Better Call Saul

that's what she... oh never mind

Lydia wasn't a "rogue housewife"

yeah, this was pretty good. i really liked that there wasn't much expository dialogue - the characters' interactions were enough to fill in the blanks.

i wonder if the black and white photography in the omaha sequence was a deliberate homage to / joke about alexander payne's nebraska?

were the flash forwarded sequences in BB b/w?

Did 'Chuck' ever get mentioned in BB? I take it he's Jimmy's brother? Or uncle?

So glad this isn't just a knockabout sitcom about a hapless lawyer though. I was always a Saul agnostic when he was in BB as he stood right on the edge between comic foil and slapstick sitcom buffoon. Plus it took me ages to stop thinking of him as Gob in Arrested Development, but as a lawyer instead of a magician. I like how Jimmy cuts a bittersweet, really quite dualised and tragic figure. One minute he's walking around in his suit, acting as though he owns the place; next he's returning home to an absolute hovel after having been talked down to and kicked in the nuts by life... It continues the double-act of WW/Heisenberg in that respect.

i might be out on this already, the tone just feels off to me; I bet there will be some inspired stuff but not sure I want to invest ~14 hrs or w/e

There will be loads of bb characters in this. Of course as Saul goodman he'll have good reason to come up against every scumbag in Albuquerque, and cops too

I mean, this is a breaking bad spinoff about Walter White's wacky lawyer; its very existence is fan service, however much prestigey ~darkness~ they inject into it.

I'm down cause I thought odenkirk was brilliant in bb

i loved the cold open so much

I enjoyed this a fair bit, just because Saul is a great character and it's good to spend more time with him. Wish the Tuco reveal hadn't come so early, because it's a fairly short line from him to Gus Fring, and really if this show is going to succeed on its own terms it needs to take time to do a Frasier and build its own universe of characters. The scenes with Chuck suggested that's in the plan, even if he felt miscast - I struggled to see him and Saul as actually related.

It's also showing us at least two Walter White-style descents into the underworld, and I love seeing people way way over their heads.

Like I think a constant parade of "hey look, it's Badger!" gratuitous fanwank would be the worst approach they could take and I more or less trust Gilligan not to take that road.

No they'll be careful not to make it constant I think

yeah i think i trust this team enough now not to make it shit

When you look at Odenkirk's career between his inspired turn as Stevie Grant in The Larry Sanders Show and his BB turn as Saul it is quite depressing, a lost decade and a half of mediocre writing credits and various atrocious comedy-fail shite. I think this being his stand alone big shot and Gilligan's nerviness at following up such a big hit might be something to do with the rocky start this series has made. I hope it gets better cos I always liked Odenkirk, but so far it all feels a bit stilted and predictable.

nah...

don't think i'd heard of odenkirk before BB though.

i think the broken windshield was a nice level of fan service callback

haha, what's that?

i.e. that walt's windshield was constantly broken and now we've had another two broken windshields already, the breaking bad universe is much like our universe but with way more broken windshields

xposts

Odenkirk did Mr Show between Sanders and Breaking Bad! And he was in Nebraska after BB, which was nominated for a Palme D'Or and a half-dozen Oscars. He will be fine if this tanks.

and fargo

Comedy-fail dross and an appearance in a Payneful, overrated movie might pay the bills but fronting your own series is a different matter and Fargo is also post BB.

Yeah, Odenkirk hasn't had the best luck making movies of his own but he's otherwise had a pretty solid (if generally low-key) career and a vast comedic community that rightfully respects the shit out of him. Plus he brought Tim & Eric into our hearts and homes. He's gonna do just fine.

Mr. Show = 'comedy-fail dross'. Okay.

ok whatever your assessment of his career or talents are - he understands the risks of Better Call Saul, he'll be fine if it doesn't work out, and it's not "his stand alone big shot".

The NYT interview seems totally level-headed:

“I was worried about what it would do to my family and worried about whether I would end up being the guy who” — um, screwed up — “the legacy of ‘Breaking Bad.’ ”

“And then I talked to my daughter, who is 13 and incredibly mature, she said, ‘It’s a big opportunity, we will be fine, and if it’s bad, really, how bad could it be?’ ”

“And I said well, it won’t be bad. It’s written by Vince Gilligan and Peter Gould; the worst thing is it’s a really interesting misfire. If that’s the worst thing it is, I’d be more than happy to be part of that.”

There's a scene in Ep 1 at a security checkpoint where the guard waves the metal detector near a guy's privates and it goes off...the fact that McKean is in the cast made me think this was a homage to Spinal Tap

i loved the cold open so much

― gr8080, Tuesday, 10 February 2015 13:35 (2 hours ago) Permalink

Me too!

AAAAAAAAAAAA

That was some nasty comedy, it's rare I genuinely lol while cowering

The second half was quite okay.

