london

You are lucky with the exchange rate right now. Your mother will also probably kill you if you don't do the Chelsea Physic Garden (bonus: uniformed Chelsea Pensioners).

If you're oriented east, try the Ace Hotel in Shoreditch - very chichi hipster, but don't hold that against it. I like Hoi Polloi, the restaurant in it.

The Zetter and the Rosewood hotels are central - the former is modern, the latter is in an ornate, refurbished old insurance HQ (you'll never believe insurers could be that baroque) with about five good restaurants inside, and they have a hotel dog you can borrow (I've met this golden lab being taken for runs in Lincoln's Inn Fields right behind the hotel).

Try the Mr and Mrs Smith group of hotels for cozy nightcap style accomodation in various neighbourhoods, and make sure you eat at St John.

Second Golborne and Goldfinger, it's an ace spot.

It's not a garden, but I highly recommend the canals - you can walk from Paddington to Hackney along Regent's Canal and check out several different neighbourhoods and parks along the way, or cycle/walk up the River Lea from Leamouth through Hackney marshes to Lea Valley Park.

Chelsea Physic Garden and nearby Battersea Park both worth strolling. Hampton Court gardens are near-ish to Kew too. Richmond Park has amazing views.

I work near the Zetter - nice hotel but I wouldn't recommend it as a base as it's not well connected.

We booked the Rosewood, it looks amazing.

Any theater nerds out there? I'm partial to small-medium size venues (my favorite in DC is 200 seats). Open to anything that isn't a musical.

Do check out the John Soane museum - it's just by the rosewood

It's also worth checking out St James Park, which can be combined with a visit to main sites of Westminster (Big Ben, Buckingham Palace, Trafalgar Square, Houses of Parliament).

If you're feeling energetic, it's possible to walk through 3 or 4 parks in Central London almost continuously (St James, Green Park, Hyde Park, Kensington Gardens) - an amazing mount of green space in the centre of the city. For example, it's possible to walk from St James Park through to Notting Hill (where Portobello Market is) through these Parks.

Other suggestions, it's worth a visit to the South Bank to eat and/or drink alongside the Thames and walk a bit. In July, might be best in the evening.

If it's just 4 days, I'd personally concentrate on the main sights (mainly central London), with maybe a day out to Kew Gardens (combine it with Richmond Hill/Richmond Park or Hampton Court Palace). Kew Green (just by Kew Gardens)is also an amazing exquisite example of a classic English green with cricket pitch, church and beautiful houses.

If you do visit Portobello Rd market, it's not much of a stretch to Holland Park, as recommended above with superb formal gardens, Japanese garden and peacocks.

xp and the Hunterian, across the Fields. Another gallery rec when you're in the West End, my favourite in London and always near-deserted is the Wallace Collection, which has Canalettos, Poussins, the Laughing Cavalier and a huge collection of arms and armour, porcelain etc. It also has a restaurant in its covered internal courtyard.

Re:restaurants, the really high end ones will serve you incredible food but can also exude a particular kind of joylessness, a couple of the Michelin starred ones have such a hushed, rarified atmosphere it can feel like eating in a museum. Having said that if you're looking for both a romantic meal and a total once-a-year blowout then I'd go with Alain Ducaisse at the Dorchester or one of Gordon Ramsay's places (I've only been to Petrus but that is excellent).

If you want somewhere that will serve you amazing food but also feels fun and a bit more casual I'd always recommend St John (unless one of you is vegetarian) or one of the Social places (Pollen Street/Social Eating House/Berners Tavern). The latter has more spectacular surroundings and as a bonus you can go to the punch room upstairs and have a literal bowl full to drink.

There's a lot to be said for spending an evening in Clerkenwell - the Zetter Townhouse is the best cocktail bar in London. That and then St John would be as good an evening out as I could recommend in London.

