hey gawker dudes. what the fuck is wrong with you?

idk i dont listen to the radio

it was all you cant do this yourself

wld be a good protection racket

imo the right thing to do is create a public persona that is completely ridiculous, then people have trouble trying to pin malicious thoughts on you

operate celebrity parody accounts exclusively

you're defending gawker because they're taking down "amoral careerist dbags". that gets about an 8 in the mental gymnastics competition.

is 8 a good score in mental gymnastics im unfamiliar with the competition rules tbh

who is attacking gawker itself? I thought we were talking about a point made on the site right now

Definitely think you guys should read the book first - covers lots of these points; many of these things are way more complicated (like the Adria Richards thing) than 'turning off notifications'

afaict the conversation went something like 'gawker going after this coachella kid is ridiculous' and then 'but jon ronson sorta defended jonah lehrer' which idk i think i'm maybe missing a step in the middle

many of these things are way more complicated (like the Adria Richards thing) than 'turning off notifications'

― Your Ribs are My Ladder, Tuesday, April 14, 2015 11:20 AM (6 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the getting fired piece is such a hook for the whole argument otherwise its just like oh no a million ppl are yelling at me on twitter! turn off notifications bro

― lag∞n, Tuesday, April 14, 2015 11:05 AM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

fwiw i have read a least a couple ronson articles on the topic and i follow him on twitter i dont think i shd be forced to read his book after already being pretty thoroughly exposed to his pov re this

also feel free to offer up these supposed complications yrself lol

Ah right (x-post)

Haha 'forced' - it's a pretty great read, even when you're disagreeing with it, is all

ya i like his work quite a bit but i in this case i dont think his approach is really appropriate, this doc of his is a stone classic imho

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAMIvDmWbQs

i mean jonah lehrer did not make mistakes he was a compulsive self promoter borderline conman, and ronson really thought this guy was not gonna get a second chance, this might not be the social commentator we need

― lag∞n, Tuesday, April 14, 2015 3:39 PM (46 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

not to mention the information that he was getting a second chance was already available!

― lag∞n, Tuesday, April 14, 2015 3:40 PM (45 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it just didnt fit his narrative of all powerful mobs taking mostly innocent ppl down

― lag∞n, Tuesday, April 14, 2015 3:40 PM (44 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

But all this is wrong; Ronson talks in some detail about Lehrer's existing book deal in his book, and that it's due to be published right after his own

Not picking a fight, truly - just don't know what you mean that his approach isn't "appropriate"

ha then why was he so worried abt him getting a second chance! and like obvs guys like that always get a second chance, the mob is actually much less powerful than the jonah lehrers of the world

cutesy schticky reductive seeks to personalize systemic issues xp

I could tell Sam Biddle was finding it startling too - like when you shoot a gun and the power of it sends you recoiling violently backwards. He said he was ‘surprised’ to see how quickly Justine was destroyed: ‘I never wake up and hope I get to fire someone that day - and certainly never hope to ruin anyone’s life.’ Still, his email ended, he had a feeling she’d be ‘fine eventually, if not already. Everyone’s attention span is so short. They’ll be mad about something new today.’

is "they'll be fine" gawker editorial policy?

or is it just the 'unwritten' culture of gawker to make the writers feel better about being such creeps?

"I actually want to live in a world where Jonah (Lehrer) should get another chance" is the quote?

cutesy schticky reductive seeks to personalize systemic issues

Bbbbbut that's like 92% of Ronson's work!

yeah but when youre laughing at conspiracy nuts its more appropriate imho

This is the complete quote:

When you talk about folks like Jonah Lehrer, Mike Daisey — people who committed actual transgressions, and for whom it might be hard to ever trust them to do nonfiction again maybe — how do they fit into your whole theory of public shaming in 2015?

I totally get what you’re saying and I think maybe if I hadn’t gone down the road that I’ve gone down the last few years, and met Jonah and met Michael Moynihan and met other recipients of other shamings where the transgressions were less serious, like Lindsey, I would probably feel the same way. But honestly I think it’s okay to humanize Jonah without exonerating him, and I actually want to live in a world where Jonah should get another chance, even though I really understand that he made some really stupid mistakes, both in the transgressions and also in trying to cover them up. To say he was his own worst enemy would be putting it mildly. But I still want to live in a world where people are allowed reentry into society, whatever they did. That’s just the world I want to live in.

you gonna get fired

here are the second chance quotes i can find from the book

Jonah was offering the same dismal prediction about his future as Michael and Andrew Wylie had. He was foreseeing a lifetime of ruin. Imagine being thirty-one in a country that venerates redemption and second chances, and being convinced your tragedy has no happy ending. But I thought he was being too pessimistic. Surely after paying some penance, after spending some time in the wilderness, he could convince his readers and peers that he could change his ways. He could find a way back in. I mean: we weren’t monsters.

