a clown car full of millionaires: the 2016 presidential primary thread

What are these guys going to be debating, anyway? The Iran deal, the Affordable Care Act, uh...

Immigration! Not that I'm aware of any points of contention among them.

Feel like "debate" in this situation means just "guaranteed airtime" so each person marches up and gets the chance to demonstrate what kind of public speaker they are, and party/media has official opportunity to muse on whether they seem remotely viable as a candidate. "Pageant" would be a better word really. Like suddenly after this event the media will be ready to evaluate their prospects as if something has Happened and their "performance" can be evaluated, which was somehow not possible watching them deliver the same canned soundbites in their stump speeches. But all results (people actually quitting the race) will be postponed until the first primaries anyway, unless the sheer stench of loserdom marks some people so much that they get it through their heads it's over and quit. The ten-person threshold might do more than the actual contents of the event.

I guess that, since it's going to be treated as an event, candidates will be consciously doing things to try and get that 1 or 2-point boost, relative to each other, in the hopes of "emerging" as the "leader" of their particular bracket, which helps them remain plausible longer in the race and soak up more donor money. Particularly among the low-tier wingnuts, they all have to be figuring that if it was just down to one low-tier wingnut, it'd be them, and depending when Trump quits, they're suddenly a competitive top-tier player. So people are going to be desperately trying to score a big memorable line or strike a chord, since with ten people nobody's getting a lot of air time. I imagine this will actually be even more desperate in the third-stringer all-losers debate, where everybody has to be figuring that if they "win" that, then they'll naturally be the wild card to step in and keep the main lineup crowded when someone drops out. All pure horse-race sideshow stuff but, hey, clown car. Not that I expect it to become a really substantive nuanced conversation once it drops down to 4-5 of these guys more clearly embodying a choice between standard 'types.'

Jeb does seem to be playing on "hey remember that mess last time, wouldn't it be a better idea just to get a front runner coronation this time after just the first clown wave" - while not reminding people that last time the eventual front runner was a malfunctioning fleshbot.

speaking of trump and reagan (and nixon):

CHUCK TODD: And, again, I know we're going to get into a lot more issues with you in a couple weeks. But I want to ask you about Black Lives Matter. The latest shooting of a white police officer shooting an unarmed black man. Do you see this as a crisis in America?

DONALD TRUMP: It's a massive crisis. It's a double crisis. What's happening and people. You know, I look at things. And I see it on television. And some horrible mistakes are made. At the same time, we have to give power back to the police because crime is rampant. And I'm a big person that believes in very big-- you know, we need police.

And we need protection. Look, I look at some of the cities. You look at Baltimore. You look at so many different places in this country. Chicago. Certain areas of Chicago. They need strong police protection. And those police can do the job. But their jobs are being taken away from them. At the same time, you've got these other problems. And there's no question about it. They are problems. There is turmoil in our country.

CHUCK TODD: Do you understand why African Americans don't trust the police right now?

DONALD TRUMP: Well, I can certainly see it when I see what's going on. But at the same time, we have to give power back to the police because we have to have law and order. Hundreds of killings are in Baltimore. Hundreds of killings are in Chicago. And New York is not doing so great in terms of that front. And so many other cities.

We have to give strength and power back to the police. And you're always going to have mistakes made. And you're always going to have bad apples. But you can't let that stop the fact that police have to regain some control of this tremendous crime wave and killing wave that's happening in this country.

It's a massive crisis.
It's a double crisis.
What's happening and people.
You know, I look at things.
And I see it on television.

This reminded me of David Byrne lyrics.

kind of a don delillo vibe, the repetition

dude is talkin like it's death wish 2 and shit out there

At the same time, you've got these other problems. And there's no question about it. They are problems.

"i like this trump guy. he sees the world the way i do, sees things that no one else ever points out."

thanks Donald

http://www.theonion.com/blogpost/somebody-should-do-something-about-all-the-problem-11018

Dr. Casino currently bringing the awesome on this thread - Reagan fanfic, yes. Pageant, yes. Re: Ryan, "college-debate-team" is perfect. (Note that Cruz is currently occupying this slot, and he has more actual college-debate-team chops than anybody. (Good luck with that, Sen. Smugface. We'll see how far it gets you with the public.))

What's happening and people

This could be fun!

"Beau was losing his nouns and the right side of his face was partially paralyzed. But he had a mission: He tried to make his father promise to run, arguing that the White House should not revert to the Clintons and that the country would be better off with Biden values."

