The nation may survive, but the wound to hope and order will never fully heal - US elections 2016: the october surprises

Is this how every single election is going to be now from here on out? The same people supporting Trump will have another person to support the next time around

Naw, one of two things will happen:

1. Trump voters will be outnumbered to the point of irrelevance because Shillary is going to give voting rights to millions of illegals and refugees.

2. There may not even BE a next election. Trump voters will all be in their bunkers in Montana with three years' worth of canned food and ammo, waiting for the libs and brown people to succumb to the ravages of the Burning Times. Then the Patriots will emerge, and build a new civilization (based on FREEDOM) on the rubble of the old one.

There will definitely be another white supremacist candidate in 2020, but no way the GOP will allow that one to win the nom as easily as Trump did this one. There will be oppo, there will be smears. Ryan and Cruz will now how dangerous it is.

Is this how every single election is going to be now from here on out?

It partly depends on how badly Trump wets the bed on election day. The worse he is humiliated, the less likely his successor will attempt to sound or act like him. The GOP will retreat back to the 'safe' ground of dog whistles for the racists, groveling before the religious right and bootlicking the wealthy.

if he ran in 2020 Pence would have to answer for so much that he's saying in this campaign.

the dems can run for awhile on the own words of the republicans who gambled on trump this year

the own words? anyway

That's what they said in 2008, when the GOP was soul-searching for five minutes.

The 'center-right' of the GOP (which is still fairly extreme) hoped that Trump was an aberration, or that he could be controlled. If there's another one in four years, they'll fight nail and tooth. And everyone will be so damaged that Hillary easily wins re-election.

https://twitter.com/SopanDeb/status/787059051637137408

Dana Perino: "After 20 years of defending these guys” — she sliced the air with her hand — “done.”

Oh, OK, 20 years. 20 years! 20 years!!!!

Okay, someone talk me off a ledge here. Is this how every single election is going to be now from here on out? The same people supporting Trump will have another person to support the next time around, someone just as horrible who nevertheless yells a little less. Like Cruz or Pence. I'm not sure I can take it.

― Josh in Chicago, Friday, October 14, 2016 5:43 PM (eleven minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i think it may help to remember that these people have been voting in every election

This is why I want the oppo to keep coming. Not as punishment but as deterrent.

let's bear in mind that four years from now no one in America will pay any price whatsoever for having supported or abetted Trump.

xp

if he ran in 2020 Pence would have to answer for so much that he's saying in this campaign.

Ha ha, you give journalists so much undeserved credit. There probably won't even be newspapers anymore by 2020.

Trump, reportedly in 1999: "People want me to [run for president] all the time … I don’t like it. Can you imagine how controversial I’d be? You think about [Bill Clinton] and the women. How about me with the women? Can you imagine?"

especially within the GOP, where p much everyone is guilty to varying degrees. They will all act like it never happened, and all the losers who voted for Trump will feel the exact same way.

xp

https://twitter.com/SopanDeb/status/787059051637137408

― GUNSHOW POOPHOLE (Phil D.), Friday, October 14, 2016 11:55 PM (four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

last paragraph on this = very "blood runs cold"

i think they may pay a price, even if it's a small one. which might be enough to swing a few races.

i found that photographer's brother's facebook, check out some photos he posted:

https://www.facebook.com/daryl.davidoff?fref=ts

the American electorate is totally amnesiac. Did the GOP pay a price for the deeply unpopular move of shutting down the gov't/nearly defaulting on the nat'l debt in 2013? No they did not - in fact they were rewarded with congressional majorities in both houses less than a year later. GOP will bury Trump like he never happened and move on to trying to sell the same old shit, same as before.

xp

as a different british dude i would say trump was NOT well known in the uk in 1980-81: trump tower was only half built (it broke ground in 79, opened for business in 83) and i certainly didn't hear about him to register till i was reading the voice and spy in the late 80s... someone travelling to new york now and then probably could have come across his photo, but he definitely wasn't a regular name in the uk papers

the westminster sex parties story is still unfolding tbh -- some of it may be true (it's really murky stuff), whether or not gilberthorpe is a fantasist or paid fibber or whatever he is...

(many many x-posts as i was watching luke cage while writing)

GOP will win the midterm elections again in 2018. The crazies are just more fired up. But the problem is the GOP can't both stoke that craziness in midterms, and then ignore it in presidential elections. If they want to win the White House, at some point they'll have to deal with their most crazy voters. Not for the sake of the nation - they don't give a shit about the nation - but for their own careers.

private eye is down at the moment -- too many visitors? -- but there's a old PE story going round twitter abt gilberthorpe as fantastist (announcement in the papers of his marriage to a woman who didn't exist): annoyingly i can't re-find it, i thought charles aaron had retweeted it but apparently not

https://web.archive.org/web/20140812194717/http://www.private-eye.co.uk/sections.php?section_link=street_of_shame

thx ailsa, my fu is garbage at the moment

He's quite the piece of work

frederik b otm, sadly. the odds of dems taking the house this time are really low. And while I'm sure there'll be some hilarious drama around the speaker selection, by mid-2017 the house will consist of committee after committee investigating the email server and sundry other Clinton "scandals"

you don't think they'll go directly to impeachment? there will be a _lot_ of pressure on them to impeach.

