a quick poll about Russia and Donald Trump

why Kissinger and Chile instead of Clinton and Honduras?

because Kissinger and Chile makes a stronger case for my point

i meant in the sense of botox, which ain't cheap

xpost

yeah there seems way way way more here than there was with Benghazi

100 times zero is still zero

― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Monday, March 27, 2017 6:13 PM (three months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol

btw, most of the news stories I heard or read yesterday about the meeting with the Russian lawyer kept emphasizing Donald Trump Jr.'s involvement, while barely mentioning Kushner's and Manafort's attendance at the same meeting. This puzzles me, since Kushner is a member of the current administration and Manafort was then the manager of the Trump campaign. Donald Trump Jr.'s importance is tangential compared to those two.

Well, half scoop is the son of two scoop, and you'd think daddy would be interested in what his eldest son is doing. Now, of course, two scoop is a straight up sociopath, so normal rules doesn't count, but it's not strange that people are focusing on jr.

The focus is on Half Scoop because he tweeted the emails, he agreed to the meeting, and he was the only one actually talking to the Russian lawyer; apparently Manafort was on his phone the whole time and Kush bitched out partway through

I found this very amusing: http://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2017/07/goalposts-wont-move

1) Don’t be silly. There’s no evidence that the Russians did anything untoward or that anyone involved with the Trump campaign even met with the Russians, let alone colluded with them for electoral gain. While in principle I support an investigation, in practice we should not waste our time on such distractions from the real issues.

2) Don’t be silly. There’s no evidence that the Russians did anything untoward that I personally find convincing. And while one or two people with the Trump campaign did have undisclosed meetings with Russian officials that they later forgot to remember when denying having them under oath, there is no reason to see that as being particularly suspicious. While in principle I support an investigation, in practice we should not waste our time on such distractions from the real issues.

3) Don’t be silly. The evidence that the Russians messed with the election comes from intelligence sources. ‘Nuff said. And while a myriad of people with the Trump campaign did have undisclosed meetings with Russian officials which kept slipping their minds when they were questioned about such meetings, there is no reason to see that as being particularly suspicious. While in principle I support an investigation, in practice we should not waste our time on such distractions from the real issues.

4) Don’t be silly. Remember: U.S. intelligence, a contradiction in terms. That, or the Deep State apparatus. One of those things. Sure, people involved with the Trump campaign met people connected to the Russian government to discuss colluding with them for electoral gain, but nothing actually come of it in this particular meeting so no harm done, amirite? And if any harm was done, it was to Hillary Clinton because of the bad things she did that, had she not done them, would have meant there could have been no collusion so her evildoing is the real story. Which is why, while in principle I support an investigation, in practice we should not waste our time on such distractions from the real issue, which is Hillary’s evildoing.

i don't get it why is Russia an "aggressor"? i dont understand why we should be so concerned with them specifically when we have been funding and supplying weapons to several countries that openly fund the terrorism we have been at war with for over a dozen years now? how is hacking some emails for a campaign manager treason compared to that?aaaaaa

― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Wednesday, July 12, 2017 3:01 AM (yesterday)

lol wow dude you were literally claiming three months ago that there was "zero" evidence of anything and now you've switched your line to "well it isn't treason!"

i assume if we ever have a tape of trump bragging about how good he is at committing treason your angle will be "i don't get it, what's so bad about treason anyway?"

Adam just admit you voted for teh Donald already

My article from last August describes open Kremlin promotion of Trump in 2014-2015, backed up today by WSJ report https://t.co/V2v3VOMOTT pic.twitter.com/sVoKLqXsyt

— Sarah Kendzior (@sarahkendzior) July 12, 2017

. . . and . . .

Kremlin spokesman when asked about the hacked emails: "Talk to Donald Trump Jr" pic.twitter.com/eeTTcYAA9N

— Sarah Kendzior (@sarahkendzior) July 26, 2016

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/3893506-Invasion-of-Privacy-lawsuit-complaint-Trump.html

lol wow dude you were literally claiming three months ago that there was "zero" evidence of anything and now you've switched your line to "well it isn't treason!"

lol this entire thing hinges on it being treason.

