Drink full: The TWIN PEAKS 2017 spoiler thread, part 2

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also, remember that the electricity "going out" can also mean a surge of electricity, too much electricity. my first reaction when i saw it was to think that evil had come to this hitherto normal household.

― Karl Malone, Tuesday, September 5, 2017 10:50 AM (two hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Season 4 -- Twin Peaks: The Checking of the Palmer's Breaker Box

Did we know that Ray was snitching to the FBI?

"Has my watch stopped, or was that one of the Marx brothers?"

btw I have to give full credit to Chrysta Bell for her reading of "He electrocuted himself by sticking a fork.. in a wall socket"

Ray was clearly passing info to someone but I think it was left unclear, even meant to be misdirection.

no they specifically said he was an informant in the big ep. 17 exposition scene at the beginning

an fbi informant that is

man Albert getting no dialogue whatsoever in twin peaks

Yeah sorry, I meant prior to that.

xp

Man, all this stuff about Coop failing in the end, being defeated, etc: I can kind of see it, but there's very, very little textual support for the amount of attention that's being given to this line of thought, it seems to me.

― Dan I., Tuesday, September 5, 2017 3:24 PM (eight minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yeah I can't speak to the accuracy of this interpretation, could well be true, but that narrative falls real flat for me. Cooper failing at the end of S2 was powerful, because we'd spent two seasons with him and seen the limits of his goodness. Ditto Naomi Watts being pushed to the edge in Mulholland Drive, b/c we'd spent much of the movie with her. But Cooper failing at the end of an 18-hour odyssey he was barely a player in for the first 16 episodes is really unsatisfying. Why did he fail? Why did he do anything he did? It was hard to tell, because we'd hardly spent any time with him

Ray actually addressed the person on the phone as Philip so I think all the stuff he says before dying is true - what this means re the FBI snitch reveal is just unfathomable

Albert and Tammy relaying all the info on Dougie after just glancing around at the machines was pretty amusing.

She pulled the info off the computer file on Douglas Jones sent to them by the Las Vegas field office.

/Man, all this stuff about Coop failing in the end, being defeated, etc: I can kind of see it, but there's very, very little textual support for the amount of attention that's being given to this line of thought, it seems to me.

― Dan I., Tuesday, September 5, 2017 3:24 PM (eight minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink/

Yeah I can't speak to the accuracy of this interpretation, could well be true, but that narrative falls real flat for me. Cooper failing at the end of S2 was powerful, because we'd spent two seasons with him and seen the limits of his goodness. Ditto Naomi Watts being pushed to the edge in Mulholland Drive, b/c we'd spent much of the movie with her. But Cooper failing at the end of an 18-hour odyssey he was barely a player in for the first 16 episodes is really unsatisfying. Why did he fail? Why did he do anything he did? It was hard to tell, because we'd hardly spent any time with him

apart from the two seasons we spent with him

So, what exactly happened in the scene with Mr. C in a cage by Garland's head? Most of it seems pretty straightforward, but just before he was sent to the TP police dept. parking lot, C was transformed into... something. I thought it was a monkey on first viewing, but it's not. It looks like a bristle brush and a marble? Is it maybe a golden ball and a shock of hair (i.e. the components for constructing a Tulpa)!?

(this question not related to the "did Coop fail" thing)

he didn't fail tho! all season he was constantly winning without even trying. he even went back in time and stopped Laura from ever dying in the first place.

I haven't rewatched since the first time but I thought it was just his head from a rear angle lol

it's a bezoar

Oh yeah that! I forgot about that, but it stood out while viewing. Bristly hair was sticking out between the bars- it made me think of a porcupine almost

Xpost

he even went back in time and stopped Laura from ever dying in the first place

this is an odd interpretation

Yeah seriously

did you miss when the wrapped in plastic disappeared BTTF style?