Enjoyed this thoroughly. The vibe is hard to pin down; I can't think of many other things that hit this kind of dour anti-humor/slapstick balance. Reminds me of the book Miss Lonelyhearts more than anything, maybe a little Coen brothers too. The skitching/generic funk scene was a little cringe worthy but I'm excited for the rest.

I'm hoping we get to see more of what he's been up to post-Breaking Bad

Saul is sort of similar to Jesse in that he's basically a good person but poor choices mean that he gets involved in some really quite unpleasant situations

Jesse is a good person?

afaict the only good person in BB was junior

yeah, i hope there's more post-Breaking Bad stuff. Gilligan seems to like telling stories from opposite ends and flashforwards and stuff anyway, so might happen a bit.

Episode 2 is good - starting to gather pace.

lol:

credits shot of Saul staring balefully out across the North Dakota sunrise from his Cinnabon

― what's up ugly girls? (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, September 30, 2013 10:59 AM (1 year ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

whoops didn't c+p the whole thing:

was waiting for post-credits shot of Saul staring balefully out across the North Dakota sunrise from his Cinnabon

― what's up ugly girls? (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, September 30, 2013 10:59 AM (1 year ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is all very enjoyable, though it does feel a bit like The Hobbit to BB's LOTR; everything is broader and sillier, and there's a little too much fan service. It should ideally be a show that someone who's never seen it's predecessor could enjoy perfectly well and I'm not sure it is. I am looking forward to the rest, the ripping off the embezzlers plotline has potential, and the standard of storytelling was obviously very high.

Jimmy's foray into the HHM offices (ep. 1) was hilarious, man. His second interaction with the older fella on the ground floor was classic, sort of 'why are we engaging in hand shake' "Right." "yes."

First part of his Network bit in the meeting room, he kinda channeled both Larry David and Daniel Day Lewis.

loved and hated the all that jazz homage

i really really hope we've seen all the tuco we're going to see

tuco was without a doubt my least favorite character in the BB universe and even if raymond cruz's acting chops were a little better in monday's episode than they were in s1/s2 of BB he still grates on me

hoping the county treasurer character gets fully developed like walt did (without totally mirroring walt)

Didja ever get your shit pushed in?

loving this. It is v much BB part 2 the sequeling, but in some ways I already like it more just because I love Bob Odenkirk so much

i hope the b+w cold open isnt the last we see of nu-saul, even if we have to wait for the s2 premiere or something

xp it's so exactly breaking bad as a comedy! Like how many times did we see an abject, desperate Walt trying to wheedle his way out of being killed? But it has a diff feel cause saul's dialogue & performance are so firmly in the comedy register (which is why so many find him jarring in breaking bad). The Saul-Walt parallels in this show are at absurd levels but it seems to be working at a level of its own. The violence is on the farcical bathtub of gore, zombie necktie level and I hope it stays there. I found the desert scene horrific & hilarious but the date scene was even worse/better, I was wincing & laughing so hard (plus blackmail tributes always get props from me)

tbh I think Saul was key to making BBad's tragicomic tonal balance really work. The series didn't fully click for me till he was introduced.

Oh yeah, so many ≠ me, I love Saul & always have. Always funny and his edginess was a great barometer for how real things were getting. Loved his sadsack exit also, which is why I kinda think any more Omaha stuff would be redundant

the corpse-fucking case seemed a *bit* much but everything that came after made up for it. lol'd at the gratuitous Network and All That Jazz quotes. the rhythms of the episodes, the way they are set up and structured, is so consistent with BB - the montages, the tense confrontations, the quieter, more elliptical exchanges between two characters.

What is it with airports? I had the same in the airport lounge leaving to Iran.

Miss this tv show, wish it would go on forever

yeah I've tried a few other shows since but nothing is on the same level

plus it was really nice to have Bob Odenkirk on TV every week. regardless of what you thought of anything else

There was a link to the Critics Choice Awards (whatever they are) on another thread: https://variety.com/2023/awards/news/critics-choice-awards-2023-winners-list-1235488828/. Weird: Better Call Saul won Best Drama Series, Odenkirk won Best Actor, Giancarlo Esposito won Supporting Actor, and Carol Burnett was nominated (but lost) for Best Supporting Actress.

Rhea Seehorn was not nominated.

While I'm not quite as high on her work in the last couple of seasons as everyone else (as opposed to early on, when I thought she was great), that's egregious.

Maybe this time

This guy looks pretty beat up...BUT, HOORAY! and THANK YOU to everyone who enjoyed Better Call Saul, and for this Nom. We all cared SO MUCH everyday we made this show. It starts with the WRITING and I'm so thankful Peter Gould and Gordon Smith are nominated. RHEA being… https://t.co/aiTsW9qU4T

— Mr. Bob Odenkirk (@mrbobodenkirk) July 12, 2023

No idea how they determine such things, but isn't Rhea Seehorn a lead actress? I've seen the first three seasons of Succession, not the new one, but to me, Seehorn was at least as much of a lead as Sarah Snook.

iirc the actor (or sometimes production) themselves decides in which category to submit

I want an entire series about season 6 Kim.

otm

Started a rewatch last night. I know I doubled back at one point to rewatch the previous season after an extended break, but I don't think I've ever gone back to the beginning. Have forgotten so much, I expect it will feel new.

