 victory over Sweden on Saturday, the U.K. is advancing to the World Cup semifinals for the first time since 1990.

LOL Americans.

Alan Alba (Tom D.), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:21 (five years ago) link

isn't part of the fun of modern World Cup that each team is flawed so ~endless opportunities~ for surprise?

fuck the NRA (Neanderthal), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:24 (five years ago) link

Germany 2014 were largely fantastic throughout, no one has looked that good this time round, let alone as good as Spain 2010.

Matt DC, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:25 (five years ago) link

If we were really doing the blood sausage World Cup then Spain every time.

Matt DC, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:26 (five years ago) link

BLACK PUDDING'S COMING HOME >:(

mark s, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:32 (five years ago) link

will be interesting to see what happens if england concede earlyish, have yet to be behind in a game that counts. also have scored in every game that counts too i suppose.

Roberto Spiralli, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:42 (five years ago) link

(xp) Yes. Also if Croatia can defend set pieces, one of those footballing basics that seems to have fallen by the wayside in this WC, along with crossing a ball.

Alan Alba (Tom D.), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:50 (five years ago) link

with this utter failure of self examination after a major defeat, you might wonder if the colombians didn't just lose the us presidential election #politics #satire #topical

Roberto Spiralli, Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:53 (five years ago) link

probable clash between the start of the final and the men's singles final at Wimbledon is gonna be delish for fans of BBC politics

he's one of our pwn (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:56 (five years ago) link

colombian remoaners taking it badly

I'd Rather Kecak (NickB), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:57 (five years ago) link

Labour moderates already berating Corbyn for failing to demand a rematch

he's one of our pwn (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 8 July 2018 15:58 (five years ago) link

Harry Kane has all the goals, but Raheem Sterling has been England's best attacking player in the World Cup. He plays a vital role progressing the ball so Eng can get all those corners and FKs.

He's also NOT a bad finisher, just a bit unlucky in the WC so far. pic.twitter.com/CFBwjDdeSn

— Ted Knutson (@mixedknuts) July 8, 2018

Hah.

Matt DC, Sunday, 8 July 2018 17:50 (five years ago) link

https://youtu.be/kcHslKK0VMQ

This is very good as well.

Matt DC, Sunday, 8 July 2018 17:59 (five years ago) link

Can't believe the best line from that Time article wasn't c&p'd itt already

"England’s underdog team is set to face Croatia on Wednesday, July 11"

I want to change my display name (dan m), Sunday, 8 July 2018 18:34 (five years ago) link

Germany 2014 were largely fantastic throughout, no one has looked that good this time round, let alone as good as Spain 2010.

ah yes, Spain, losing their first match, and narrowly winning all of their knock out matches 1-0. Paraguay missed a penalty in the 1/8's against them. etc.

the point is.. hardly at any World Cup a team is truly great, that's what makes it so much fun. Like this year, to me it seems all 4 are perfectly possible to win it. France, decent overall, Belgium, great counter attacks, Croatia, bit like France + Modric, England, set pieces. :P

Ludo, Sunday, 8 July 2018 19:07 (five years ago) link

not just that, im fine with the final 4 having seen what i have of the rest

repartee is deft (darraghmac), Sunday, 8 July 2018 19:09 (five years ago) link

Croatia, bit like France + Modric

threadban request

imago, Sunday, 8 July 2018 19:33 (five years ago) link

Hot take - this Croatia team is very good and people are mad underrating them in this thread. If they play like they did against Argentina then England are in trouble.

Matt DC, Sunday, 8 July 2018 19:37 (five years ago) link

argentina were a ridiculous rabble tbf

imago, Sunday, 8 July 2018 19:51 (five years ago) link

peak croatia take any england apart

weve seen that once against rabble

theyve been flat since, and absolutely through the wringer twice

repartee is deft (darraghmac), Sunday, 8 July 2018 19:58 (five years ago) link

That Paulinho transfer is absolutely insane. Did he basically take a year-long loan at Barca so he could play himself back into contention for the World Cup?