*screaming intensifies*

Yeah, it seemed clear to me that that's what happened! That's why Judy (in Sarah) was so pissed off! She (It) had been foiled

how great was it when Sheriff Truman has Bad Cooper in his office, looks right at him, and says, "Cooper.. Cooper."

he had shit figured out

"C was transformed into... something. I thought it was a monkey on first viewing, but it's not. It looks like a bristle brush and a marble? Is it maybe a golden ball and a shock of hair (i.e. the components for constructing a Tulpa)!?"

you mean when he's walking away in the parking lot? you're just looking at the back of his head; it kind of looked like his FBI pin was being used to hold up his shit ponytail

i love how ambiguous the ending is. it could be Laura's dream. it could be Cooper's dream from season 1. the first time he enters the Lodge and is 25 years older is in a dream.

also fwiw i don't entire buy that Sarah is possessed so much as the house is a super conduit for negative vibes.

The story ends with a confused Cooper and Carrie/Laura screaming out of pure fear/terror. How is this not a failed venture? *scratching head*

Was gonna ask if you guys stopped watching at part 17 but even then...

twin peaks is a good show because no one can agree even on the most basic elements of what happened
like at this point i feel like i could say "kyle maclachlan starred in twin peaks" and someone would have somehow missed that or be convinced that it was a different actor
this is not a dig at anyone, i have missed important stuff too

Can't remember if someone mentioned this above, but the moment Laura disappears while holding Cooper's hand in the woods, isn't the sound that plays (before the curtain flapping and laura screaming sounds) the Fireman's record player sound from back in ep. 3 ?

akm: no, in the cage before he is sent back to the parking lot

apart from the two seasons we spent with him

That's a cheat, though. The Return was an 18-hour work meant to stand on its own, just like fwwm did but on a more epic scale, so ending it with a "here's what this season says about a character sidelined for 94% of the series and that we hadn't seen for 25 years before that" feels empty

did you miss when the wrapped in plastic disappeared BTTF style?

...except then Laura disappears while he's trying to lead her out of the woods (presumably back to the White Lodge idk), Cooper clearly fails to rescue her. He hears the sounds from the opening scene in the first episode ("listen to the sounds") and then she's gone. I took this as a literal "you can't change the past"-type failure on Cooper's part. Which is what drives him to subsequently continue with Diane down the road to the point in the desert by the powerlines, which leads to the other alternate/inverted reality.

xp

he rescues her from the story line of the original twin peaks but doesn't necessarily save her completely, i.e. protect her from evil/her fate forever

but the body didnt turn up and pete just fished

what is that sound anyway? a record skipping would make sense thematically...

[but the body didnt turn up and pete just fished

soooo.... where does she disappear to?

to not death

I feel like the recurring trauma (the Scream, etc) is part of Laura's (the bigger Laura "spirit" that the Fireman sent to earth) "job"--the way that she works against evil is to be a kind of ritual sacrifice, an archetypal victim (and I know people have deployed this idea w/r/t Laura even before S3)

The Scream is not a defeat, the Scream is what Laura does

I guess her not getting murdered by being magically led away by Cooper through the woods doesn't make sense to me because it leaves all the other factors that led up to her murder in place. Does Leland just decide to ... not kill her? I mean wtf

xp

i think he prevented her from going to the train car that night with ronette

I guess I would feel more confident in that interpretation if the shots of Pete fishing/body disappearing etc. came *after* she disappears out of his hands rather than before

When I agreed that it was a weird interpretation I wasn't disputing that the disappearing body signified a change in the story, I was questioning Adam's idea that "you still get raped constantly from ages 12-17, but I'm going to remove the most significant choice you make in this story" as yet another example of a whole season of frictionless winning for Dale. Plus yeah all the stuff that happens after

i think he can have saved her that night and still not have "saved her". he succeeded in stopping her murder that one night but he failed in defeating evil and death forever.

I enjoy reading all of your thoughts but I literally (thankfully) have no more thoughts on this, just unable to parse or process it. My only take away is this season gave us a deeper understanding of the Twin Peaks mythology, which I loved

another way dale can be seen fucking up... laura chose death that night.. it's what she wanted

http://twinpeaks.wikia.com/wiki/Mrs._Tremond/Chalfont

fyi, in case it hadn't been linked before

same two last names mentioned by the woman who opens the door at the not-Palmer house