I think they may be done with Benghazi by now. Only eight different committee investigations on that one.

W out a special prosecutor or justice dept support or any scared Dems that'll never happen. They'll probably still try tho.

xp There will lots of pressure to impeach, but they'll need some kind of plausible hook to hang it on that won't enrage 70% of the population for their trying to overturn a legitimate presidential election.

for whatever reason it feels like they took the L on benghazi after clinton's congressional testimony. obviously the fever swamp still brings it up, but it's been dwarfed by "emails" and "the foundation" throughout the campaign season

i wouldn't be shocked if they eventually impeached clinton, but even with their bloodthirsty base they'll probably still have to work up to it

also i feel like it's going to be leadership follies in the house gop for at least the first few months

German tabloids join in:

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/CuwR9F7W8AEAujm.jpg

oh yeah

xp There will lots of pressure to impeach, but they'll need some kind of plausible hook to hang it on that won't enrage 70% of the population for their trying to overturn a legitimate presidential election.

― a little too mature to be cute (Aimless)

oh, most americans already think she's a criminal. impeach her for the email server thing. they'll drag it out for as long as possible, fail, and clean up in 2018. won't do shit for them in the long term, but they don't have any concept of or interest in long-term survival at this point.

But there are 'center-right' politicians who do have long-term interests. As do many dark money givers, who wants lower taxes and less regulation and free trade, not deadlock and impeachment trials. There are powerful forces who wants something else.

xp not that the GOP is necessarily thinking strategically, but the earlier impeachment famously lost them seats in '98. Even if everyone hates HRC, it seems unlikely to me that immediate impeachment would lead the GOP to clean up in 2018.

Idg this weird niche of prominent Indo-American Republicans.

https://twitter.com/ArifCRafiq/status/786257727995645952

Republican Hindu Coalition ldr on his support for Trump: “There is an elephant — or, I should correct myself — there is a camel in the room”

I know Jindal, D'Souza and Haley are Christian but a lot of NRIs find common cause in small government, an emphasis on personal / family responsibility and hating Muslims.

xp not that the GOP is necessarily thinking strategically, but the earlier impeachment famously lost them seats in '98. Even if everyone hates HRC, it seems unlikely to me that immediate impeachment would lead the GOP to clean up in 2018.

― intheblanks

yeah and going to war in iraq didn't do much to help ghwb win re-election, and yet...

seriously, where are the leaders in the gop? where is the common sense? there is none, _particularly_ not in the house.

Huh. Enjoying the image results for https://www.google.com/search?q=schlammschlacht

xp i don't know if i follow your point about bush I. I don't necessarily disagree that the house will eventually impeach clinton on some ridiculous charge, i just don't think they're going to do it immediately, specifically because of their lack of leadership, in addition to it not being in the interests of the tea party/freedom caucus donor base (Koch network, etc)

in addition to the likelihood of having a democratic senate, something the mid-90s house didn't have to contend with

where is the common sense?

i think there are a handful that can look & play the part (eg Ryan), prob just biding their time. rosiest case i can see for the party is that instead of getting perma-tarred w/ Trump, the "reasonable" dudes who clucked their tongues while offering a mealy-mouthed endorsement will eventually get rehabbed the MSM (gotta have that horse race!). they'll try to look adult while exploiting the dissatisfaction/ outright disdain of voters who voted HRC out of fear of Trump.

this, of course, does not consider demographic changes afoot, nor the GOP's seeming unwillingness to piss off the white nationalists who've infiltrated their base

the GOP's seeming unwillingness to piss off the white nationalists who've infiltrated always been their base

can't really argue with that

but i guess they used to do a better job of keepin em in the basket

or during my lifetime, anyway

most americans already think she's a criminal. impeach her for the email server thing.

I doubt that the majority thinks she's a criminal, even if the number who think it is substantial. otoh, the email server thing has been thoroughly aired before the election, so when she wins there will be an indisputable majority who voted for her and want her to be president, regardless of the email server. Ignoring their wishes would be perilous. Voters get very pissed off when their expressed wishes during an election are treated with contempt.

i feel like there is actually a ton of good will toward her right now. she's running her campaign in a very responsible way -- never taking trump's bait, letting that campaign destroy itself