Fire at Grenfell Tower in London

Paget-Brown needs to go.

http://www.primeeconomics.org/articles/treasury-economics-george-osborne-and-grenfell-tower

I find myself agreeing with much of this Ann Pettifor piece, but not entirely sure about her her line of argument and conclusion - probably need to read it again later.

Poignant messages left by firemen at the scene of the #GrenfellTower fire. pic.twitter.com/U3yWbQYU5Y

— CameramanJim (@cameramanjimITV) June 22, 2017

http://www.primeeconomics.org/articles/treasury-economics-george-osborne-and-grenfell-tower🕸

I find myself agreeing with much of this Ann Pettifor piece, but not entirely sure about her her line of argument and conclusion - probably need to read it again later.

I completely agree. The economic profession largely embraced austerity and not for any reasons that could be supported by evidence or observation. Dogma is the right word for it and their myopic stupidity is one of the root causes of all this.

yeah that article is booming

Thread on Grenfell and the death toll (79 is far, far too low) which is fuelling suspicion of a cover up (1/?)

— David Lammy (@DavidLammy) June 25, 2017

When all the scummer press were focusing on the faulty Hotpoint fridge/freezer the other day I couldn't help thinking it wouldn't have caught fire if it was plugged into an RCBO (which will trip on slightest phase neutral imbalance or overcurrent) circuit. And also all electrical appliances can become dangerous over time. I appreciate Hotpoint don't have a good record, but in social housing people who are poor are more likely to buy 2nd hand white goods.

Yeah, short of signs of arson or particularly foolhardy risks, focusing on the cause of this or any domestic fire is limited in use at best.

In this instance it's actively distracting

This is damning.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p056nw0f

A fire expert inspecting another Rydon building.

I do like the way that man says the word "appalling"

Jesus, that clip. My dad worked on buildings like that in the 70s and has been banging on for days about how they must have opened up additional fire routes beyond just the cladding for it to have got to the core in the way it looks like it did in Grenfell. Which is exactly what that inspector is saying.

I actually thought that gas couldn't be Installed in Tower blocks in the uk.

well that's not a very can-do attitude!

In 2008 restrictions on types of gas cookers in all flats came into effect - but applied only to new purchases.

Focus on the cladding panels alone is missing the point. From https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/27/may-orders-national-inquiry-after-100-failure-rate-in-high-rise-cladding-tests?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

"The government has given limited information about how the tests on cladding samples are being carried out by the Building Research Establishment. The Department for Communities and Local Government said it was undertaking combustibility tests on core materials, but experts have warned that cladding systems also need to be tested as a whole, including insulation materials and design features such as fire breaks.

“You are testing a material in isolation,” said David Metcalfe, the head of the Centre for Window and Cladding Technology. “What we need to consider is how it performs as a system – it’s the cladding, it’s the support system, it’s the insulation, it’s the cavity barriers, it’s all of these things combined to determine what happens in a fire.”

Also worrying in that article is the report of blocks missing loads of fire doors. That's a complete absence of responsibility for fire safety by whichever landlord it is.

Javid was going in on the number of blocks in Camden missing fire doors, leading rw twitter to rage at high rise dwellers stealing and selling doors for scrap and alleging that camden is corbyn's favourite council (doesn't really work but is attempt to turn story into stick to beat labour).

Javid btw was on the list of landlord MPs who voted against tougher safety measures on landlords. Of course.

Police have said they don't expect to have a firm death toll *this year*.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/40434741

The actual fuck

What will change next year

Tory/DUP government on more strong and stable footing.

Why the fuck is it so hard?

Why the fuck is it so hard?

Because there could be lots of people who weren't officially living there and there is nothing left of them.

Probably true but I've noticed this before in the UK, these things move at a snail's pace, it took them 6 months to recover four bodies from that power station that collapsed last year.

