Democratic (Party) Direction

The push for health care began with Harry Truman, tbrr.

My friend with diabetes now has health care when he didn't before 2010. He'd punch you for saying that.

But, yes, I appreciate your proposing universal health care paid for by the federal guvmint, a goal of everyone on ILX.

My friend with diabetes now has health care when he didn't before 2010. He'd punch you for saying that.

Eh, I don't punch people that often these days. But I think about it a lot.

yo Bruneau my man Darrell Hammond didn't join SNL until 1995. 1992 steez Clinton was done by Phil Hartman.

I appreciate your proposing universal health care paid for by the federal guvmint, a goal of everyone on ILX.

― morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, February 15, 2018 3:11 AM (twelve hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

he's running

only if you'll be my consigliere.

<3

Washington's Senate is on fire. In past month, it has passed automatic & same-day voting registration, a ban on conversion therapy, stronger protections for trans students, stronger financial disclosure rules—and today death penalty abolition. https://t.co/scgDLWp55j

— Taniel (@Taniel) February 15, 2018

makes me wonder - is there a state route towards dealing with firearms somehow? i mean i know dealers just truck 'em in from other states

A state government could slow down the easy access to guns through new legal requirements, but this would be a minimally preventive measure. Truly meaningful restrictions would be adjudicated away in the federal courts due to the current case law regarding the second amendment.

The best solution would require banning weapons and accessories that permit the greatest lethality, followed by a buyback period where such items could be safely disposed of. No state government could effectively impose such a solution in isolation from the rest of the nation.

Still, at this point almost anything is worth trying and state governments are the only political venue where any measures at all are likely to pass. Lately, state legislatures have been going down the path of easier access and fewer restrictions far more often than not. The NRA fear and hatred machine is a marvel to watch in action.

so what did we expect the Dems to manage re DACA? cuz we got nothin'.

They managed to force Trump to boldly contradict his public promise that he'd sign any bill they put on his desk and that he would 'take the heat' for it. This revelation will certainly result in Trump's base realizing he is erratic, impulsive and cannot be trusted to keep his word!

https://splinternews.com/what-democrats-lost-by-caving-on-immigration-yet-again-1823069718

makes me wonder - is there a state route towards dealing with firearms somehow? i mean i know dealers just truck 'em in from other states

― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Friday, 16 February 2018 08:57 (ten hours ago) Permalink

Building a wall, iirc

so what did we expect the Dems to manage re DACA? cuz we got nothin'.

― ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), 16. februar 2018 19:23 (four hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

A longer shutdown. There really was no way that they could force Trump to extend DACA protections, but they showed their lack of spine/interest on the issue. And I'd think a lot of the bad polling recently has to do with this.

Nothing is exactly what should have been expected, but apparently lots of people paid no attention in math or government class

& just because a lot of lefty sorts are into loud performative shit that accomplishes nothing doesn’t mean shutdowns are cool ways for the party out of power to make a point

I hate to say this, but in all honesty I lean toward Morbs' side in this. They seemed really concerned with not seeming too concerned about immigrants, when as a matter of fact it's an issue where it's possible to at least think up workable compromises. The house is blocking everything, but the house won't stay GOP forever.

when as a matter of fact it's an issue where it's possible to at least think up workable compromises

It is true that it is possible to think up stuff

so what did we expect the Dems to manage re DACA? cuz we got nothin'.

― ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Friday, 16 February 2018 18:23 (five hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Be fair

They're putting at least some children a safe distance from American gunmen

x-post: The important word in that sentence was 'workable'. There was a bi-partisan agreement that passed the senate and would have passed the house if it'd been put forth there as well, but it died because of the Hastert rule.

So it was workable because the house is controlled by... oh right, not the Democrats. So not actually workable at all, but they gave it a shot anyway. I’m sure a prolonged shutdown would have moved Paul Ryan to the left though.

The Dems looked poised to take over the house in 2018, so pushing a senate compromise blocked by the house would have been a step forward. Instead it quite honestly seems as if they've taken a step back, and the US is further from reform than it was before the talks started.

Huh?

Yeah no clue how to parse that

DACA was and is a highly motivating issue among young voters seeking social justice, so the 'opticals' of the budget & immigration reform compromise have probably sapped the enthusiasm of those voters, which might have been amped up by a bloody fistfight between Democrats and Republicans over the issue.