Jonah was saying that spending time with him would ruin me in some unexpected way. ‘Well, that’s not going to happen to me!’ I laughed.

‘Then you’ll be the first,’ he said.

As he said this, a bolt of panic shot into me. It was a frightening thing for someone to say. Still, I kept trying to convince him, on and on, but each line of reasoning seemed to make him more anguished, as if I were a siren trying to lure him to the rocks with my song of possible redemption. He said his worst days were when he allowed himself to hope for a second chance. The best were when he knew it was over forever and his destruction was necessary as a deterrent to others.

Jonah was at the Knight Foundation lectern, standing very still. I was watching at home on my computer. In his old lucrative public-speaking days his voice would rise and fall to emphasize this word or that, but now he sounded flat, like a scared child in front of the class. This was the most important speech of his life. He was begging for a second chance. As if things weren’t stressful enough for him, the Knight Foundation had decided to erect a giant-screen live Twitter feed behind his head. Anyone watching from home could tweet their ongoing opinion of Jonah’s request for forgiveness using the hashtag #infoneeds and their comment would automatically appear, in real time and in gigantic letters, right next to Jonah’s face.

at least in the emily gould era, say what you will about how unethical they were, they pretty much went after celebrities and not private citizens (as far as i remember). i assume everyone has seen this classic video from the gould days?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-avakrRUaU

feel like mistakes is a way too kind reading of what lehrer did, his entire approach was to bend the whole concept of non fiction and journalism in order to advance his career, like there was nothing besides that

ironically being a terrible science reporter who reaches ridiculous conclusions to make his writing more interesting is not a fireable offense just ask malcolm gladwell or the freaknomics guys

ya i like his work quite a bit but i in this case i dont think his approach is really appropriate, this doc of his is a stone classic imho

this and secret rules of the world are way way more interesting than anything he's done of late. he was more interesting before he got big in america.

secret rulers*

o fine blame america

i apologise for my post - thank you for calling me out on it.

please can a mod delete.

too late my boss has seen it

my parents just received death threats

on the plus side i am writing an article for the new yorker about my experiences

more justice goodly done

ironically being a terrible science reporter who reaches ridiculous conclusions to make his writing more interesting is not a fireable offense just ask malcolm gladwell or the freaknomics guys

Gladwell and Broken Windows covered extensively in the book!

hey max. what the fuck is wrong with you?

thats good but he still gets 200k (made this number up) per speaking engagement xp

i caught an interview w/ gladwell on, idk fareed zakaria's show maybe? where he was saying that americans should probably cheat more on taxes bc we'd get away with it, but we're just too darn honest.

America should torrent more Malcolm Gladwell ebooks

Stop and frisk continued through the 2000s and into the 2010s and one by-product of it was that some repeatedly frisked young people sought revenge in online activism - by joining 4chan. It wasn’t only Mercedes who told me this. Soon after we met I had a cloak-and-dagger meeting outside a subway station in Queens with a 4chan friend of hers. A battered car pulled up. The driver was young, white, of Spanish heritage and wore a big crucifix. I still don’t know his real name. He said I should call him by his Internet name: Troy.

He took me to a cafe where he grumbled about how things weren’t like they used to be, about the good old days when you couldn’t leave your mobile phone on a cafe table around here without it being stolen. I told Troy that the good old days sounded terrible to me, but he explained that with gentrification comes collateral damage - constant stop and frisks of any young people who don’t look like preppy hipsters: ‘Going to the store, coming home from school, ruining your whole day. It’s disgusting. It’s dangerous to walk the borders around here.’ It was these police inequities that compelled Troy to join 4chan, he told me.

I keep expecting an epic Gladwell takedown story to come up, but it never comes.

its been tried but he always responds its just a bit of fun and besides criticism is bad and who can disagree that fun is good and criticism is bad

https://ourbadmedia.wordpress.com/2014/12/11/tipping-points-malcolm-gladwell-could-use-a-few/
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/115164/malcolm-gladwells-pseudo-profundity
http://blog.chabris.com/2013/10/why-malcolm-gladwell-matters-and-why.html
http://www.salon.com/2013/12/16/hack_list_no_10_malcolm_gladwell/
http://shameproject.com/report/malcolm-gladwell-unmasked-life-work-of-americas-most-successful-propagandist/

gladwell takedown stories is its own cottage industry

lol at shame project

yeah, totally, but they never stick. I thought the debunking of the "koreans can't fly planes because of their culture" story would get more traction.

I don't know about epic takedown, but he calls him out on some stuff here too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LktwDI6JqO0