It also has to be said that you don't HAVE to spend a load of money to eat well in London. Going down the Time Out best restaurants list will provide you with ample options but braving the queues and going down to Tayyabs in Whitechapel (or Lahore Kebab House round the corner) with a bottle of your own booze is my standard go to recommendation there.

on that budget for a hotel - maybe somewhere like the rosewood in holborn? i walk past it every day and it's beautiful. also that area is extremely close to everything central, and you'll have a wealth of brilliant restaurants nearby.

perhaps zetter townhouse would also be good - i've never stayed there but if the rooms are like the cocktail bar i assume it's great. there are two now - i'd say the one in farringdon is a better location.

oh lol i see someone already recommended both of these. good work guys. SUZY OTM.

so if you're at the rosewood, go to barrafina on drury lane. tapas. the best. maybe great queen street too, on great queen street. dunno if you want a more high-end blowout "event" type meal - barrafina is sort of that but it is a tapas bar. i'm not as well versed in the 10 course tasting menu type places. i suspect matt might be? xpost.

for theatre i'd prob recommend something like the young vic or the national theatre, not reinventing the wheel but you'll see good stuff there. the young vic is smallish and usually has interesting youth-orientated takes on classics. if you do go to the young vic a good night out would be to eat at the anchor and hope restaurant which is beside it - quite casual but one of the first gastropubs and still one of the best imo.

second st john for sure. if you don't manage to go at night (to the one on st john street) maybe go there in the day and have a snack at the bar.

Wallace Collection is great, and can also easily be combined with a walk up Marylebone HIgh St up across Baker St into Regents Park (yet more beautiful gardens and a rose garden to die for in summer).

A couple of very personal views:

- East London- the elephant in the room. Don't be talked into spending all your time drinking or hanging out in east London on the grounds that it's somehow the 'real' London or more authentic. Yes, it can be great to drink in a grimy Bethnal Green boozer, or sit among the barbecue fumes on London Fields, but if you've only got 4 days it's good to see the main sites.

- Cycling: can easily be hired and are great for getting around the main parks or along the Thames embankment, but I personally don't feel safe on the main roads and wouldn't risk it for a 4 day holiday.

Also (seriously) think about how much you REALLY want to see inside Westminster Abbey/the Tower of London/wherever. When you've taken travel and queuing into account it's quite easy to lose half your trip on this stuff and it probably won't be the best use of time. If I had to do one it would probably be climbing to the top of St Paul's Cathedral, although don't plan on doing anything energetic afterwards.

And if you're staying in Holborn, spend an hour or so wandering around the winding passages of the Inns of Court, which also has some lovely gardens. If you start at Grays Inn and walk down towards the river from there, through Lincolns Inn and Temple you'll see a London that has barely changed for centuries.

Also at risk of sounding like a broken record, a round-trip boat from Westminster Pier (or wherever) out towards Greenwich and back won't take you very long and will give you a view of most of the big sights while being more pleasant than a corny open-top bus ride. Also if you get off at Greenwich and wander up to the top of the hill by the observatory you'll see not just an excellent park but also the best natural view of the city anywhere in London (people will say Primrose Hill but those people are wrong). That might be stretching it for a four-day trip though.

Definitely visit both Madame Tussauds and the London Dungeon.

Seriously though, Greenwich and the Royal Observatory are well worth a trip if you don't mind a bit of walking. And to be less partisan about my corner of London, you might also enjoy a stroll up through Hampstead Garden Suburb up to the Free Church/St Jude's Church, especially if you want a flavour of the arcane powers which preside yet over this city, or a walk along Regent's Canal if you want to explore East London in style, with a possible Docklands Light Railway tie-in (you can sit at the front! It goes to Greenwich!) - then there are the Green Chain walks, backstreets Bloomsbury, the South Bank.......

Maybe keep it simple tho

Aberdeen Angus steakhouse opposite Leicester square tube stn is a must-visit

lol not really

amble through leicester square on a saturday night and soak up the quaint atmosphere.

walk along Regent's Canal if you want to explore East London in style

Not sure 'style' is quite the right word. Ready to dodge the cyclist who come zooming up behind. I'd also stick to a selected well-populated stretch and combine with Victoria Park maybe.

A great many London ILXors work in Holborn and I live about 200m from the Rosewood.

It would be almost more worthwhile to have a FAP at Tayyabs or Lahore Kebab than at a pub, just sayin' like.

