Chapo Trap House and the rise of the dirtbag left

Androsky resigned from the DSA-LA steering committee.

http://www.dsa-la.org/statements_from_josh_androsky_and_the_dsa_la_steering_committee

The right move.

They got better aboutnkt talking over female guests fwiw but I definitely remember that being a problem at least once or twice. Mostly Felix.

yeah the Klein episode and the international-left one were pretty notably free of that. I wish amber was on more regularly.

quite the commitment to dirtbag style

oh man I left a dump in the toilet the second before I left for the airport last week. it was sitting here 7 days. don't say it was my posts

— Partisan Gridlock (@ByYourLogic) October 13, 2017

"partisan gridlock" as a spooky halloween handle is a pretty good joke

accusations of assault against sam kriss... wonder if any other of these folks in this orbit were on that shitty media men list

yeah i heard about that list, how widely was it circulated? assuming it's not public

I just learned that I'm on a list of "shitty media men" that's being circulated. But I have no idea what I'm accused of. Sweet Jesus.

— Doug Henwood (@DougHenwood) October 16, 2017

xp

yeah, also I wonder if global tetrahedron was on it

wtf?

were on that shitty media men list

oh, is this the one Doug Henwood found out he was on? presumably for attacking H.R.C.

XXP

i've still only heard half of one episode of these guys, but it could be worse, i could be reading 'celebrity' 'feminist' Twitter

Good lord. Between Harvey, Donald and Bernie, women are reliving all KINDS of pain.

I want to hug all of you right now. Every single woman.

— Amber Tamblyn (@ambertamblyn) October 14, 2017

oooooof

also Kriss' apology statement was...not good

The cynicism of tweets like that is exactly why I still slightly mistrust the "shitty media men" list -- 95% of the women putting men on the list probably have legit reasons but if the document was so easy for anyone to add anyone to, and without context, etc. As Henwood points out, he doesn't even know what the charge is, so it's pretty hard for him to explain/defend/apologize/whatever is warranted.

also agree about Kriss's apology. A straight apology is all that was called for, no "explanation."

Amazes me that none of these people have learned from others' mistakes re: public statements. The first, brief paragraph in Kriss' post would've sufficed. Totally unnecessary & counterproductive to go into detail. I really don't get it. You apologize if necessary, then shut up.

Kriss responded to it, but didn’t exactly help himself with all the extra bits, did he

The actual details are... appalling

Dude is a serious piece of shit

The cynicism of tweets like that is exactly why I still slightly mistrust the "shitty media men" list -- 95% of the women putting men on the list probably have legit reasons but if the document was so easy for anyone to add anyone to, and without context, etc.

the spreadsheet existed as a living document for like only 12 hours; it was meant to be useful for women, not a court of public opinion

i guess what i’m trying to say is it doesn’t matter if you “mistrust” it

Only guy that's been accused of sexual assault & kept his statement/denial short that I can think of is James Deen.

i guess what i’m trying to say is it doesn’t matter if you “mistrust” it

that's true, because no one with a brain should be thinking about it

thanks morbs, i think it's actually worth thinking about how women can make themselves and each other aware of abusers, but no, you're right

Won't link until I find it somewhere other than copy/pasted to /pol but tldr is he coerces her into drinking, ignoress protests and kisses/gropes her, and my favorite part brags about his 'big fucking house' that he'll inherit when his parents die

i see, a blacklist that could contain groundless character assassination is now "meant to be useful"

get me outta this fucking century

lmao ok dude

fwiw Sam Kriss struck me as kind of a POS in his podcast appearances and in his writing, which I also just didn't think was very good or smart.

no, you're right, any anonymous "document" must be believed 100%

xp

morbs i am ESPECIALLY not saying that

though i guess i understand where you got the idea

i... give up?

Alex Press wrote about this

https://www.vox.com/first-person/2017/10/16/16482800/harvey-weinstein-sexual-harassment-workplace

that's a good piece

I thought Jia Talentino's piece on the New Yorker site was good too.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-whisper-network-after-harvey-weinstein-and-shitty-media-men

Anyway, afaik (1) no actual host of Chapo is on a "shitty media men" list or has been rumored to be (2) there are no standing allegations against a host of Chapo, (3) no Chapo host has said anything shitty, or, afaict, anything at all about the Kriss allegations (and I don't really think they are required to do so or even should). I guess Kriss is sort of a "Chapo universe" guy but he's not part of the podcast, and I think it's kind of shitty to tie his behavior to them.

