Weinsteins step down as Miramax CEOs

yeah thats what i fucking said, great work - just another fucking ilx thread where ppl read me in the worst possible faith

you used the word relevance. we read the word. we suggested 'relevance' was a wrong-headed metric, and said why we thought so. expecting us to read something other than what you said is silly. correcting our impressions, defeating our objections, or clarifying your position would all be reasonable response. telling us to fuck ourselves is what you chose to do. I decline the invitation.

no its fine, you guys are definitely the good guys because you've decided everything jim derogatis does is now about criticism

lol weren't you just criticizing ppl for deliberately misreading you in bad faith? physician heal thyself etc

do I need to refer you to all the threads clowning DeRo on a regular basis for p much everything he does *except* his R. Kelly reportage

relevance was the word i intended & one hundred percent stand by its use *in context* and if you choose to willfully misread it...fuck yourself

do I need to refer you to all the threads clowning DeRo on a regular basis for p much everything he does *except* his R. Kelly reportage

― Οὖτις, Thursday, November 30, 2017 2:16 PM (twenty-eight seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

*you've decided everything jim derogatis writes about r kelly is now above criticism

how much does he write about r kelly? I'm out of the loop

This is a good piece from last month that touches on how he's gone about it, and how difficult a time he's had of finding media outlets that would publish his pieces:
http://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/November-2017/The-Lonely-Crusade-of-Jim-DeRogatis/

*you've decided everything jim derogatis writes about r kelly is now above criticism

extrapolating from declining to criticize one piece to a blanket assumption that *all pieces* will not be met w criticism IS A LITERAL BAD FAITH ARGUMENT

you are so bad at this plz stop

Maybe I'm crazy but it seems to me the subtext of Ronan Farrow in particular covering Harvey Weinstein may have had something to do with Woody Allen's career revitalization coming at Weinstein's hands: http://articles.latimes.com/1994-06-17/entertainment/ca-5387_1_miramax-films

This article was sold to me via social media as the REAL reason R Kelly has been able to keep doing what he does, but Derogatis lacks the range to understand that in its totality, or the NYer oversold him. The reason would be executives--unnamed, uninvestigated. If there's no new story here, what's the purpose of the reporting? To capitalize.

If he wanted the story to be less dissatisfying to the end consumer he might consider covering an artist with more commercial RELEVANCE who is NOT already widely seen as a sexual predator. In fact, reporters are doing that every day! but in this story, hes beating a dead horse

im not saying that makes him a bad person or that hes the bad guy, just saying the article isnt really adding much to the convo

extrapolating from declining to criticize one piece to a blanket assumption that *all pieces* will not be met w criticism IS A LITERAL BAD FAITH ARGUMENT

you are so bad at this plz stop

― Οὖτις, Thursday, November 30, 2017 2:24 PM (nineteen seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

im talking about this BAD piece in the context of his other, occasionally GOOD pieces, so no its not a bad faith argument idiot

he writes about him a lot, and he deserves praise for continuing to push on this subject. kelly's label deserves condemnation for not dropping him; his fans deserve condemnation for supporting him.

namecalling always helps put your arguments over. you learn lessons well.

xxp

namecalling always helps put your arguments over. you learn lessons well.

― Οὖτις, Thursday, November 30, 2017 2:27 PM (two minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this kind of post is equally useful, glad we're using our time constructively

just glad to be here, the day when r kelly was called to account for the 30th time is one we'll all remember

sic that was like the most crappy uncharitable post ever, are you sure you're not me?

mom they’re fighting in the bad-touch thread again

DeRogatis is still in touch with many of the women’s families, that may have something to do with why he persists in targeting Kelly

Isn't the New Yorker the biggest forum he's ever had for his R.Kelly writing? He's been on the Kelly beat for so long that a swerve to covering some more relevant artist would seem out of character.

i think his buzzfeed article was a much bigger platform

think of this then as a criticism of the nyer editor who sought & packaged this piece, it just struck me as 'get the r kelly guy on the horn that'll be good for a few clicks'

srsly wtf is wrong with you guys

LL makes discussion worthy observations but yall would rather argue about doorlocks or jump right into the 9,576th version of the same WHAT I SAID WAS argument with deej

the worst

xp so, you choose to read the editor's actions in the worst possible light?

incredible use of the xp there

at any rate fair point i apologize for derailing though stand by my posts alrightbye

that's fair point @ VG

aaaaand.... scene

Quiet ladies, the men are shouting.

I still havent watched that Frontline doc, I keep meaning to!

Yes, please watch it! Everyone should watch it. There was another investigation about agricultural workers called Rape in the Fields. Anyone who eats produce or works in an office should watch and discuss.

Apparently Matt wants his money (unlikely result, it seems):

https://pagesix.com/2017/11/30/matt-lauers-lawyers-trying-to-get-him-30m-payout-after-firing/

But he also likes acting like a bad Netflix series villian now or something:

https://nyppagesix.files.wordpress.com/2017/11/matt_lauer-1.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&w=300

...seen for the first time since his sexual misconduct scandal broke leaving his $33 million Hamptons estate on Thursday to meet famed East End real estate and criminal lawyer Eddie Burke Jr. to whom he handed an envelope.