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/02/opinion/sunday/maureen-dowd-joe-biden-in-2016-what-would-beau-do.html?ref=opinion&_r=0

"Biden values"?

http://o.onionstatic.com/images/17/17948/16x9/750.jpg?4525

oh good Maureen Dowd here to explain how the conventional wisdom works

lol

I was near a tv showing the NBC nightly news yesterday, and I'm kind of in awe of how useless national news is. They had several minutes of commentary that was basically quoting Maureen Dowd and the WSJ about Biden and the current presidential candidate landscape, then basically went "hmm."

I guess if your broadcast is just pulling a quote from Maureen Dowd and displaying it on tv, you should reconsider whether you need to broadcast anything.

they're totally irrelevant and they know it

new poll
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CLfiprmXAAEkXXN.png

list needs something, maybe a half dozen more candidates

fwiw for people who care about my personal experience in the primary season i have a thread on 77. sorry for the 77ness, but i may end up incriminating friends and neighbors and don't need it searchable.

you're Tim Pawlenty?

MAYBE

oh TPaws

"Biden values" include Amtrak and unwanted shoulder massages

and putting everything on a credit card and paying 96 percent interest.

Graham polling worse than Santorum = lol

if only Graham could win over that one voter

Kinda hope Trump goes after Cruz in the debate for having been born in Canada, even though Cruz has been one of Trump's most willing defenders. Wanna see Trump sidepoint with his thumb and make a "get a load of this guy" face.

this face?
https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fi.huffpost.com%2Fgen%2F3176536%2Fimages%2Fo-DONALD-TRUMP-facebook.jpg&f=1

still trying to figure out why cruz is one of trump's biggest supporters, because trump's reign of terror would seem to steal from cruz's target audience, more than anyone else. maybe the idea is that when trump finally pushes it too far and collapses, the trump crowd will migrate to cruz, and he might even get some reciprocal support from trump? i dunno.

That's the only thing that makes sense.

xp YES

1) I suspect Maureen Dowd hallucinated her entire column out of pure Clinton hate;
2) Don't take political advice from someone with brain cancer.

o rly?

http://i.imgur.com/pONcaE9.jpg

Graham polling worse than Santorum = lol

Santorum was on some Sunday news show and I almost (but not quite) felt a little sorry for him, because the entire interview was about how he's not going to be in the debates. He tried to spin back to his successes four years ago, and it seemed like even HE'S not enthused this go 'round.

I still cant believe Santorum ended up the last idiot standing before Romney

I believe Karl Malone is correct - much of the Trump support goes to Cruz if/when Trump drops.

Because FIGHTER.

Saith the dextrosphere: the BASE wants a FIGHTER, not a NAMBY-PAMBY RINO. Someone who will STAND UP to the lamestream media and the spineless GOP establishment leadership. ELEVENTY. They've TRIED the milquetoast moderates - McCain, Romney - and now they want REAL. They want a FIGHTER.

capitalization sic

maybe they should recruit Christina Aguilera

someone who's a BIG person who believes in VERY BIG

I still cant believe Santorum ended up the last idiot standing before Romney

hey i voted for him in TN's open primary

Christina Aguilera / Katy Perry 2016

Beau Biden working for Sanders on his deathbed

Please splain to a political dum dum how this benefits Bernie

just guessin' really, as hrc and joeb are cut from the same "we know how DC works" cheesecloth

all the discussion around Biden has to do with how Hillary is looking p weak at the moment - he's not being drafted to counter Bernie, he's being drafted as an alternative to Hillary: a "mainstream" Dem that's a known quantity, broader appeal, more predictable/conventional policy positions etc. He isn't a wildcard like Bernie, and he isn't stiff as a board like Hillary, the appeal is obvious. He'll cut into Hillary's support, not Bernie's.

and both voted to authorize W in Iraq

xp

that being the case, Biden undercutting Hillary is good for Bernie - now there's two candidates undermining her candidacy

and both voted to authorize W in Iraq

I know this is likely to never really be an issue with the electorate, or to come up v much in the campaigns, but it really is a litmus test for measuring the venal stupidity of mainstream candidates imo. Just think, if it comes down to JEB! and Hillary then we are back to having two morons who supported that war as the frontrunners, neither of whom will be willing to cop to the cynical calculus that led to that support.