The problem is that the longed-for fistfight would have resulted in a deadlock that would have lasted right until the Democrats capitulated. The shutdown would have been blamed on the Democrats and the capitulation would not have felt much better to the young voters for having come a few days or a week later than it did. One could quibble and say that the Democrats should have held out over the weekend, but that entirely symbolic option would have wasted a huge amount of time and money for no tangible gains.

Once more, the Democrats' greatest weakness was messaging, imo. The actual compromise that was made was a small net gain for socially progressive goals aside from DACA, but the message was not sufficiently strong and unified to project a strong, unified direction for the party.

Nobody wants to get out in front yet. First mover disadvantage etc

That’s why I don’t think there’s much straightforward messaging, if that wasn’t clear.

In front of what?

Nobody is prepared to try and position themselves as the putative leader of the Democratic party, an utterly thankless and mostly impossible job unless you actually win the Presidency, at which point it remains mostly impossible but at least Paul Krugman might notice you. And without a leader or a hierarchy there's no place for coherent, consistent messages and strategies to come from. Each candidate has their own priorities and ways of trying to achieve them.

I thought this was a fair rundown on the issue, although there's not nearly enough gnashing of teeth and angsty spittle for some of us, I'm sure: http://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2018/02/senate-democrats-immigration

Is it time to trot out the old Will Rogers joke about the Democrats, yet?

i agree that the party not in the presidency should have a "leader". "but we're not europe, that's not how it works here" - well the way it "works" appears to fuckin suck. maybe the way to do it is to have the primaries.. like.. 2-3 years before the election. with the option somehow to have another primary closer to the election if there's support for that. this way you have a real government in waiting. and presidential elections wouldn't have to take like 18 months because the primaries would have already happened, and everyone would be pretty familiar with the candidates already.

Okay.....

Our Revolution is backing Dennis Kucinich over the Elizabeth Warren-backed former director of the CFPB Richard Cordray. https://t.co/SYff0LW0GN

— Zachary #FBPE (@zatchry) February 20, 2018

not that surprising considering the commitments DK made recently on ending oil and gas drilling in OH

I'd love to know whether globetrotting Elizabeth Kucinich is a foreign agent

earnestly can't tell if that's satire

Yeah I don’t know either. But I thought this was interesting in light of his more recent weird Trump supporting/Fox regular phase.

https://www.clevescene.com/cleveland/the-king-of-spin/Content?oid=1503534

political opportunists can be useful

a piano dropped from a great height at the right moment can be useful

I don't know that it's a good or correct call, I just assume the statements he released recently (incl pushing for a statewide ban on AR-15s) are a direct result of his going after this endorsement. as to whether or not he's really markedly worse than Warren's guy, other folks can attest

he is demonstrably bad at getting people to vote for him

Yeah, ol' Dennis didn't even make it through January in the 2008 primaries, then didn't endorse Obama until 2 months after he won the nomination.

lmao fuck

even though his positions seem to be pretty good most of the time afaict i've always felt like he was kind of a nitwit.

I mean I'll always have much love for Dennis for standing up to the utilities and banks as mayor despite the resulting default, but he is well past his sell-by date as a politician.

a frequent FOX News guest and a praiser of Trump's "American carnage" speech

yeah i had a kucinich '04 sticker on my guitar case in high school but denny pack it in brother wyd

Republican well-financed and wingnut media supported spin on tax plan now gaining ground....

The tax overhaul that President Trump signed into law now has more supporters than opponents, buoying Republican hopes for this year’s congressional elections.

The growing public support for the law coincides with an eroding Democratic lead when voters are asked which party they would like to see control Congress. And it follows an aggressive effort by Republicans, backed by millions of dollars of advertising from conservative groups, to persuade voters of the law’s benefits

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/19/business/economy/tax-overhaul-survey.html

Dems and Dem groups quoted in right-wing site/newspaper article. Priorities USA, a top Democratic super PAC, released a memo calling on Democrats to message more consistently against the tax law.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/democrats-struggle-with-rising-popularity-of-gop-tax-law/article/2649354

fwiw i am getting an extra $38 per paycheck, which adds up to around an extra $832 a year.

contrast that to last year when i was penalized more than that by the mandate for NOT having insurance.

messaging problems indeed.

"oh hey this is a (x) trillion dollar wealth transfer to the top .(x)% and this is a bad thing" (insert correct/exact figures) would have been a fine line to trot out early, often, and consistently, one would think, but it's not clear to me that this was done widely enough