Serial - the podcast *spoilers*

What do you want to hear from Stephanie? I'm more interested in hearing from Jenn.

I'd ask Stephanie how it felt dating the guy who put Adnan in jail while thinking that Adnan is innocent.

she was super close to both of them - how did she feel about adnan's conviction? did she have any reason to suspect jay had more involvement than he was letting on? what was the aftermath like? is she still in touch with adnan? why were neither of these guys hanging out with her on her birthday?

I don't think Jay's interview really hurt him or helped him, but I did feel bad for him and his family because it does sound like certain reddit people behaved in ways that were definitely pretty creepy and I could see how he and his wife would be unsettled for themselves and particularly their children. I don't think that was at all the intention of the Serial producers, but I do think that certain "Free Adnan" folks seem to be somewhat cavalier it.

cavalier about it.

Revelation that Stephanie both: 1) believed Adnan was innocent and 2) dated Jay for 2-3 more years, was pretty amazing. I'd be interested in understanding that dissonance. In terms of the case itself for Adnan's guilt or innocence, I don't believe either Stephanie or Jenn have much to add.

It doesn't exactly say she believed Adnan was innocent, it just sounds like she didn't believe it at first.

Exact words were that she didn't believe he did it. Still you don't know timeline so that could been before Jay said "no he did it."

Coming today @the_intercept. Another key #Serial figure speaks out for first time.
https://twitter.com/the_intercept/status/552843216471732224

Stephanie? The Streaker?

the prosecutor i think

streaker dude having a beer with other streaker dude, bragging "But you are just a serial streaker. I am the Serial streaker, you see."

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/01/07/prosecutor-serial-case-goes-record/

Unsatisfying on some points, but illuminating on others, especially the point about cell tower tech being different at the time.

Well, there is a major problem with that explanation, which is that the only phonecall that ties Adnan to Leakin park, a phonecall to Yaser, actually pings at Woodlawn. So if cellphonetech is as he says it was, then Adnan never provably called or was called from Leakin park. And Urick really, really keeps going on at that point, that Adnan called or was called from Leakin, and that that is a fact, but it was never proven as such. Adnan just didn't dispute that he thought he had his phone on him.

Right, that was sort of the main problem I had with the interview, the way he sidesteps the whole "what if Adnan wasn't with the phone when it was in Leakin' Park?" question.

Took another look at Jays new story, and another look at the cellphone records, and obviously we all know they would not add up perfectly, but... It's a shambles.For example, there isn't a single call to Jays house, not a one. So how did Adnan get Jay to meet outside his grandmas? It's such weird journalism from the intercept. Going 'Exclusive: Jay tells his story' and then just letting him tell a new story that doesn't square with anything, and at no point going 'well, could not have been midnight, don't you just mean after dark?'

Letting Jay tell a new story which can't be true, and letting Urich repeatedly say something that doesn't hold up either. But then they also presenting it as if they are really proving that Serial didn't do their jobs. But if Serial was bad journalism then TheIntercept is...

For example, there isn't a single call to Jays house, not a one. So how did Adnan get Jay to meet outside his grandmas?

This isn't really that hard to explain though, e.g. he might have known that Jay was likely to be at his grandma's at that time, because he usually was, or because they had discussed it earlier. It was where he was living and where he ran his dealing operation out of.

Also why would there be a call to Jay's (grandmother's) house from the cell phone arranging for Adnan to meet Jay there if Jay was the one who had the cell phone at the time, or am I misunderstanding your point?

Well, it's what Jay says. Jay says Adnan called him at home, and asked him to come outside. But there is no call like that. It was just an example. There are a myriad ways how it doesn't fit with the timeline.

The thing supposedly took place between Cathy's and Leakin Park, which is a 45 min window with a few other calls being made in a completely different place.

Has the 6:24 incoming call been clearly identified? Maybe, just for example, the 6:24 call is Jay calling Adnan's cell from Jay's (grandma's) house when Adnan has the phone -- it's a 4+ min call, maybe they're talking for a bit on the phone, then when Adnan gets close by he says "come outside.'