Canal walks: either go from Little Venice to Ladbroke Grove or Angel Islington to Hackney Wick (lots of canalside cafés on the latter walk).

Restaurant wise, Tayyabs/Needoo/Lahore pretty essential, St John is good but I'd go for Quality Chop House. Similar(ish) style of food but more interesting in my opinion, and less ambitious pricing. Also the interior is one of the oldest in a restaurant in London, I'd say it's a must-visit. I'd also very strongly recommend Clove Club for something more creative (and expensive).

Also on a clear night cocktails at Dandelyan and/or dinner at the Blueprint Café for views along the river which are hard to beat.

If you go to Kew do grab lunch at the Glasshouse. It's not especially exciting but the quality is really really high and it has a cosseted/nothing bad ever happens here/ladies who lunch/home counties vibe which none of the other places mentioned so far really cover.

Oh yeah the Clove Club really is excellent, one of the best meals I've had in London in the last couple of years. For similar food at less crazy prices the room upstairs at the Ten Bells is also great, and there's tourist interest of a sort too (basically Jack the Ripper guff).

The only thing I don't like about the Clove Club is their ticketed booking system, which dements me.

Also in Shoreditch, I was there last weekend and Lyles is really nice - not to turn this into london restaurants

You are welcome to turn this into london restaurants with a large helping of gardens and walks!

This is all really great info. For the record, Parliament/Big Ben/Tower of London stuff isn't really my thing. I mean I've lived in Washington, DC for over a decaded and have not been to 9 out of 10 Historically Important Buildings here in my own town. Likewise museums; I do like a nice smaller gallery (a good rainy day activity), but in general I'd prefer to spend 4 days wandering about on foot.

One super touristy thing I am contemplating is Hyde Park on horseback, unless you strongly advise against this as utter nonsense. I'm a horsey gal it may be the only time I can convince my spouse to consider an equine adventure. We have some friends who did it and they had good feedback.

Restaurant choices are going to be so hard!!! On that note, do you think it is OK if I e-mail the Rosewood some preferences and ask them to do the reserving for me? I dunno if that is a British thing or an American thing, the outsourcing of reservation-making?

I'm popping over the london restaurants thread now!

Is Borough Market something to be avoided? I really love markets but maybe there is a lower-key, less touristy alternative?

I am crazy for cheese and may have to seek out a cheese-intensive lunch somewhere.

On a Sunday, there's Marylebone Farmer's Market and this place:

http://www.lafromagerie.co.uk/cafe-menus

I think that's definitely an American thing, I'd never even heard of it until now!

Borough Market should be fine during the working day I'd think - avoid at lunchtime (12:00-14:00) and you should be fine.

I'd get the hotel to reserve/do the admin for any nice restaurant that takes a credit card number when people book.

UUuuuuuugh I so don't want to play the reservations game, but I will if I have to.

OK so current list of restaurant contenders is: St John, Barrafina (no reservations, so we'll try for a walk in), Clove Club, Anchor and Hope, Ledbury, Dinner, Petrus, Ducasse, The Square, Fera, Quality Chop House, Palomar, Honey and Co. Plus I gotta fit in an Indian meal--chowhound mentions Dishroom, Trishna, Gykhana--any thoughts?

Too many restaurants, not enough days :(

xpost Thank you, Suzy. I'll try to narrow down to two "blow-out" meals and ask for reservation help.

Barrafina rewards those who queue at around noon - there are obnoxious execs that send their PAs down to save them a place, so the key is to beat them to the front.

Borough Market is a bit crazed - would avoid on weekends as in firm Not Fun territory but weekdays are ok. London is generally a bit shit with food markets as destinations like in Montreal or Paris or whatnot, but they're worth a visit if you're nearby. (Personally I prefer wandering round Selfridge's market or the mahoosive Whole Foods in Kensington but, er, they're not holiday winners.)

Bars - I have hearing damage and like quiet spots - the Connaught and Langham are both have great cocktail menus. I love Duke's in St James which is vv old school (Ian Fleming's old bar) but it's intimate, the staff are friendly, and there's usually lots of interesting non-scumbag posh people to eavesdrop on. I also like Heights in Oxford Circus, which is a merely average bar but has a superb views over London and the new BBC building, especially in the loos. If you can stand it, the Centerpoint bar near your hotel also has an excellent London view, but don't stay for long (and you need to book in advance).