My friend's kid is currently working on something with Patrick Fabian, and the kid got Patrick to do a birthday greeting for his brother in the character of Howard Hamlin. I saw the clip this weekend and 'twas a hoot.

Most esoteric birthday gift ever!

Everyone was calling for a Kim prequel...I would love to have seen a Kettleman prequel, documenting the years they spent embezzling all that money.

Quite immersed in this rewatch...I'll find out when I get there, but my recollection is that the show was spinning its wheels a bit the last season or two--there were great moments, but I remember feeling impatient a lot. I'm four episodes into S2, and I just love the way the Jimmy and Mike stories circle around each other, sometimes running parallel and sometimes interesecting. The Jimmy/Chuck and Jimmy/Kim relationships are as well drawn as they'll ever be. And Jimmy is still close to a 100% sympathetic figure. (Not that I'm arguing against moral shading...I just like liking him, ditto with Ignacio/Nacho.)

Some of the food deliveries I do around town I pick up from a community centre where the main room has about a dozen tables and there are usually groups of seniors playing cards or quilting. Today I was so tempted to start going around the room and doing some gladhanding Jimmy schtick. The bond between Jimmy and seniors those first couple of seasons is one of the highlights--also the way Howard and Chuck are mystified by it.

(At 63, I'm still legally on the other side of that divide...)

One year older than odenkirk!

I used to be known as Slippin' Clemenza.

yeah Jimmy’s man of the people charm really highlights the gulf btw him and Chuck, and Howard too. (And of course, the class-based prejudice that they also pretend isn’t there)

At one point, Chuck derisively blurts out "He's a Svengali!" (He's talking about Jimmy's effect on Kim there, but he probably means it more generally.)

How 'bout Ed Begly Jr.'s character with that big expensive acoustic guitar? Is he learning some Woody G songs?

Despite quotes emp. differences, this seems late-Kim-like (in new Apple "sci-fi" series):

Gilligan echoed the sentiment about Seehorn, telling us, “She’s such a pleasure to work with, I wrote a show for her. I created this new show for her.”

“I’m excited for audiences to see Rhea play a very different character than the character she played on Better Call Saul,” said Gilligan, adding: “She plays someone who’s trying very hard to be good. She’s a bit of a damaged hero, but she’s a hero nonetheless. And it’s just a pleasure to work with her because she’s just the best, and she is so sweet and kind and talented. I can’t say enough good about her.”

I think that's a description of her character in the new show, but I see where you could interpret that as describing Kim

It is a description of the new character, but seems late-Kim-like, in a new context, which is probably---pretty wild.

S4, E4 felt like an early highwater mark--so much going on. Saul: starts at the cell phone place. Kim: hanging around the courthouse with an eye towards pro bono work (the judge's ruse about The Verdict was perfect to the point of being mean). Mike: calls out the one guy in the support group who's a phony (set up beautifully by the pre-credit opening). Nacho: the shootout with the crew he dishonestly fingers. The next episode flashes back to Saul's Breaking Bad exit, the most pointed overlap thus far, so that further underscored the before-and-afterf eeling.

Had to check back, but happy to see that everybody seemed to agree the Miracle on 34th Street scam to get Huell acquitted defied credulity. (Also answered my question of who Kim was listening to on headphones: Stereolab.)

Had completely forgotten the circumstances of Nacho's death. Very much in character; noble.

Almost finished; just started the first Carol Burnett episode, so maybe two or three more. I'd forgotten that Lalo pays two visits to Jimmy and Kim in two different episodes, so after the first one, I thought I'd misremembered: I was positive that an episode ended with Lalo saying "So let's talk," and that that was one of the greatest episode-ending lines ever. But when Howard showed up there in the later episode, the context all came back to me. I have many quibbles about the final season--with more to come--but the 1-2 of Howard's murder and Lalo's line is truly incredible.

I was picking up a few boxes of books today, donated by an older woman (86) to our Friends of the Library book sale, and I noticed a book in there on Hummel figurines. (She was an antique collector--almost the entirety of the five boxes was books about antiques, price guides, etc.) Thought immediately of Saul's little Hummel scam. The internet says their value is in decline: "Hummel figurines once sold for hundreds of dollars apiece, but the generation that appreciated these little porcelain statues is now downsizing or dying off, dumping Hummels back into the market by the thousands. Younger generations have little interest in buying them."

I'm just about to start the last disk of the last season, the last 3 episodes.

they've done the BB thing of killing off interesting characters too early.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0rBB93sl58

Weird!

Slippin' Jimmy as the antithesis of the con man who I'm guessing inspired the spot, that's what strikes me as weird--but Saul was a stickler for his clients' rights, no question about that.