But the problem with that kind of analysis is that it hinges on someone's memory, 15 years later, of the more minor details of a story that anyone could get wrong, let alone someone stoned.

Which is why I don't put too much stock in the mere fact that there are "inconsistencies" in his testimony.

I thought that there are two outgoing calls, one to Jenn and one to Yaser immediately prior to the two Leakin Park incoming pings. I guess it's "possible" that Jay took the phone and ran off with it to Leakin Park and then gave it back to Adnan before 9pm, but I'd say it's pretty strong evidence that the phone was with both of them.

The 6:24 call pings at Cathy's. Don't think Adnan can get to Jay from Cathy in four minutes. And yeah, there are two outgoing calls right before Leakin Park, as in, only ten minutes before, but problem is they don't ping from Leakin Park, but from the mosque. So they hardly prove that Adnan called anyone from Leakin Park.

Btw, this: http://viewfromll2.com/2014/12/13/serial-why-the-nisha-call-shows-that-hae-was-murdered-at-332-p-m/ Apparanlty, buttdials ocures with some frequency during violent attacks... The writer is a bit disengenous, as he claims he isn't making a statement on WHO had the phone, just that the guy with the phone probably murdered Hae during the Nisha call. Seeing as the phone called Jenn ten minutes before, though, it's a pretty speculative attack on Jay.

Which tower is the mosque? I don't see it on the map
http://serialpodcast.org/maps/cell-tower-map

"So they hardly prove that Adnan called anyone from Leakin Park."

They indicate he had the phone 10 minutes prior and that Jay was likely with the phone as well 10 minutes prior.

Btw, this: http://viewfromll2.com/2014/12/13/serial-why-the-nisha-call-shows-that-hae-was-murdered-at-332-p-m/ Apparanlty, buttdials ocures with some frequency during violent attacks... The writer is a bit disengenous, as he claims he isn't making a statement on WHO had the phone, just that the guy with the phone probably murdered Hae during the Nisha call. Seeing as the phone called Jenn ten minutes before, though, it's a pretty speculative attack on Jay.

― Frederik B, Wednesday, January 7, 2015 5:08 PM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this makes a lot of pretty big leaps

It definitely does. But something weird happened with that call.

The mosque as apparantly L651, same as Adnan, Best Buy and Woodlawn.

The 6:24 call pings at Cathy's. Don't think Adnan can get to Jay from Cathy in four minutes. And yeah, there are two outgoing calls right before Leakin Park, as in, only ten minutes before, but problem is they don't ping from Leakin Park, but from the mosque. So they hardly prove that Adnan called anyone from Leakin Park.

― Frederik B, Wednesday, January 7, 2015 5:05 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

BTW not sure this is right either, the 6:24 call doesn't ping from the tower closest to Cathy's on the map, nor does the 6:09 call, only the 6:07 call does.

But something weird happened with that call.

But even proving that the call was a butt dial wouldn't be proof of anything else, it would just take away the "Nisha call" theory.

Well, true that. But everyone has said there were multiple calls at Cathy's, so it seems more likely that the place is covered by two towers?

x-post, that. And you're of course right on in you're post right above me, man alive.

lord of the pings: the two towers

lol

BTW who were "Phil" and "Patrick" again?

the 3:48 and 3:59 calls

Patrick is a friend of Jays. He claimed it was his weed-dealer. Phil, dunno. Anyone else know?

Starting to go down the rabbit hole now, but is there any way Adnan had the cell at 3:21 and made the "come get me" call to Jay on Jenn's home # at that time?

I guess that would contradict the whole "it was definitely after 3:30" thing though

I've thought about that as well, but then everybodys story is so weird, because why would everyone say Adnan borrowed out his phone? Also, earlier outgoing call at 12:41 is also to Jenn.

wasn't the phil the coworker from the video store?

Well, Jay didn't work there at the time, so that would be weird?

Maybe Phil got him the job at the store. I actually think the guy SK interviewed in ep. 12 though was named Josh.

yeah I think you're right

about it being josh

I don't recall if it was his real name though. Maybe it was a pseudonym for "Phil".

i can't find any info on who phil is.

but josh IS the coworker dude