Man FP’ing all the deej and Shakey posts in this thread is like one of those clicker games where nothing really happens but you somehow feel better anyway because you worked at it

<3

Sheesh i tried to be civil :(

🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

surprisingly, I mainly agree with deej - derogatis is just trotting out his r kelly schtick in a different venue here (nb any music writer who turns down nyer money to do something he's already done is a total & complete idiot, though, chicago winter heating bills don't pay for themselves) - however "relevance" lol who gives a fuckin shit, be real w/that, that is an adolescent concern, decaptitated aren't really "relevant" in death metal any more either and I'm very glad all the metal pubs didn't waste any time thinking about that when it came time to report on their crimes

i have been haunted by that story
i wish i hadn't read it
were they prosecuted?

Fellow dudes, if you are in this thread, just remember every time you make it about yourself, you’re making it not about someone else, probably a woman, probably a minority, and your point is better served by listening. It is hard. It can be impossible at times, because we are taught that we should strive to be heard.

It should be fucking obvious that a dude trying to win an argument with another dude is inappropriate in this context. Having said that, I believe I have won all future arguments with fellow dudes, for sure. HA HA I am the wokest, I got first.

This is why we can’t ever listen.

Boys are the worst

idk. boys don't get to be like "boys are the worst" and then leave it there. that sounds like the friend who's always like "i have to flake again, I'm the worst!" It's a cop out. try to be better, don't expect anyone to notice or care that you're trying, just try your best to not live up to "boys are the worst"

for example, i would much prefer to be engaged in a productive interactive conversation over simply being listened to. i would rather be part of a/the conversation than the focus of it. it feels better to be shown that i am worthy of engagement, to be treated as an equal, than it does to simply be heard.

it's also illuminating how easily and naturally these derailed conversations develop -- being aware of that is a start.

keep trying!

exactly

my thing right now is this

since you multitudes of dudes can count on one hand the number of women participating in this thread currently, it would be good if you were occasionally mindful of who’s doing all the talking and just, idk, ask a question or reframe the conversation.

we are weary of this subject and bummed out by it and leery of how close to home it all feels but we’re still here because it feels worthwhile to talk about it. well, ok me, i wont speak for anyone else.

just. respect the issue at the heart of this thread revive. remember why we came here and what we’re here to talk about.

that’s all.

I don't know who this Geist person is but surely the puffy-faced sociopath from breaking bad is Jesse Plemons/Tod

Did I solve the thread

(I mean that describes many of the characters from that show)

ohh true he does look like him

since you multitudes of dudes can count on one hand the number of women participating in this thread currently, it would be good if you were occasionally mindful of who’s doing all the talking and just, idk, ask a question or reframe the conversation.

I don't really participate in this thread, but I read it, so I would like to know who the woman participating are. I know some of you, but some names I'm not sure. LL, VG, Trayce, In Orbit, Horseshoe, who else?

*cough*

It does feel like something new is happening, like for years there was talk of “oh Terry Richardson is horrible” but the fashion business’s MO seemed to be “never acknowledge it” - I am a little curious about whether there was pressure to not publish any answer to a question about him, or whether the fashion press is sufficiently a courtier industry that it was never asked.

Or maybe it was reported and didn’t matter - the other matter that struck me was Eddie Berganza, an editor in the DC Superman office, who had semi-blind items and a silent demotion for sexual assault five years ago, and was actually named last year and nothing happened, and now there’s a Buzzfeed article and DC are shocked, shocked and now he’s finally gone.

Which is to say that I understand the tendency to go “oh this will revert to the mean”, and it’s the hope that kills you etc etc but dudes saying that nothing will change should maybe be aware how that looks when things are already changing.

Also as a result I can’t blame DeRogatis for thinking “okay the New Yorker is a pretty big deal, maybe one more fucking Kelly article will make a difference”, but I’m also not surprised if it’s one more fucking Kelly article.

Especially if it's in the print issue, having the story in the New Yorker will reach a whole new audience.

And fair enough to say legally this is all consenting adults, but if one of the parents was a movie director or politician, etc...

I assume this has become a general thread for related stories? Add Jays broadcaster Gregg Zaun to the list.

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/baseball/mlb/gregg-zaun-rogers-sportsnet-fired-1.4427565

https://apnews.com/3895454a10004f258ed7e18f25c74a26?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=APCentralRegion

CHICAGO (AP) — Details of alleged sexual assaults by Hollywood mogul Harvey Weinstein, comedian Bill Cosby and other famous figures are now widely known in part because several accusers did something they promised in writing never to do: They talked publicly about their allegations.

When those women spoke out, they broke nondisclosure agreements — contractual pledges not to discuss what happened that are common features of financial settlements. In doing so, they helped start a national discussion about sexual misconduct and showed that the agreements do not necessarily offer the same ironclad protection that for decades has shielded the rich and powerful.

A look at how the agreements work and what can happen when accusers go public anyway:

Seeing more rumblings that the next big stories will be Broadway-focused, thus

I have a feeling the world of Broadway is going to be rocked to its foundations. We'd better wear our seatbelts for the next few days.

— Lea Salonga (@MsLeaSalonga) December 1, 2017

hmm