I mean this is also a "dirtbag left" thread so it's fair play but I did think the "waiting to find out which of them is a serial abuser" comment was a little beyond the pale

some ppl are creeping precariously close to "all men are guilty"

you seem to believe this morbs

it seems more like "the Bernie wing is guilty" to me

there are a couple sentences in that nyer piece that... don't read great to me

In dirtbag-left-adjacent news on a related subject, @CApuffin's accounts of what went down in DSA-LA and their systemic failure to deal with it is much more troublesome to me than the Kriss thing is

Been predictably ugly since the initial statement (on pastebin and easily findable if you are on twitter) and SK's non-apology (the guy is now losing thousands of followers) were released. All that theory can just go to the bin when the basics are nowhere to be found.

One of his female friends have had to leave twitter due to the abuse she has been getting by just being associated with SK. Questions are now being asked around whether Momentum have any procedures to deal with abusers too (SK being a member). Expect this one to run on and on around new-ish UK left media and certain sections of the left - with hopefully something good coming out of this. xps

The Chapo with the closest Kriss association is Amber (the podcast that stopped after a few eps). I think the podcast does need to do an episode on abuses on the left - this, the LA DSA harassment allegations, their Cosby tweet, etc.. They've tackled 'woke lib' creeps before, they should acknowledge it in their own backyard too.

Kriss's conduct was vile top to bottom and the bragging about his family's wealth makes me think of other privileged leftists who went bad later on (ala Hitchens).

Expect this one to run on and on around new-ish UK left media and certain sections of the left - with hopefully something good coming out of this.

God, I hope so. Abuse and harassment in left orgs is a *massive* problem that needs to be convincingly dealt with everywhere.

here's the full story, as i mentioned before it's pretty vile

https://www.facebook.com/notes/monitoring-the-lefts-support-for-r-pe-culture/metoo-and-sam-kriss/1518056408275666/

Yeah.

On the left in the UK this all ties back to cover up of abuses around SWP - many of those on the anarcho left fighting the SWP had no time for SK at all. As did many really but SK did occupy this curious middle ground between far-left and Guardian left.

(jepsen is a/the woman who brought the LA DSA sexual harassment allegations)

Kblocki‏ @kblocki 28m28 minutes ago
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Okay Sarge, but wrong response for a couple of reasons. Your point isn't technically wrong, but doesn't absolve the left because it's an...
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Kblocki‏ @kblocki 27m27 minutes ago
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Issue everywhere else. Second, it's a unique issue on the left because so many leftist women/men are willing to defend/overlook because...
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Kblocki‏ @kblocki 24m24 minutes ago
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Of other percieved good qualities (Chapo Trap House) or as you point out (it's a problem everywhere so why are we getting called out) or...
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Kblocki‏ @kblocki 23m23 minutes ago
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It's just dismissed as HRC delusion or relitigating and ignored as an issue.
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crawly rage jepsen‏ @CApuffin 22m22 minutes ago
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This is really disgusting. I'm a leftist woman & men across the political spectrum have been horrible to me.
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crawly rage jepsen‏ @CApuffin 20m20 minutes ago
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Don't you dare use my harassment to denigrate left politics as a whole-so many womn are leftists and fighting this.
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Don't you dare use my harassment to vilify left politics as a whole. Liberal institutions are horrible to harassment reporters too.

— crawly rage jepsen (@CApuffin) October 17, 2017

It's more disappointing in leftist men, but the left provides a better framework for fixing these problems than liberalism.

— crawly rage jepsen (@CApuffin) October 17, 2017

Also my abusive ex loved second wave feminism and hated Chapo.

— crawly rage jepsen (@CApuffin) October 17, 2017

I'm not convinced he's any kind of left really and that big house comment appears to confirm that, but he's a guy who hit on an online persona that worked very well for him for a while. You always get the sense there's an ageing reactionary lurking within self-styled bad boys of the British intellectual left and there's been a nasty misogynistic tone to a lot of Kriss's posturing.

The linked story is horrible and worse than I would have expected but he's always come across as transparently loving the approval he got from a crowd of gross enablers.

as others have already said more eloquently than me, the left has the burden/responsibility to be/do better on these things since it's the left that wants to replace the existing order.