Matt DC, Sunday, 8 July 2018 20:11 (five years ago) link

well i mean fraud has been used in discussions around him previously so

repartee is deft (darraghmac), Sunday, 8 July 2018 20:16 (five years ago) link

croatia: argentina :: poland : colombia

||||||||, Sunday, 8 July 2018 20:26 (five years ago) link

croatia have the two best midfielders in either squad and england are better in every other position idk

imago, Sunday, 8 July 2018 20:37 (five years ago) link

dgmr it'll be much tougher than sweden whom i knew england would beat. this one could go either way

imago, Sunday, 8 July 2018 20:39 (five years ago) link

I know I'm going to get accused of jinxing here but I'd be putting money on England winning this game - if I didn't already have money coming in from the work's sweepstake.

Alan Alba (Tom D.), Sunday, 8 July 2018 20:40 (five years ago) link

i too can see no possible way for england to fail in this upcoming match

repartee is deft (darraghmac), Sunday, 8 July 2018 21:42 (five years ago) link

England will win the cup guys

Young team, excellent striker in kane, being top scorer, incredibly consistent, and an inventive system, pretty much the best team in decades

F# A# (∞), Sunday, 8 July 2018 21:56 (five years ago) link

tbh I think they'll get into double figures both games

Neuer write off the germans (Bananaman Begins), Sunday, 8 July 2018 22:05 (five years ago) link

Otmfm

Hat trick by kane after which he’ll be knighted

F# A# (∞), Sunday, 8 July 2018 22:08 (five years ago) link

Croatia = Dissipated and knacked, video reach stereo bog

(help me out here, Fizzles)

Alan Alba (Tom D.), Sunday, 8 July 2018 22:17 (five years ago) link

love this:

Here I am in 1996 writing earnestly in my diary about Gareth Southgate’s missed penalty.

👌🏻👌🏻 match analysis. #ENGSWE pic.twitter.com/Dp8MyMGZQm

— catherine barter (@okayjane) July 7, 2018

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, 8 July 2018 22:34 (five years ago) link

gutted it wasnt kane

*realises kane would have been....3 in euro 96.......ffs

repartee is deft (darraghmac), Sunday, 8 July 2018 22:55 (five years ago) link

lol

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 9 July 2018 00:40 (five years ago) link

France all the way.... Déschamps over Southgate; love them both

Et Dieu crea l' (Michael White), Monday, 9 July 2018 00:45 (five years ago) link

booooo

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 9 July 2018 01:14 (five years ago) link

<3

Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 9 July 2018 01:14 (five years ago) link

Don't know if this has been posted upthread somewhere but quite interesting article from the WSJ. You can't imagine Big Sam doing anything like this.

SAMARA, Russia—It was the night before the Super Bowl, and sitting courtside at the New Orleans Pelicans vs. Minnesota Timberwolves game was a man who had traveled all the way from England with his mind intensely focused on another global sports event: the World Cup.

There has never been anyone more interested in a Pelicans vs. Timberwolves matchup than England manager Gareth Southgate.

Southgate bombarded his companions with detailed inquiries about strategy, arena operations and even Crunch, the wolf mascot. Chris Wright, the chief executive of the local MLS team Minnesota United, was stunned by his curiosity about this sport that’s about as British as sauerkraut.

“Here’s this English guy, the England team manager, trying to figure out Basket ball 101,” Wright said.

But these are strange days for England. They have emerged as a serious contender at the World Cup. They lucked into the weaker half of the knockout bracket. They play Colombia on Tuesday for a spot in the quarterfinals. And they can attribute some of their unlikely success in soccer to basketball.

Wright was delighted when the Football Association contacted him before Southgate’s visit to the Super Bowl in Minnesota. He is English himself, which is why he wasn’t expecting this request from the manager: “Is there any way we can go to the Wolves game?”

There was a reason that he was so eager for this outing, and it wasn’t Crunch. On the ride to the arena, Southgate told colleagues that he was especially curious about how NBA teams created space around the basket. He thought there might be something he could steal.

Was there any way he could apply the principles of NBA plays—the pick-and-rolls, the off-ball screens, the constant movement—to the English national soccer team?

There are precious few moments in every soccer match when a manager can actually choreograph the action by designing a play. They’re called set pieces, and for many years, they were better known in England as a bloody disaster.