Yeah but... Aren't they missed by someone? I'd reckon the completely unaccounted for are far outnumbered by those who people know of are missed because of this. xp

I guess people know who some of the missing people are but given the unofficial nature of their occupancy they're reluctant to come forward, even though the Met have stated there's an amnesty on those who were sub-letting.

There's a lot of leeway between firm death toll and expected approximate final figure, which they are avoiding for all they're worth since last week

"What will change next year"

"Compassion fatigue" was a hideous expression I read somewhere earlier. Nick Robinson likes to keep the "debate" going every day on the radio and tv, that of course this tragedy is not the government's fault you fules. Maybe through blunt repetition within a year everyone will be over this unfortunate episode, and sprinklers wouldn't have made any difference etc...

Have they even recovered all the bodies from the tower yet? Huge parts of the building must be extremely dangerous and unstable.

Given the news today about Hillsborough you'd think they'd realise that this isn't going to fade away. Angry, grieving families aren't the kind to lie down and swallow the official line.

Given the immigration politics festering in this country at the moment I'd guess that some friends or family of the deceased are afraid to even talk to anyone official.

Apologies if already posted but this is one of the better analyses of Grenfell and the actual housing issues at stake I've read, maybe the best. Comments shockingly good as well.

https://nearlylegal.co.uk/aftereffects/

Have they even recovered all the bodies from the tower yet? Huge parts of the building must be extremely dangerous and unstable.

A construction company is helping the authorities stabilise the structure.

At the cih housing conference today the invited housing minister was too busy to attend. First time a housing minister hasn't addressed the conference in 22 years. Government sent minister for communities and local government in his place. 10 minutes speech about how many thousands of homes are going to be built and how lots of cladding panels are failing lol independent fire tests.

Going to a specially convened discussion on grenfell this afternoon.

The Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea (RBKC) has angered residents by excluding press and the public from its first cabinet meeting since the Grenfell Tower fire.

The council said tonight's cabinet meeting, due to start at 6.30pm, would be private due to "security and public safety concerns".

If they want a full blown riot, they just need to keep dehumanising the Grenfell tenants and acting like guilty, shady fuckers. I'm sure they will get one.

Meant to add earlier: the chair told the local government minister that there was time for questions but he muttered that he had to go and was off stage like nobody's business.

This judge fella seems like a terrible old Tory bastard, unsurprisingly.

The meeting broke up as the press were ordered to be allowed in by the judge.

Just insane the council (never mind May and the Government) haven't fallen over this.

Full statement from Nicholas Paget-Brown. Doesnt include resignation. pic.twitter.com/RBcwGAagSN

— #JusticeForGrenfell (@just4grenfell) June 29, 2017

This judge fella seems like a terrible old Tory bastard, unsurprisingly.

(no argument the single decision highlighted by the press was a bad one though, and i accept accusations of terrible old tory bastard-dom aren't helped by him looking like john major's lanky stunt double)

He sounds like an absolute cunt who is a violent struggle session short of knowing what a "decent human being" is. But at least he has admitted that it is going to be one of them type of inquiries that will only please the guilty parties and not the victims.

Yes, that was almost funny; "don't get yer hopes up."

2010/11: 106,000 preventative inspections by local authority health & safety inspectors; 2015/16: 3850 preventative inspections. Local authority health & safety preventative inspections down 96%

Looking at tomorrow's @thetimes front page, suddenly the Council's bizarre secrecy around their meeting today makes more sense pic.twitter.com/RbJU6Faxwh

— Felix Renicks (@ffffelix) June 29, 2017

Fielding Mellish? What Woody Allen film is that again?

Lol! Bananas

They will be shitting it about possibly getting arrested by 2046.

I haven't actually watched the Tsherassky as a whole for a while but I did then and holy fucking shit, it's amazing.

Eric H of this parish calls it one of the greatest horror movies ever made fwiw (apologies to Eric if I have that wrong)

Eh wrong thread obviously. Sorry. It's still a horror show.

Yes, appropriate..