Nixon had a smoking gun of him admitted her understands the plan and saying to go ahead with it. the minute they find that for Trump i will eat my shoe.

there are lots of things wrong w this and potentially illegal about this that have nothing to do with treason

Russia is going to be Trump's Benghazi

― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), 26. marts 2017 22:22 (three months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

100 times zero is still zero

― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), 28. marts 2017 00:13 (three months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

still waiting on that evidence

― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), 17. juni 2017 18:57 (three weeks ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

if there is the Russian conspiracy equivalent of the Bill Clinton semen dress let's see it

― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), 17. juni 2017 18:57 (three weeks ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Dude, you've been wrong about this from the start, and no matter how much you move the goalposts, you will still be wrong.

I'm sure the guy who said that the ACA was written just as secretly as the GOP healthcare bill is being fair minded and informed on this one too.

turns out the republican who lied about our previous president's kenyan birth met with the russian government he owes billions to collude on "winning" an american presidential election. still feels weird typing that out, even with all the proof available at this point

the son, the son-in-law, the campaign manager, and the russian lawyer, and that's it. . .and the ex-KGB agent

the son, the son-in-law, the campaign manager, the russian lawyer, the ex-KGB agent. . .and the interpreter

the son, the son-in-law, the campaign manager, the russian lawyer, the ex-KGB agent, the interpreter. . .and miss universe

i don't really understand who this person is who can confirm there was an eighth mystery person but there may or may not have been more people than that

you missed the epilogue, it's Justice Wargrave

Kilroy showed up near the end of the meeting, but he spent all his time doodling.

https://www.vox.com/videos/2017/7/14/15971936/strikethrough-fox-news-normalize-collusion-russia-trump-hannity

so... futerfas is being paid with trump 2020 campaign contributions????

the guy who fired the director of the FBI for investigating russian (!) interference into the election (whose son (!), campaign manager (!), and son-in-law (!) met with representatives of the russian (!) government about interfering in the election and god knows what other classified shenanigans that haven't been made public yet) would never do such a thing :)

http://ishkur.com/trump/

http://www.politicalresearch.org/2017/05/11/between-trump-and-putin-the-right-wing-international-a-crisis-of-democracy-and-the-future-of-the-european-union/#sthash.QkVJC8fV.1GpZTXD8.dpbs

“So. Washington is ours. Chișinău is ours. Sofia is ours. It remains but to drain the swamp in Russia itself.”

If guys who look like Dugin and Richard Spencer are really going to hold sway over the future, then please god just give 김정은 some proper ICBMs with proper warheads already

Given that it looks increasingly like that Dugin has been fired from Katehon - the organisation most people regard as 'his' think tank (having already been fired from Moscow State University) and Spencer is primarily famous for getting punched in time with Born In The USA / Killing In The Name Of, you can probably defer the friendly bombs for a while.

A few months after that Dugin quote, Boyko Borisov was re-elected as Prime Minister of Bulgaria, a much more powerful institution than the Presidency his party lost, albeit as part of a coalition. Bulgaria is an interesting example though. Borisov is a homophobic, racist, illiberal kleptocrat with strong links to organised crime whose wife runs a bank alleged in leaked US memos to be part of a huge money laundering operation. He's notionally 'our guy', though.

The article references the election victory of Igor Dodon in Moldova but neglects to mention that he beat the candidate of a party whose leader engineered the theft of 12% of the country's GDP in a single year. idk how you can write an article about growing illiberalism in Europe and not mention Poland once, either.

If we're going to take the concept of a threat to liberalism in Europe seriously, and learn anything from it, we need to stop viewing countries in the centre / east just as proxies in a fight with Russia and ask why their institutions are structurally incapable of putting up resistance to kleptocrats and religious revanchists of all stripes. That would require a lot more work and self-criticism than anyone seems willing to put in.

"If we're going to take the concept of a threat to liberalism in Europe seriously, and learn anything from it, we need to stop viewing countries in the centre / east just as proxies in a fight with Russia and ask why their institutions are structurally incapable of putting up resistance to kleptocrats and religious revanchists of all stripes. That would require a lot more work and self-criticism than anyone seems willing to put in."

I'd be interested in hearing more about what you mean when you talk of their structural incapability, and how Western European nations contribute to that (if that is the suggestion you're making).