All of which makes England’s set pieces at this World Cup nothing short of a national miracle.

Their six goals on set plays were the most of any country in the group stage. But there’s a better comparison than England vs. the world: England vs. England. They have scored four goals on corners and free kicks so far. They scored four goals on corners and free kicks in the previous three World Cups combined.

“On set plays, we’re a real threat,” Southgate said. “We’ve identified that as a key area in tournaments and a key area we felt we could improve on.”

England’s ineptitude on set plays before Southgate’s hiring in 2016 was a bigger national drama than Brexit.

At the time, England star Harry Kane took their corners and free kicks, one of the many questionable tactical decisions that eventually cost Roy Hodgson his job. That paved the way for the unproven Southgate, a retired player whose prior managing experience included a stint with the country’s youth team and three seasons with a middling English Premier League club that was relegated under his watch. Southgate was an improbable choice, and he was given the job only after Sam Allardyce was fired in disgrace.

Southgate now looks like the manager who might be able to solve England’s problem of face-planting in spectacular fashion at the worst possible time. His inventive schemes have benefited one player in particular: Harry Kane. In England’s opening World Cup win against Tunisia, Kane slammed home a header on a corner kick in the 91st minute to avoid an embarrassing draw. It was his second goal of that match: Kane had already scored on another corner kick.

But the clearest example of how England implements basketball strategies on their set plays was a corner kick during their 6-1 blowout of Panama in the group stage.

It started with Kieran Trippier’s bending corner. Once the ball was in the air, two English players cleared out the center of the box, almost like they were 3-point shooters flaring away from the basket. Meanwhile, at the top of the box, Ashley Young threw his body into the defender guarding John Stones long enough for Stones to get free in the middle of the box and head the cross for a goal.

It was a primitive basketball play: the back-screen. And it worked to perfection.

It’s not like Gareth Southgate invented the pick play in soccer. But even he said, through an England spokesman, that he was influenced by what he saw watching basketball. The people who sat next to him that night were not surprised.

“In areas where he was specifically interested,” Wright said, “he wanted to go deep.”

Southgate had already proven by this point that he was not afraid to seek out ideas in unorthodox places. He entrusted his assistant, Allan Russell, with England’s set pieces, for example, even though the last teams that Russell had coached were the Carolina RailHawks and Orange County Blues, minor-league clubs in the soccer hinterlands otherwise known as the United States.

Southgate is not the first soccer manager to study basketball for inspiration.

Manchester City manager Pep Guardiola, who happens to be the coach of the English Premier League champion and the most dominant team in global soccer at the moment, has long been intrigued by the NBA. He attended a Finals game in 2016 wearing a LeBron James uniform, and he has utterly befuddled English reporters by citing the Golden State Warriors in his press conferences.

(This being England, of course, Southgate watched not the Cavs or Warriors but the Timberwolves and Pelicans. Neither team has ever won an NBA championship.)

There’s an obvious similarity between a corner kick in soccer and the pick-and-roll in basketball. The whole point is to create enough vertical air space for a header or dunk. But what basketball plays and soccer set pieces really have in common—the reason that Guardiola paid careful attention to the NBA—is they are both an opportunity to seize a small advantage, said Philadelphia 76ers vice president Daniel Medina, who worked under Guardiola at FC Barcelona.

“He used to look at not only basketball, but other sports like handball and indoor football,” Medina said. “Similar collective ideas with different constraints can lead to different solutions.”

Which is why Southgate was so inquisitive at the Pelicans vs. Timberwolves game.

“He was the one asking questions all night,” said Ben Grossman, a Minnesota United minority owner.

“Like I’m Tom Thibodeau,” Wright said.

Southgate had so many questions about how everything from how offenses create space to how defenses protect the basket that he stayed long after the game was over. Grossman realized when they finally left that Southgate was not at the NBA game simply to have a good time. He was there to work.

“I know this is going to sound a little silly, but I actually left that night expecting England to do well in the World Cup;” he said. “You could just tell the way he went about his business that he was going to leave no stone unturned.”

groovypanda, Monday, 9 July 2018 07:26 (five years ago) link


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