Duke's sounds like my kind of place, for sure.

Any superb coffee near Rosewood? I'm going to need it after all these cocktails.

The Espresso Room is my local, and is still pretty good even though the owner changed last year. I also go to Fleet River Bakery which is about 100m from the Rosewood (and they do nice coffee in the Holborn Delicatessen onsite).

I probably wouldn't make Dishoom a priority, especially as you can't book. I hear very good things about Gymkhana and Trishna but they are edging towards one off blowout territory.

I would also avoid anything with a no-bookings policy, which rules out Dishoom. This does include the Anchor and Hope BUT that is basically a pub and it's easy enough to drink in relative comfort if there isn't a table. (NB I love the Anchor and Hope).

Booking most of the other places online should be pretty straightforward.

Maybe don't go to Borough Market, or if you do, prioritise going to Maltby Street and/or Druid Street market first. Better food. Borough has more of the quality of an event but the cooking at the food stalls is p shit.

I wouldn't avoid anything with a no-bookings policy - not least Barrafina or Anchor and Hope, which are pretty easy to get into. And make it easy to wait as you say. The no-bookings hell is more like burger restaurant du jour.

The queue in Barrafina is like "grand I'll have a glass of wine", unless it's manic, which it doesn't tend to be - the Drury Lane one is p easy to get into anytime at lunch, and before 1930 or so on weekdays. Even after that it's not bad. Barrafina is actually really nice for a weekend lunch imo - it has a very bright and relaxed feeling.

I wouldn't specifically go to that area to go to Anchor and Hope but given it's beside the Young Vic which was my theatre recommendation, then I probably would.

If you do end up at Maltby Street, there are a few good restaurants there. A small St John, a tapas bar called Tozino, and a wine bar called 40 Maltby Street. There are also many many breweries around that area which open on a Saturday, if either of you are into beer. If you only tried one, I'd go to the Kernel. They get a bit overcrowded but it can be a fun thing to do.

Personally I prefer wandering round Selfridge's market or the mahoosive Whole Foods in Kensington but, er, they're not holiday winners.)

lol I was actually going to say maybe go to Selfridges, I mean if you're on the kind of holiday where shopping might appeal. Also Liberty. Beautiful building and a nice shop.

I wouldn't specifically go to that area to go to Anchor and Hope but given it's beside the Young Vic which was my theatre recommendation, then I probably would.

Or if they're on the South Bank, from which it's a short walk, especially given most South Bank food options are best avoided.

It should be pointed out that if you're in Holborn you're in really excellent walking territory, right between the City and the West End, with Bloomsbury to the north and the aforementioned walk down to the river southwards. In fact you're really well placed for a lot of zone one stuff. Bloomsbury especially can be quite peaceful and worth a wander round if things are getting hectic.

yeah otm. you can walk everywhere from there. another recommendation - i'd probably go to the delaunay or its small adjoining cafe - it's very old school, viennese themed but essentially quite british, brilliant service. particularly good for breakfast.

If you're around that area and i'm in the UK, i'd be happy to take you up to the top floor of my office which has a killer view of London from St Paul's to the Houses of Parliament, though might be slight redundant if you're also doing the London Eye, etc.

Oh god yeah, definitely go to the Delaunay for breakfast.

It's bourgeoise middle class question time: anyone recommend a cleaner? SE or central London (Waterloo to be precise).

Eating breakfast at the Delaunay is middle-class bourgeoise; you're about to cross the rubicon into the decadence of conspicous consumption status signalling.

henry hoover dot jpg

I can recommend you a tutor as well

The discrete charm of the ilx urban haute bourgeoisie.

everyone i know has a cleaner p much regardless of wealth - if anything it's because they're all in flatshares and it stops people arguing, or not cleaning.

knew you guys would pull through for me <3, tbh i have happily resisted crossing this rubicon for the longest time but circumstances now make supporting the exploitative part time low wage economy the preferential option.

...xp