It's a good question and probably depends on how far back you want to go. Each country is different but post 1992, it's difficult to think of many that have been able to grow strong civil society / state institutions capable of pushing back on the encroachment of executive power. Poland is probably one of the better ones - which is why PiS is so keen to hobble the independent judiciary.

Opinions vary but a lot of the nation-building activities designed to support the transition away from communism either neglected the importance of those institutions - believing that they'd grow organically over time if you just implemented free markets and free elections - or actively encouraged the concentration of power in the hands of people who were amenable to the EU / US.

More recently, the EU could have made much more effort to ensure that countries like Slovakia, Hungary and Bulgaria were, at the very least, constitutionally robust, had transparent budgets, had strong independent anti-corruption offices, etc before being formally given accession. A lot of it was there on paper but never properly interrogated. You could also argue they've been slow to push back on the V4 countries - for all the talk of potential sanctions on Poland and Hungary, there's no action yet.

The rise of PiS in Poland is also deeply linked to the failure to socialise the benefits of membership. On paper, the Polish economy has boomed but gains in quality of life have been unevenly distributed while cost of living has shot up for everyone. Poland hasn't arbitrarily decided that trad-Cath identitarianism trumps economic growth of 6% p.a or w/e.

Looking outside the EU at Moldova - the willingness to back people like Vlad Filat / Vlad Plahotniuc because they're notionally on the EU / US side has backfired horribly. Not only are they increasingly toxic domestically, the EU and US get guilt by association. This article has some good background on that:

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/04/world/europe/moldova-vlad-plahotniuc.html

It's an active betrayal of Moldovans who genuinely share pro-EU views.

Ukraine is a similar situation. Russia and the EU / US both treated Ukraine as a prize to win, the latter initially willing to turn a blind eye to Yanukovich's corruption if it meant bringing the country into NATO and an economic alliance with Europe. The west has never been in a better position than it is now to ensure that Ukraine is rebuilt in a way that conforms to some vague notion of a liberal democracy (it, after all, controls the money spigot and access to EU markets) but has done nothing to stop one kleptocracy replacing another. There are occasional calls to have a properly resourced anti-corruption board put in place but, at the moment, everyone seems happy to funnel IMF cash and EU / US aid into the pockets of a different set of gangsters to the ones who were in the ascendancy until 2014.

The key theme throughout the region - from Ukraine to Georgia - is that privatisation is mandatory, robust democratic structures are optional.

None of which means that Russia is better, of course. That shouldn't need pointing out.

Thanks SV

http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a56395/trump-russia-money/

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iql43wLjm6H8/v2/800x-1.png

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iql43wLjm6H8/v2/800x-1.png

when you put it that way

'None of these' p much the same as 'other', right? Or is 'none of these' long for dgaf?

D2S didn't even have a 35% chance of beating hillz :(

immigration tied with climate change is an eye-opener.

Build the sea wall

And make polar bears pay for it.

The Trump Russia scandal is a pretty distinct thing from the "U.S. relationship with Russia" issue though in people's minds I believe. It does garner a lot of interest (hence the coverage) but that interest is really more "dislike of Trump" specific. Also unlikely Dems run on the scandal exclusively, they've actually been talking a lot about healthcare the last few months.

the most russia-friendly congressperson speaks

https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/07/congressman-asks-scientists-if-theyve-found-ancient-civilizations-on-mars/

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/18/Dana_Rohrabacher.jpg

Congressman Hoskins

collusion meeting at trump tower was to talk about martian adoption, no joke

trump is trolling us. next time he gives a speech he will walk onstage to this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sxTbfeYdO0

i still tend to think this is being overblown, but if it hurts his presidency i guess it's justified. as lenin would say.

Dana Rohrabacher is relatively pro-weed, maybe he was high for the hearing.

a sitting congressperson -- dana rohrabacher (R-CA) -- was working with the russians to scuttle a sanctions bill and was using russian propaganda to justify it around the time two-scoops supposedly didn't "meet with" his namesake son, his daughter's husband, his campaign manager, the crown jewel of moscow prosecution, and the head of the russian money laundering a-team about adopting russian orphans. i'm glad chris kobach (R-KS) is reviewing america's voter rolls in the wake of the 2016 election. taxes are theft :)